1 2011-07-07 00:01:17 <kreal-> so whats new?
  2 2011-07-07 00:03:47 <nefario> Any python devs on here?
  3 2011-07-07 00:05:50 <phantomcircuit> nefario, yes
  4 2011-07-07 00:06:02 <nefario> hey phantom
  5 2011-07-07 00:06:14 <phantomcircuit> hello
  6 2011-07-07 00:06:26 <nefario> would you be able to help out on a glbse client problem
  7 2011-07-07 00:06:34 <phantomcircuit> sure
  8 2011-07-07 00:06:42 <nefario> command line client is getting a timeout error as a result of ssl
  9 2011-07-07 00:07:04 <nefario> Server error: SSL connection timeout at 297454.
 10 2011-07-07 00:07:11 <nefario> using pycurl
 11 2011-07-07 00:07:16 <phantomcircuit> link?
 12 2011-07-07 00:07:28 <nefario> It was working for a while but now it's just timing out
 13 2011-07-07 00:07:48 <nefario> no link
 14 2011-07-07 00:08:00 <nefario> wait
 15 2011-07-07 00:08:56 <nefario> code in question for the client
 16 2011-07-07 00:08:57 <nefario> https://gitorious.org/black-market/black-market-client/blobs/master/bmc.py
 17 2011-07-07 00:09:01 <nefario> server is nginx
 18 2011-07-07 00:09:13 <nefario> ssl certs included with client
 19 2011-07-07 00:10:44 <Herodes> I know there is a bitcoin testnet, is there a namecoin testnet as well? When getting my feet wet for the first time trying to do some automatic transactions, I'd like to use testcoins, and not real coins. Should I opt for the bitcoin testnet, or is there a namecoin testnet as well?
 20 2011-07-07 00:10:54 <b4epoche_> is anyone here using mtgox websocket?  I can't seem to connect but it looks like other sites are.
 21 2011-07-07 00:11:40 <Herodes> b4epoche: I haven't used it ever, but I think you must use credidentials? Have you checked these are correct?
 22 2011-07-07 00:13:22 <b4epoche_> hmm...  that may be...
 23 2011-07-07 00:13:42 <b4epoche_> the getKey.php is down...  maybe the sites I'm seeing already had creds
 24 2011-07-07 00:16:03 <Herodes> yeah, i don't know, it was just somethign i tought of.
 25 2011-07-07 00:20:12 <nefario> phantomcircuit, it seems to be a bug with with the platform im on (Ubuntu 11.04) specifically how gnu-tls and libcurl are interacting
 26 2011-07-07 00:21:07 <phantomcircuit> hmm
 27 2011-07-07 00:23:59 <nefario> seeing if package updates will fix
 28 2011-07-07 00:29:40 <nefario> phantomcircuit: confirmed, it is an issue to this specific version of ubuntu
 29 2011-07-07 00:29:53 <nefario> works fine from another debian machine
 30 2011-07-07 00:30:03 <nefario> thanks for your time
 31 2011-07-07 00:30:57 <phantomcircuit> uh ok then
 32 2011-07-07 00:30:58 <phantomcircuit> xS
 33 2011-07-07 00:52:24 <accel> when all bitcoins are mined
 34 2011-07-07 00:52:27 <accel> how many bitcoins will there be?
 35 2011-07-07 00:53:00 <jgarzik> accel: approximately 21 million
 36 2011-07-07 00:53:24 <accel> so at $20.00 / BTC
 37 2011-07-07 00:53:28 <accel> it would be worth $400M
 38 2011-07-07 01:01:48 <lfm> ;;calc [bc,blocks]*50 +50
 39 2011-07-07 01:01:49 <gribble> (135,108 * 50) + 50 = 6,755,450
 40 2011-07-07 01:02:05 <lfm> current total bitcoins 6,755,450
 41 2011-07-07 01:03:18 <gmaxwell> minus the lost ones...
