1 2010-10-16 02:02:59 <necrodearia> Is anyone around to help with some c++ code?
  2 2010-10-16 02:14:58 <yebyen> maybe
  3 2010-10-16 02:15:24 <yebyen> the alternative is to figure out how to use these VB6 examples :\n21461
  4 2010-10-16 02:16:46 <yebyen> oh that's much better thank you
  5 2010-10-16 02:42:31 <necrodearia> vb6?  I don't understand
  6 2010-10-16 02:42:47 <yebyen> my boss asked me to get a book
  7 2010-10-16 02:43:05 <yebyen> i would rather gnaw off my own hands
  8 2010-10-16 02:45:42 <necrodearia> What is optimal method to extract nBits value of current block?
  9 2010-10-16 02:46:47 <necrodearia> Everything I've posted since 7:17pm cst/cdt I haven't made any progress since.
 10 2010-10-16 02:47:11 <Kiba> sabber has returned
 11 2010-10-16 02:57:13 <jgarzik> necrodearia: blk.bitcoinwatch will display it for you: http://blk.bitcoinwatch.com/b?h=72000
 12 2010-10-16 02:57:19 <jgarzik> necrodearia: 'bits'
 13 2010-10-16 02:58:07 <jgarzik> necrodearia: that comes out of the 'getblock' RPC that I added, which displays all values of the specified block, including nBits.
 14 2010-10-16 03:01:33 <necrodearia> ;bcs
 15 2010-10-16 03:01:35 <bitbot> necrodearia: CurrentBlockCount( 85,396 blocks ) CurrentDifficulty( 1,378.0286071800 ) NextDifficultyAt( 86,688 blocks ) NextDifficultyIn( 1,292 blocks )
 16 2010-10-16 03:02:03 <Kiba> ;mtgox
 17 2010-10-16 03:02:05 <bitbot> Kiba: Mt. Gox: Last(0.105) High(0.119) Low(0.092) BestSellPrice(0.094) BestBuyPrice(0.1) Volume(22643)
 18 2010-10-16 03:05:25 <necrodearia> jgarzik, $ bitcoind getblock 8            error: {"code":-1,"message":"value is type str, expected int"}
 19 2010-10-16 03:05:51 <necrodearia> That doesn't seem right.  I am assuming it is just a miscompilation on my part perhaps
 20 2010-10-16 03:06:45 <jgarzik> necrodearia: sounds like you're using a gavin patch, maybe?
 21 2010-10-16 03:07:06 <necrodearia> I'll confirm
 22 2010-10-16 03:07:56 <doublec> the monitorreceived patch takes a string block id for getblock iirc
 23 2010-10-16 03:08:39 <echelon> when monitorreceived fetches a url, does it comply with the socks proxy settings?
 24 2010-10-16 03:08:41 <doublec> or am i thinking of gettransaction
 25 2010-10-16 03:09:21 <doublec> echelon, good question, I don't know
 26 2010-10-16 03:09:49 <echelon> is there a way to just make it run an external script instead of fetching a url?
 27 2010-10-16 03:10:25 <doublec> it wouldn't be hard to change it to d othat
 28 2010-10-16 03:10:37 <necrodearia> jgarzik, I think it was your patch, because I recompiled with gavin's monitor patch and getblock works now
 29 2010-10-16 03:11:53 <necrodearia> I'm also using listgenerated and listtransactions patches which also modify rpc.cpp file.
 30 2010-10-16 03:12:05 <jgarzik> echelon: wouldn't be hard to set up a simple HTTP server that runs an external script :)
 31 2010-10-16 03:12:43 <necrodearia> However, it appears gavin's getblock command doesn't show nbits =/
 32 2010-10-16 03:13:44 <necrodearia> I shall write a patch for a patch ^_^
 33 2010-10-16 03:16:49 <Kiba> if we lucky
 34 2010-10-16 03:16:57 <Kiba> you will see a new web service
 35 2010-10-16 03:17:06 <Kiba> that accept bitcoin
 36 2010-10-16 03:18:48 <doublec> nice
 37 2010-10-16 03:19:14 <jgarzik> yes, gavin's patch supercedes 90% of mine
 38 2010-10-16 03:19:23 <jgarzik> it omits several fields
 39 2010-10-16 03:21:27 <necrodearia> Yeah, I see now.