 42 2011-07-07 01:04:14 <lfm> ;;calc ([bc,blocks]*50 +50) *20
 43 2011-07-07 01:04:15 <gribble> ((135,108 * 50) + 50) * 20 = 135,109,000
 44 2011-07-07 01:04:46 <lfm> ;;bc,mtgox
 45 2011-07-07 01:04:47 <gribble> {"ticker":{"high":16.5,"low":13.55,"avg":14.917334187,"vol":92778,"last":14.75015,"buy":14.75038,"sell":14.79}}
 46 2011-07-07 01:04:59 <lfm> ;;calc ([bc,blocks]*50 +50) * 14.75015
 47 2011-07-07 01:05:00 <gribble> ((135,108 * 50) + 50) * 14.75015 = 99,643,900.8
 48 2011-07-07 01:05:13 <CIA-103> bitcoin: Chris Howie * r0298673de9e4 mining-proxy/htdocs/common.inc.php: Change human_time() to support durations in the future, and to allow omission of the "ago"/"from now" suffix http://tinyurl.com/64jnx6n http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/w/mining-proxy.git/commitdiff/0298673de9e40e1484baa0d20f33b11e5f9149d1
 49 2011-07-07 01:05:15 <nanotube> ;;calc ([bc,blocks]*50 +50) * [ticker --last]
 50 2011-07-07 01:05:17 <gribble> ((135,108 * 50) + 50) * 14.75015 = 99,643,900.8
 51 2011-07-07 01:05:19 <nanotube> lfm: ^ :)
 52 2011-07-07 01:05:27 <lfm> cute
 53 2011-07-07 01:05:28 <nanotube> or even better...
 54 2011-07-07 01:05:46 <nanotube> ;;calc ([bc,blocks] * 50 + 50) * [ticker --last]
 55 2011-07-07 01:05:48 <gribble> ((135,108 * 50) + 50) * 14.75015 = 99,643,900.8
 56 2011-07-07 01:05:49 <nanotube> :)
 57 2011-07-07 01:06:34 <lfm> isnt that the same?
 58 2011-07-07 01:07:31 <nanotube> yes it is. but without the manual copying of magic values :)
 59 2011-07-07 01:07:53 <nanotube> so you could keep running the same command every day and get updated mkt cap, e.g.
 60 2011-07-07 01:08:00 <gmaxwell> he mean
 61 2011-07-07 01:08:03 <gmaxwell> 20:05 <@nanotube> ;;calc ([bc,blocks]*50 +50) * [ticker --last]
 62 2011-07-07 01:08:10 <gmaxwell> er meant
 63 2011-07-07 01:08:11 <nanotube> oh haha
 64 2011-07-07 01:08:14 <nanotube> yes
 65 2011-07-07 01:08:31 <nanotube> thought bc,blocks output was copied heh
 66 2011-07-07 01:08:33 <nanotube> nvm
 67 2011-07-07 01:09:05 <lfm> nano ? how can i see full help from bc,help
 68 2011-07-07 01:09:16 <lfm> ;;bc,help
 69 2011-07-07 01:09:17 <gribble> Alias bc,24hprc, Alias bc,avgprc, Alias bc,bcm, Alias bc,blocks, Alias bc,btceur, Alias bc,btcgbp, Alias bc,btcguild, Alias bc,btcrub, Alias bc,btcto, Alias bc,calc, Alias bc,calcd, Alias bc,channels, Alias bc,convert, Alias bc,deepbit, Alias bc,diff, Alias bc,diffchange, Alias bc,eligius, Alias bc,estimate, Alias bc,fx, Alias bc,gen, Alias bc,gend, Alias bc,help, Alias bc,hextarget, Alias (1 more message)
 70 2011-07-07 01:11:57 <lfm> nanotube: ^^
 71 2011-07-07 01:12:41 <nanotube> lfm: now run 'more'
 72 2011-07-07 01:12:55 <justmoon> I want to politely point out that with a currency it's called money supply, not market cap (because a currency is not a legal person owning capital, so there can't be a market capitalization, i.e. a market valuation of the capital) - please don't hate me now... :)
 73 2011-07-07 01:12:59 <nanotube> can always run more when you see (X more messages)
 74 2011-07-07 01:13:09 <lfm> ;;more
 75 2011-07-07 01:13:10 <gribble> bc,interval, Alias bc,mtgox, Alias bc,mtgoxask, Alias bc,mtgoxbid, Alias bc,mtgoxlast, Alias bc,nethash, Alias bc,nexttarget, Alias bc,price, Alias bc,prob, Alias bc,probd, Alias bc,slushpool, Alias bc,spotestimate, Alias bc,stats, Alias bc,swepool, Alias bc,timetonext, Alias bc,totalbc, Alias bc,wiki, and Alias bc,xau
 76 2011-07-07 01:13:16 <lfm> ah! ok ty
 77 2011-07-07 01:13:24 <nanotube> justmoon: money supply is measured in bitcoins :)
 78 2011-07-07 01:13:36 <justmoon> no money supply can be measured in anything
 79 2011-07-07 01:13:49 <justmoon> for example the total money supply is x amount of dollars
 80 2011-07-07 01:13:56 <justmoon> is something an economist would say
 81 2011-07-07 01:14:00 <AlonzoTG> om
 82 2011-07-07 01:14:08 <nanotube> justmoon: yes, but would he say "the total money supply of dollars is X euros?