 40 2010-10-16 03:21:41 <necrodearia> It would be nice for both of your patches to be merged into one.
 41 2010-10-16 06:50:45 <doublec> bitcoin discussion on hacker news: http://apps.ycombinator.com/item?id=1793599
 42 2010-10-16 14:56:00 <jgarzik> LRUSD needs more asks
 43 2010-10-16 15:40:02 <Kiba> Liberty Reserves...hmm
 44 2010-10-16 15:46:15 <theymos> The BCBot alert message has incorrect grammar. The first comma should be a semicolon, the second one should be a period, and the message should end with a period.
 45 2010-10-16 16:07:07 <tcatm> hey
 46 2010-10-16 16:10:38 <Kiba> hey hey
 47 2010-10-16 16:14:06 <tcatm> is there an easy way to get the difficulty for a given timestamp in the past?
 48 2010-10-16 16:15:56 <theymos> Look at a block from that time. The target ("bits") is in the header.
 49 2010-10-16 16:17:50 <tcatm> thanks. haven't thought of it :)
 50 2010-10-16 16:33:09 <AAA_awright> jgarzik: If enough people buy, supply and demand will find more asks, that's usually always how it works out :)
 51 2010-10-16 16:42:35 <kermit> how is mtgox.com trading bitcoins 25% higher than bitcoinmarket.com?
 52 2010-10-16 16:43:41 <tcatm> funds at mtgox.com cannot be withdrawn or added in USD
 53 2010-10-16 16:47:00 <edcba> $0.10 now ?
 54 2010-10-16 16:55:54 <jackmcbarn> my khash/s has dropped to 51 on one of my computers
 55 2010-10-16 17:05:27 <digger3> jackmcbarn: it's probably downloading blocks
 56 2010-10-16 17:05:45 <jackmcbarn> no, its been like that forever
 57 2010-10-16 17:05:56 <jackmcbarn> and its caught up in blocks
 58 2010-10-16 17:06:31 <theymos> Is it using 100% of the CPU?
 59 2010-10-16 17:06:53 <jackmcbarn> about 80%
 60 2010-10-16 17:06:57 <jackmcbarn> but thats still terrible
 61 2010-10-16 17:17:28 <nathan7> :o
 62 2010-10-16 17:31:50 <Kiba> ;mtgox
 63 2010-10-16 17:31:52 <bitbot> Kiba: Mt. Gox: Last(0.1) High(0.1074) Low(0.0925) BestSellPrice(0.1) BestBuyPrice(0.103) Volume(5511)
 64 2010-10-16 17:34:34 <MartinW> Spiking higher and higher.
 65 2010-10-16 17:35:21 <ArtForzZz> Arctic Cooling Accelero Xtreme 5970 cooler is pretty much useless for bitcoin mining
 66 2010-10-16 17:36:10 <Kiba> MartinW: not really
 67 2010-10-16 17:36:14 <ArtForzZz> cores stay pretty cool, but VRM temps are worse than stock cooler @ 80%
 68 2010-10-16 17:36:27 <Kiba> well, srorry, thought you were talking about mtgox price
 69 2010-10-16 17:36:42 <Kiba> Mt. Gox apperantly will be returning to partial normalacy
 70 2010-10-16 17:36:48 <Kiba> on Tuesday
 71 2010-10-16 17:36:55 <MartinW> New payment processor?
 72 2010-10-16 17:39:10 <theymos> ArtForzZz: Does Bitcoin mining stress that part of the graphics card more than other activities?
 73 2010-10-16 17:39:31 <ArtForzZz> yup
 74 2010-10-16 17:39:37 <ArtForzZz> pretty much as bad as furmark
 75 2010-10-16 17:39:45 <Kiba> MartinW: apperantly, one that only allow withdrawl through visa
 76 2010-10-16 17:42:29 <ArtForzZz> on the bench and at stock clocks/voltage VRM temps are ~95???C, overclocked to 5870x2 levels VRMs hit 125???C and card throttles
 77 2010-10-16 17:43:47 <theymos> ArtForzZz: The guy from Tom's Hardware would probably be interested in that. Are the public GPU miners efficient enough to have that effect?
 78 2010-10-16 17:44:01 <edcba> there are public gpu miners ?