 83 2011-07-07 01:14:11 <nanotube> "
 84 2011-07-07 01:14:23 <nanotube> which is what you'd be saying if you say "the total money supply of bitcoins is 99million usd"
 85 2011-07-07 01:14:24 <justmoon> yes he would, if he's a european economist
 86 2011-07-07 01:14:36 <justmoon> yes, that's how you would correctly say it
 87 2011-07-07 01:15:14 <lfm> useless number anyway. can do more than that with circulation
 88 2011-07-07 01:15:35 <justmoon> lfm, also we don't know how much of it is lost
 89 2011-07-07 01:15:48 <lfm> and hoarded etc
 90 2011-07-07 01:15:55 <justmoon> exactly
 91 2011-07-07 01:17:18 <justmoon> it also doesn't include demand deposits (which would be zero if there aren't any bitcoin banks yet)
 92 2011-07-07 01:17:30 <justmoon> so it's M0 only - the monetary base
 93 2011-07-07 01:17:42 <lfm> mybitcoin.com and mtgox both are banks kinda
 94 2011-07-07 01:18:33 <lfm> even if theyre not doing fractional reserve stuff yet
 95 2011-07-07 01:18:45 <justmoon> lfm, yep, that's what matters in terms of money supply
 96 2011-07-07 01:19:34 <justmoon> AlonzoTG, btw in what language are you writing your client?
 97 2011-07-07 01:19:38 <AlonzoTG> I'm working on a message driver.
 98 2011-07-07 01:19:46 <AlonzoTG> Currently I'm working in C++ because I couldn't get ada working.
 99 2011-07-07 01:19:46 <lfm> ?? they use little cars for packets?
100 2011-07-07 01:19:58 <justmoon> ok cool
101 2011-07-07 01:20:09 <AlonzoTG> He did do a few smart things but the rest is kinda icky.
102 2011-07-07 01:20:23 <AlonzoTG> -- using host byte order for a protocol...
103 2011-07-07 01:20:35 <grbgout> nanotube: why isn't gribble in -market anymore?  I was gone for the weekend.
104 2011-07-07 01:20:50 <AlonzoTG> variable length integers; I have a fairly beautiful variable length integer driver already.
105 2011-07-07 01:21:14 <lfm> AlonzoTG: why not use gmp?
106 2011-07-07 01:21:17 <nanotube> grbgout: farmed out the market feed to a separate bot.
107 2011-07-07 01:21:27 <grbgout> nanotube: saw in -otc, thanks :)
108 2011-07-07 01:21:36 <nanotube> k :)
109 2011-07-07 01:21:40 <AlonzoTG> I'll look into that.
110 2011-07-07 01:21:45 <AlonzoTG> there are several approaches.
111 2011-07-07 01:21:58 <lfm> true
112 2011-07-07 01:21:59 <AlonzoTG> It's just more code that has to be written and audited.
113 2011-07-07 01:22:25 <nanotube> justmoon: well, since the same meaning is conveyed... i won't quibble either way :)
114 2011-07-07 01:22:26 <lfm> gmp is a standard lib that should not need audit Id think
115 2011-07-07 01:22:43 <AlonzoTG> I mean the lines of code I'll have to write to use it,
116 2011-07-07 01:22:55 <AlonzoTG> Also, I try to justify every package I depend on.
117 2011-07-07 01:23:15 <justmoon> nanotube, well, just avoid it when economists are present - they *will* cringe a little inside - as I do whenever I read gavin use the term in the newspaper :)
118 2011-07-07 01:23:29 <AlonzoTG> Granted that gmp is a common package that is quite robust and powerful in a number of ways.
119 2011-07-07 01:23:52 <lfm> AlonzoTG: I understand, gmp is fairly widespread but ya, there are several alternatives too
120 2011-07-07 01:24:00 <nanotube> justmoon: :D
121 2011-07-07 01:29:54 <AlonzoTG> my code is designed so that you can unit-test the snot out of it.
122 2011-07-07 01:29:55 <AlonzoTG> =P
123 2011-07-07 01:30:11 <AlonzoTG> and it will be multi-threaded,
124 2011-07-07 01:30:15 <AlonzoTG> and IPv6 enabled.
125 2011-07-07 01:30:19 <AlonzoTG> =P
126 2011-07-07 01:34:01 <AlonzoTG> anyone wanna try out my varint driver? =P
127 2011-07-07 01:34:24 <lianj> varint driver?
128 2011-07-07 01:34:54 <AlonzoTG> I wrote a driver for the variable integer fields in the bitcoin protocol as part of my effort to re-implement the entire damn daemon.
129 2011-07-07 01:35:26 <lianj> just curious about naming it a driver, where does that come from?
130 2011-07-07 01:35:43 <AlonzoTG> Good question.
131 2011-07-07 01:35:58 <lianj> its two simple functions :P
132 2011-07-07 01:36:03 <AlonzoTG> I've found that programming becomes a hell of a lot easier, especially in object oriented languages, when you think in terms of drivers.
133 2011-07-07 01:36:23 <AlonzoTG> say you had a jpeg file, you write a driver for it,
134 2011-07-07 01:36:47 <AlonzoTG> say you had a little thingie attached to your network and you want to talk to it -- you write a driver for it then you write another driver for the protocol that it speaks, etc...
135 2011-07-07 01:37:41 <AlonzoTG> At my previous job (man, I need a job!), there was this little PLC attached via a 9600 baud serial bus to a little network thumb thingy.
136 2011-07-07 01:37:49 <AlonzoTG> OK.
137 2011-07-07 01:38:08 <AlonzoTG> The previous implementation (java) treated everything procedurally,
138 2011-07-07 01:38:13 <AlonzoTG> I broke it down into drivers.
139 2011-07-07 01:38:31 <AlonzoTG> the first driver ended up with calls to establish the connection and carry out transactions -- that was it.
140 2011-07-07 01:38:44 <AlonzoTG> The next driver implemented part of the fairly extensive command protocol it had.
141 2011-07-07 01:39:13 <AlonzoTG> The driver above that managed sequences of commands,
142 2011-07-07 01:39:38 <AlonzoTG> So finally, all I had to do was write code like "set this register to blah" and that was it, all the complexity was neatly organized.
143 2011-07-07 01:40:10 <AlonzoTG> Actually, I had code above that which said "get all the registers for this production line"
144 2011-07-07 01:40:10 <lianj> ok here is my driver, http://paste.pocoo.org/show/amG1yHKR442s1pmeARPm/  some would call it just a function though ;)
145 2011-07-07 01:40:39 <AlonzoTG> ok,
146 2011-07-07 01:40:53 <AlonzoTG> I haven't tried to compile my version yet, but I think it is reasonably close to compileable.
147 2011-07-07 01:41:20 <AlonzoTG> http://paste.pocoo.org/show/431813/
148 2011-07-07 01:41:53 <doublec> python wins
149 2011-07-07 01:42:13 <doublec> thanks to the magic of 'unpack'
150 2011-07-07 01:43:08 <lianj> doublec: thank god its ruby, but yea :) unpack ftw
151 2011-07-07 01:43:24 <doublec> lianj: haha, my knowledge of python/ruby is limited so I guessed :)
152 2011-07-07 01:43:50 <AlonzoTG> unpack?!?!?!
153 2011-07-07 01:43:52 <AlonzoTG> =\n1204637
154 2011-07-07 01:44:32 <lianj> doublec: iirc python has always to pass a refernce of self when defining methods. like def read_var_int(self, payload) thats the usualy hint for python
155 2011-07-07 01:44:42 <AlonzoTG> Furthermore, my design goal for this implementation is 20,000 transactions a second for 20 years no time off.
156 2011-07-07 01:44:44 <doublec> lianj: ah, good point
157 2011-07-07 01:44:58 <rethaw> AlonzoTG: I learned C++ first and did everything with either bash perl or C++
158 2011-07-07 01:45:09 <rethaw> now i've come to the python party a little late, but it is simply amazing
159 2011-07-07 01:45:26 <rethaw> I wouldn't write it off if I were you
160 2011-07-07 01:45:35 <doublec> My day job is c++ - I do as much as I can to avoid using it apart from that
161 2011-07-07 01:46:02 <rethaw> hah
162 2011-07-07 01:56:16 <Cryo> interesting article: http://ed25519.cr.yp.to/index.html
163 2011-07-07 01:58:24 <phantomcircuit> odds of that being secure?
164 2011-07-07 01:58:26 <phantomcircuit> 0.00001
165 2011-07-07 02:02:58 <phantomcircuit> brocktice, uh hi who are you?
166 2011-07-07 02:10:13 <brocktice> phantomcircuit: hi?
167 2011-07-07 02:10:23 <brocktice> what's up?
168 2011-07-07 02:10:28 <phantomcircuit> why u try join the secretz chanz
169 2011-07-07 02:10:46 <brocktice> I heard about it from someone?
170 2011-07-07 02:11:09 <phantomcircuit> k who are you again?
171 2011-07-07 02:11:56 <doublec> there's a secret channel?