 79 2010-10-16 17:44:07 <ArtForzZz> the opencl miner for ati cards should be
 80 2010-10-16 17:44:47 <ArtForzZz> probably not quite as bad as mine, as I think it only gets the card to ~92% load
 81 2010-10-16 17:45:30 <ArtForzZz> with a external fan pointed at the card just right to get more airflow around the VRM cooler I got VRM temps under 100???C while overclocked
 82 2010-10-16 17:46:24 <ArtForzZz> which is about the same as stock cooler at 80% fanspeed under same conditions
 83 2010-10-16 17:48:04 <ArtForzZz> well, okay, stock cooler @ 80% is a lot louder than accelero @ 100% + external fan, and the accelero cools the GPU cores way better
 84 2010-10-16 17:48:35 <jgarzik> or PyCUDA, with puddinpop's cuda miner code
 85 2010-10-16 17:48:47 <jgarzik> people would probably find a PyCUDA setup useful.
 86 2010-10-16 17:49:03 <jgarzik> LRUSD ask still at 0.09?  sigh.
 87 2010-10-16 17:49:54 <ArtForzZz> well, yeah, except for the small problem that nvidia cards positively suck for integer work
 88 2010-10-16 17:50:25 <jgarzik> really?  interesting.
 89 2010-10-16 17:50:26 <ArtForzZz> = a GTX295 gets outhashed by a HD5750
 90 2010-10-16 17:50:52 <theymos> ArtForzZz: How does Bitcoin compare to GPU benchmarks for stressing the cores?
 91 2010-10-16 17:52:11 <ArtForzZz> well, I think the public opencl miner is about as bad as pyrit-opencl or dnet
 92 2010-10-16 17:54:33 <MartinW> There really isn't much incentive to release a more efficient miner.
 93 2010-10-16 17:54:35 <ArtForzZz> another comparison: GTX480 is about 15% faster than GTX295, 5870 is about 3x as fast as GTX480, 5970 ~ 5x GTX480
 94 2010-10-16 17:55:02 <MartinW> Maybe someone should start a bounty, with everyone with poor graphics cards contributing?
 95 2010-10-16 17:55:10 <ArtForzZz> 5970 OCed to 5870 levels about 6x GTX480
 96 2010-10-16 17:55:50 <ArtForzZz> 5770 (a $130 card...) about 1.5x GTX480
 97 2010-10-16 17:56:53 <ArtForzZz> those are peak figures, but from what I've seen CUDA as well as OpenCL miner get within 5% of that
 98 2010-10-16 17:59:48 <ArtForzZz> currently I'm running 5x 5770, 2x 5870 and 2x 5970, total ~3050Mhash/s using ~2kW
 99 2010-10-16 18:02:27 <ArtForzZz> if 6870 turns out to have good perf/$ and perf/W I'll probably add 4 of those, otherwise it's another pair of 5970s
100 2010-10-16 18:07:14 <theymos> ArtForzZz: At what point do you think that generating will be unprofitable even for people using top-of-the-line consumer hardware?
101 2010-10-16 18:07:35 <ArtForzZz> depends on the price of bitcoins
102 2010-10-16 18:08:12 <tcatm> around difficulty 80,000 if price stays the same
103 2010-10-16 18:08:27 <ArtForzZz> soudns about right
104 2010-10-16 18:08:57 <ArtForzZz> also depends a lot on power prices
105 2010-10-16 18:10:00 <tcatm> am i seeing it right that we have a total hashrate of 16Ghash/s now?
106 2010-10-16 18:10:06 <ArtForzZz> yep
107 2010-10-16 18:10:46 <ArtForzZz> CUDA miners will become unprofitable a lot earlier
108 2010-10-16 18:11:28 <tcatm> even opencl miners are a bit risky now
109 2010-10-16 18:11:34 <ArtForzZz> GTX460 is ~0.46Mh/Ws, HD5770 is ~1.45Mh/Ws
110 2010-10-16 18:12:35 <ArtForzZz> yep
111 2010-10-16 18:12:52 <tcatm> it'll take 1..2 month to get the investment back
112 2010-10-16 18:14:47 <ArtForzZz> probably even longer if difficulty keeps increasing like this
113 2010-10-16 18:16:48 <tcatm> i wonder what will be used when opencl miners aren't profitable anymore
114 2010-10-16 18:17:21 <ArtForzZz> I seriously doubt that'll happen
115 2010-10-16 18:18:32 <tcatm> that would mean bitcoin will die within a few years
116 2010-10-16 18:18:44 <ArtForzZz> why?