172 2011-07-07 02:12:09 <num1> ssshhh, what channel? :P
173 2011-07-07 02:14:19 <num1> I've been "temporarily banned" from #bitcoin for "autojoining", does anybody know how long these bans usually last?
174 2011-07-07 02:14:30 <cuddlefish> num1: Go bug nameless|
175 2011-07-07 02:14:45 <cuddlefish> i believe 5-15 mintues
176 2011-07-07 02:14:54 <num1> huh, it's been a few days now :(
177 2011-07-07 02:15:05 <cuddlefish> Yeah, bitch at nameless|
178 2011-07-07 02:15:09 <num1> thanks, sure will
179 2011-07-07 02:20:29 <cuddlefish> Oh my GOD I love freshen.
180 2011-07-07 02:20:31 <cuddlefish> http://pastebin.com/xHqT02du
181 2011-07-07 02:20:39 <cuddlefish> that's a test for Ubitex.
182 2011-07-07 02:20:44 <cuddlefish> Not a description of the test
183 2011-07-07 02:20:48 <cuddlefish> the actual test
184 2011-07-07 02:21:21 <justmoon> that looks like cucumber
185 2011-07-07 02:21:28 <cuddlefish> yeah, it's a clone of it :P
186 2011-07-07 02:21:33 <cuddlefish> for python
187 2011-07-07 02:21:37 <justmoon> awesome!
188 2011-07-07 02:24:57 <num1> that's magical
189 2011-07-07 02:25:09 <CIA-103> bitcoin: Daniel Folkinshteyn * r841616367a6f supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor/GPG/plugin.py: GPG: pull ident by nick checker into a nice method. http://tinyurl.com/6yrwl7j http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/w/supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor.git/commitdiff/841616367a6f726b3a4ba84068ac80e5dc841aaf
190 2011-07-07 02:25:14 <CIA-103> bitcoin: Daniel Folkinshteyn * r073a6c334597 supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor/RatingSystem/ (plugin.py test.py): RatingSystem: output target user authentication status with getrating. http://tinyurl.com/622228r http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/w/supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor.git/commitdiff/073a6c334597ebb6abee2b04f31baf1c51834716
191 2011-07-07 02:25:21 <num1> so much better than separate tests and docs
192 2011-07-07 02:26:03 <cuddlefish> num1: yeah
193 2011-07-07 02:26:28 <justmoon> cuddlefish, from the Ubitex website: "And since you pay in cash, face-to-face, fraud is nearly eliminated." - clearly, you've never been mugged
194 2011-07-07 02:26:54 <noagendamarket> heh
195 2011-07-07 02:27:24 <noagendamarket> :)
196 2011-07-07 02:27:29 <cuddlefish> yeah
197 2011-07-07 02:27:31 <lfm> mugging isnt fraud
198 2011-07-07 02:27:31 <noagendamarket> it would be fraud if they had counterfeit cash ...
199 2011-07-07 02:28:23 <justmoon> this conversation is getting to complicated for me
200 2011-07-07 02:28:52 <justmoon> *splat*
201 2011-07-07 02:31:28 <doublec> Ubitex should use geolocation - that'd make things like "Sellers Near Me" easier
202 2011-07-07 02:32:38 <noagendamarket> geocaching ftw
203 2011-07-07 02:33:08 <cuddlefish> doublec: You know why I'm writing all these tests?
204 2011-07-07 02:33:22 <cuddlefish> gigantic improvement in the works.
205 2011-07-07 02:33:31 <doublec> cuddlefish: I assumed it was to procrastinate from doing real work...
206 2011-07-07 02:34:35 <justmoon> programmers don't procrastinate - they "compile"
207 2011-07-07 02:34:37 <doublec> by what magic does that test in the paste become real code?
208 2011-07-07 02:35:05 <doublec> that's pretty nifty
209 2011-07-07 02:35:19 <doublec> so true justmoon
210 2011-07-07 02:35:33 <justmoon> doublec, good intro here: http://cukes.info/
211 2011-07-07 02:35:46 <doublec> thanks
212 2011-07-07 02:35:58 <justmoon> disclaimer: I've never used it, but if cuddle says it's good I would tend to believe him
213 2011-07-07 02:36:37 <noagendamarket> 1. I want to meet a girl 2. install flowers and chocolate 3. proceed to movie
214 2011-07-07 02:36:56 <noagendamarket> test driven dating :)
215 2011-07-07 02:37:45 <doublec> hehe
216 2011-07-07 02:37:48 <justmoon> noagendamarket, note that in case of a violation you can't reinstall, you have to delete the whole thing, so make sure you sanitize your inputs
217 2011-07-07 02:37:59 <noagendamarket> HAHA
218 2011-07-07 02:38:11 <lianj> noagendamarket: and you must start with a failing date
219 2011-07-07 02:38:38 <noagendamarket> dont put the dot in the wrong place
220 2011-07-07 02:38:49 <lfm> ;;calc [bc,totalbc]*[bc,mtgoxlast]
221 2011-07-07 02:38:49 <noagendamarket> and you wont fail
222 2011-07-07 02:38:51 <gribble> 6,755,750.00000000 * 14.72229 = 99,460,110.7
223 2011-07-07 02:39:15 <lfm> nanotube shorter yet
224 2011-07-07 02:39:18 <lfm> ^^
225 2011-07-07 02:39:24 <lfm> ;;calc [bc,totalbc]*[bc,mtgoxlast]
226 2011-07-07 02:39:29 <gribble> 6,755,750.00000000 * 14.75 = 99,647,312.5
227 2011-07-07 02:42:04 <nanotube> lfm: hehe indeed :)
228 2011-07-07 02:42:35 <lianj> cuddlefish: i often find cucumber a bit too much, but just rspec or even a suite of unittests is a good start for every project
229 2011-07-07 02:43:06 <cuddlefish> lianj: I'm publishing the featureset
230 2011-07-07 02:43:16 <cuddlefish> lianj: for user confidence reasons
231 2011-07-07 02:44:38 <lianj> sure, its maybe just me having hard times coming up with those good sentences cucumber wants :)
232 2011-07-07 02:45:04 <CIA-103> bitcoin: Daniel Folkinshteyn * rfcc7499ccfac supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor/RatingSystem/ (plugin.py test.py): RatingSystem: shorten getrating output, include auth status when no ratings as well. http://tinyurl.com/43pt5ql http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/w/supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor.git/commitdiff/fcc7499ccfac5cc5c297a365b4156b64cc6cdfe6
233 2011-07-07 02:45:12 <CIA-103> bitcoin: Daniel Folkinshteyn * r6a25d33e32f1 supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor/RatingSystem/plugin.py: RatingSystem: bah, missing space in message http://tinyurl.com/43boao5 http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/w/supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor.git/commitdiff/6a25d33e32f1e69078669fef100910b18b63c6f4
234 2011-07-07 02:45:13 <cuddlefish> gaah
235 2011-07-07 02:47:42 <rethaw> someone is committing something
236 2011-07-07 02:47:46 <justmoon> luke-jr, is it possible that you put only your client on CIA and leave out other projects? we gotta draw the line somewhere
237 2011-07-07 02:47:47 <rethaw> and wants us all to know
238 2011-07-07 02:49:13 <luke-jr> justmoon: ?
239 2011-07-07 02:49:31 <lfm> cia spam seems to be growing
240 2011-07-07 02:49:35 <justmoon> CIA just notified us that you fixed a space in "supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor"
241 2011-07-07 02:49:40 <luke-jr> justmoon: the only thing new is the long URI being appended, and that was someone else
242 2011-07-07 02:49:44 <luke-jr> I didn't do anything
243 2011-07-07 02:50:02 <num1> what's CIA?
244 2011-07-07 02:50:04 <justmoon> luke-jr, I'm not saying you did, I'm saying you include too much stuff in your CIA stream
245 2011-07-07 02:50:19 <lfm> not your fault  think, whoever set up cia bot with github was too generous
246 2011-07-07 02:50:23 <cuddlefish> luke-jr: perhaps only tagged branches?
247 2011-07-07 02:50:24 <justmoon> I don't wanna go as far as BlueMatt and say remove your repo, but can you keep it to bitcoin client stuff only maybe?
248 2011-07-07 02:50:30 <luke-jr> justmoon: again, there is nothing new. CIA has been around for months, if not longer
249 2011-07-07 02:51:03 <luke-jr> cuddlefish: BitGit only does CIA for branches configured for it
250 2011-07-07 02:51:05 <lfm> luke-jr ya but there are more porjects getting added there I think
251 2011-07-07 02:51:24 <luke-jr> lfm: sure, and if someone wants to add it with CIA, that's not my business
252 2011-07-07 02:51:37 <luke-jr> that supybot plugin has been enabled for months at least
253 2011-07-07 02:51:55 <luke-jr> and once in a while people DO mess up and commit something that needs an immediate fix following up
254 2011-07-07 02:52:09 <lfm> like I/we said not really your fault
255 2011-07-07 02:52:20 <luke-jr> justmoon: nothing to do with me
256 2011-07-07 02:52:54 <doublec> just /ignore the bot if you don't want to see it
257 2011-07-07 02:53:11 <luke-jr> doublec++
258 2011-07-07 02:54:01 <cuddlefish> I want to see the commits... but can you make it a bit shorter?