117 2010-10-16 18:19:10 <tcatm> or at least that it will stop growing at some point
118 2010-10-16 18:20:03 <ArtForzZz> yep, I'm guessing hashrate will level off at < 50Gh
119 2010-10-16 18:21:47 <tcatm> why < 50 Gh?
120 2010-10-16 18:22:39 <ArtForzZz> around that point CUDA mining should become uneconomical at $0.10/kWh
121 2010-10-16 18:23:17 <theymos> Maybe some stupid government will give free/cheap electricity to everyone and all miners can just move there.
122 2010-10-16 18:23:56 <Kiba> I heard government are in an inflation war
123 2010-10-16 18:24:16 <Kiba> trying to inflate their currency so they get export and stuff
124 2010-10-16 18:25:00 <ArtForzZz> well, there's quite a few ways to have "free" (more like waste) power for mining
125 2010-10-16 18:26:11 <jgarzik> free power, from as much yard waste as I'm willing to shovel
126 2010-10-16 18:26:17 <tcatm> ArtForzZz: legal ways?
127 2010-10-16 18:26:25 <ArtForzZz> yep
128 2010-10-16 18:26:43 <tcatm> interesting. can you explain them?
129 2010-10-16 18:27:14 <Kiba> bitcoin miner powered by byproduct of heat producing items?
130 2010-10-16 18:27:16 <Kiba> like
131 2010-10-16 18:27:27 <Kiba> a stirling engine that use your computer as a heat source
132 2010-10-16 18:27:29 <jgarzik> which in turn produces heat :)
133 2010-10-16 18:27:48 <jgarzik> stirling engine works great in cold climates, I would think
134 2010-10-16 18:28:08 <ArtForzZz> well, for example as a replacement for electrical heaters as a load for a combined power+heat genset
135 2010-10-16 18:28:28 <Kiba> build a water heater unit out of soda cans
136 2010-10-16 18:28:56 <theymos> If you wanted to use a CPU as an electric heater, what type of CPU would be the most efficient?
137 2010-10-16 18:29:04 <tcatm> pentium 4?
138 2010-10-16 18:29:07 <ArtForzZz> erm, any kind?
139 2010-10-16 18:29:42 <theymos> Some kinds have higher heat production per watt, I would think.
140 2010-10-16 18:29:48 <ArtForzZz> in-room electrical heaters are pretty damn close to 100% efficient :P
141 2010-10-16 18:30:36 <tcatm> if electricity was cheaper that might work
142 2010-10-16 18:31:05 <jgarzik> man.  -all- my free h/w is NV.
143 2010-10-16 18:31:11 <jgarzik> even the AMD platforms.
144 2010-10-16 18:31:26 <ArtForzZz> well, thats the thing, you *need* a electric load to get any decent thermal output from a combined heat+power generator
145 2010-10-16 18:31:42 <Kiba> what is the point of running bitcoin miners after the bitcoin generation has pretty much cease?
146 2010-10-16 18:31:44 <tcatm> jgarzik: NV is not that bad at current difficulty
147 2010-10-16 18:32:02 <theymos> Kiba: Transaction fees.
148 2010-10-16 18:32:36 <theymos> Best generator: seastead powered by OTEC technology using CPUs for heat.
149 2010-10-16 18:33:37 <jgarzik> probably easier to power seasteads with wave action
150 2010-10-16 18:38:22 <tcatm> ArtForzZz: do you know how to repair CRTs?
151 2010-10-16 18:39:36 <Kiba> back in my day, CRT are HEAVY and difficult to steal
152 2010-10-16 18:39:57 <Kiba> now those fricking screens are light! Now, I have to protect my monitor ultra security5000000000
153 2010-10-16 18:40:14 <Kiba> with ultra security500000000
154 2010-10-16 18:40:16 <Kiba> I mean
155 2010-10-16 18:40:26 <Kiba> the downfall of technological advancement
156 2010-10-16 18:40:58 <tcatm> mount in to the wall with uncommon screws ;)
157 2010-10-16 18:41:05 <tcatm> it*
158 2010-10-16 18:42:07 <Kiba> Naw.
159 2010-10-16 18:42:19 <Kiba> LCD will be so cheap in the future that nobody needs to steal one...
160 2010-10-16 18:43:02 <tcatm> if color production is unimportant, maybe
161 2010-10-16 18:43:07 <tcatm> repro..*
162 2010-10-16 18:43:13 <ArtForzZz> yup
163 2010-10-16 18:43:16 <Kiba> pretty soon
164 2010-10-16 18:43:24 <Kiba> 3D monitors will be commonplace
165 2010-10-16 18:43:31 <Kiba> We already got 3D television
166 2010-10-16 18:43:58 <ArtForzZz> not to mention a 10 year old 22" CRT has no problem displaying 2560x1920 ...
167 2010-10-16 18:44:39 <Kiba> hmm
168 2010-10-16 18:44:43 <Kiba> 3D porn
169 2010-10-16 18:45:02 <tcatm> you don't need a 3D monitor for that ;)
170 2010-10-16 18:45:17 <Kiba> why?
171 2010-10-16 18:45:30 <tcatm> womans are already 3D
172 2010-10-16 18:46:19 <edcba> some ppl don't get them
173 2010-10-16 18:46:36 <Kiba> too lazy and unconfident
174 2010-10-16 18:46:44 <Kiba> like me
175 2010-10-16 18:47:21 <tcatm> ArtForzZz: was that "yup" a reply to my question?
176 2010-10-16 18:47:47 <ArtForzZz> nope
177 2010-10-16 18:48:20 <ArtForzZz> I can repair CRTs, usually
178 2010-10-16 18:49:12 <ArtForzZz> though getting nonstandard parts is quite a problem nowadays
179 2010-10-16 18:49:38 <Kiba> disappearing knowledge of humanity
180 2010-10-16 18:50:15 <tcatm> i have one with broken vertical deflection partly (i.e. only bottom half is displayed, upper part squeezed to single line). any idea what the cause might be?
181 2010-10-16 18:50:20 <Kiba> it's interesting...
182 2010-10-16 18:50:34 <ArtForzZz> wow, that sounds weird
183 2010-10-16 18:51:27 <tcatm> bottom half is completely undistorted
184 2010-10-16 18:51:32 <ArtForzZz> you sure the upper part is squeezed to a single line?
185 2010-10-16 18:51:36 <tcatm> yes
186 2010-10-16 18:52:54 <tcatm> there are some lines in (looks like logarithmic) distance above that single line in the center (maybe 20mm above).
187 2010-10-16 18:53:06 <ArtForzZz> because usually "only lower part is displayed but looks fine" is vblank staying active way too long
188 2010-10-16 18:53:33 <jgarzik> amusing.  User "17ujzChRb6VPQGyANVyktc1du2Hrjfwhsz" is logged into the forums.
189 2010-10-16 18:53:46 <tcatm> the line is pretty bright
190 2010-10-16 18:54:22 <ArtForzZz> yep, that means it's really deflection and not blanking
191 2010-10-16 18:55:01 <tcatm> are there seperate power supplies?
192 2010-10-16 18:55:29 <ArtForzZz> for what?
193 2010-10-16 18:55:45 <tcatm> vertical deflection. maybe +V and -V and +V is missing?
194 2010-10-16 18:56:01 <ArtForzZz> hrrrrm
195 2010-10-16 18:57:00 <ArtForzZz> depends on model
196 2010-10-16 18:57:23 <ArtForzZz> but usually it's just a single votage and a single power transistor for vdeflection
197 2010-10-16 18:58:31 <ArtForzZz> coil provides flyback action, resulting waveform is pretty much sawtooth @ vsync freq
198 2010-10-16 18:59:20 <tcatm> what voltages are used for deflection?
199 2010-10-16 18:59:30 <tcatm> (vs. earth)
200 2010-10-16 18:59:49 <ArtForzZz> 50-100V or so
201 2010-10-16 19:00:25 <ArtForzZz> for the flyback pulse
202 2010-10-16 19:01:10 <ArtForzZz> ramp voltage in the downward scan is usually quite a bit lower