259 2011-07-07 02:54:18 <cuddlefish> maybe commithash, repo, and message
260 2011-07-07 02:54:25 <justmoon> alright, I'll remove the long url
261 2011-07-07 02:54:38 <luke-jr> cuddlefish: that's what it was until someone (not me) added the long URIs
262 2011-07-07 02:55:14 <justmoon> luke-jr we added the long urls because we enabled cropping multiline commit messages
263 2011-07-07 02:55:25 <justmoon> and that cuts off the short url for multiline commits
264 2011-07-07 02:55:55 <nanotube> luke-jr: maybe set up a separate channel for the commitstream? :)
265 2011-07-07 02:56:15 <luke-jr> nanotube: why me?
266 2011-07-07 02:56:20 <luke-jr> and why now?
267 2011-07-07 02:56:27 <nanotube> luke-jr: dunno... it seems people are assuming that you control that bot :)
268 2011-07-07 02:56:36 <nanotube> also, i am personally fine with it
269 2011-07-07 02:56:45 <nanotube> i'm only jumping into the ongoing discussion ;)
270 2011-07-07 02:58:25 <justmoon> nanotube, I can move the bot, but I don't want to do it on my authority, Diablo-D3 set it up in september last year and since then it's been sort of a communal asset :)
271 2011-07-07 02:58:25 <lfm> luke-jr btw do ALL the blocks mined at Eligius have the "Eligius" xnonce stamp?
272 2011-07-07 02:58:42 <luke-jr> lfm: no, just recent ones
273 2011-07-07 02:58:46 <luke-jr> I think starting with Ti
274 2011-07-07 02:59:02 <lfm> ok so all since then
275 2011-07-07 02:59:23 <luke-jr> lfm: yeah, why? ;)
276 2011-07-07 02:59:45 <lfm> luke-jr just snooping in the block chain and noticed them
277 2011-07-07 02:59:52 <luke-jr> hehe
278 2011-07-07 02:59:58 <luke-jr> you might be the first ;)
279 2011-07-07 03:00:27 <luke-jr> no guarantee it remains that though :p
280 2011-07-07 03:00:35 <nanotube> justmoon: i'm fine with it as is. was just throwing out a suggestion ;)
281 2011-07-07 03:00:53 <luke-jr> might make it the system hostname so they're more unique
282 2011-07-07 03:01:34 <lfm> luke-jr might not want them to stand out that way for miners tha try to switch on blocks.
283 2011-07-07 03:01:49 <luke-jr> lfm: ?
284 2011-07-07 03:01:58 <luke-jr> lfm: Eligius welcomes pool hoppers
285 2011-07-07 03:02:07 <lfm> oh ok, nm
286 2011-07-07 03:02:33 <kunnis> Does anyone have time to test an bug I think I've found?   I need a person who's running the btc client on livenet to help me test out a bug I want to check.  I just want to connect to it like any other user can.
287 2011-07-07 03:02:42 <phantomcircuit> MTGOX IS NOW ON A NEW SITE
288 2011-07-07 03:02:43 <phantomcircuit> http://covertinferno.org/~phantomcircuit/mtgox.com/users/login
289 2011-07-07 03:03:25 <lfm> phantomcircuit: not nice
290 2011-07-07 03:04:01 <justmoon> kunnis, again?
291 2011-07-07 03:04:43 <kunnis> Yes, I (think) I have a working version of my bug.  I need to try it now with someone.
292 2011-07-07 03:04:59 <justmoon> well use my server again if you want btc1.justmoon.net
293 2011-07-07 03:05:02 <kunnis> I tried using yours, but it doesn't respond to all of the commands.  I send a version to it, and it doesn't reply to it
294 2011-07-07 03:05:16 <justmoon> it's a standard bitcoind 0.3.20.2
295 2011-07-07 03:05:41 <phantomcircuit> lfm, try and login
296 2011-07-07 03:05:59 <kunnis> This is an idea, not a confirmed bug :)
297 2011-07-07 03:06:06 <kunnis> *tries again*
298 2011-07-07 03:06:56 <kunnis> is it's blockchain current?
299 2011-07-07 03:07:14 <justmoon> let me check
300 2011-07-07 03:09:33 <doublec> justmoon: I have a recent bitcoind running on bitparking.com you can use to test
301 2011-07-07 03:09:46 <justmoon> I'm not testing anything, kunnis is
302 2011-07-07 03:09:58 <doublec> oh, sorry
303 2011-07-07 03:10:01 <justmoon> kunnis, might wanna use his server, mine isn't responding to ssh right now
304 2011-07-07 03:10:05 <kunnis> mind if I use it?
305 2011-07-07 03:10:09 <luke-jr> custom 0.3.23 on su.mining.eligius.st ;)
306 2011-07-07 03:10:13 <doublec> kunnis: sure
307 2011-07-07 03:10:18 <doublec> kunnis: mines running 0.3.24 release candidate
308 2011-07-07 03:10:27 <luke-jr> "connections" : 985,
309 2011-07-07 03:10:29 <kunnis> doublec  Can you check to make sure it's block chain is current?
310 2011-07-07 03:10:35 <doublec> kunnis: it is
311 2011-07-07 03:10:38 <kunnis> ok
312 2011-07-07 03:10:47 <kunnis> ip address?
313 2011-07-07 03:10:57 <kunnis> or dns?
314 2011-07-07 03:11:18 <doublec> kunnis: 206.71.179.116
315 2011-07-07 03:11:22 <kunnis> thanks
316 2011-07-07 03:11:25 <doublec> kunnis: aka bitparking.com
317 2011-07-07 03:13:09 <luke-jr> lolwat`: nope
318 2011-07-07 03:13:18 <luke-jr> in the US, you don't need to file/register for a TM
319 2011-07-07 03:13:20 <luke-jr> it's automatic
320 2011-07-07 03:13:31 <lolwat`> oh good
321 2011-07-07 03:13:42 <lolwat`> i thought I remembered learning one of the three was dumb
322 2011-07-07 03:13:48 <lolwat`> I know patents are first-to-invent
323 2011-07-07 03:14:46 <lolwat`> i dont understand why people do things like this
324 2011-07-07 03:14:53 <lolwat`> it's like stabbing a beehive with a stick
325 2011-07-07 03:15:19 <justmoon> lolwat`, exactly, they do it because they are hoping to end up with some honey
326 2011-07-07 03:15:52 <lolwat`> it just makes no sense
327 2011-07-07 03:15:59 <lolwat`> how many bitcoin-related things are legitimate businesses
328 2011-07-07 03:16:07 <lolwat`> and of those, how many are in US jurisdiction
329 2011-07-07 03:16:31 <lolwat`> oops missed this was -dev sorry for OT
330 2011-07-07 03:22:59 <num1> cuddlefish thanks for pointing me at nameless, he cleared it all up
331 2011-07-07 03:23:20 <nameless> |cuddlefish: Stop sending people with problems my way, you know I just ban them and blame it on a script
332 2011-07-07 03:23:23 <nameless> |:p
333 2011-07-07 03:23:34 <nameless> |I mean...
334 2011-07-07 03:24:10 <luke-jr> lol
335 2011-07-07 03:25:32 <nameless> |lolwat`: OT is ok so long as there's no other conversation going on. It's bad when there are people actually trying to do -dev stuff and it's OT
336 2011-07-07 03:26:34 <justmoon> nameless|, I concur
337 2011-07-07 03:27:03 <justmoon> -dev is my only pleasure while I wait for another difficulty 1 test block being generated by my crappy graphics card
338 2011-07-07 03:30:36 <lolwat`> fuck
339 2011-07-07 03:30:42 <lolwat`> http://bitcoindomains.blogspot.com/
340 2011-07-07 03:30:49 <lolwat`> DNS is so broken
341 2011-07-07 03:31:26 <justmoon> "bitcoinarmy.com" - hell yeah :D
342 2011-07-07 03:31:30 <lolwat`> there must be a way to do DNS or namecoin without squatters
343 2011-07-07 03:31:47 <luke-jr> regulation
344 2011-07-07 03:31:48 <lolwat`> maybe something like namecoin but where the network may vote to take away your domain if you're not using it
345 2011-07-07 03:32:11 <rethaw> funny thing is the most used bitcoin related domain aside from bitcoin.org doesn't even have bitcoin in the domain, or even a b
346 2011-07-07 03:32:17 <justmoon> lolwat`, lolwat?
347 2011-07-07 03:32:39 <justmoon> what if they vote to take it away from you and you *are* using it
348 2011-07-07 03:32:52 <lolwat`> luke-jr, that's the easy way out :]  I mean is there some way to do it in something like e.g. namecoin that is decentralized
349 2011-07-07 03:32:56 <lolwat`> justmoon, then I guess it sucks for you
350 2011-07-07 03:32:58 <lolwat`> but i mean 50% of people can do anything they want
351 2011-07-07 03:33:00 <luke-jr> lolwat`: no
352 2011-07-07 03:33:18 <lolwat`> I think it could be done
353 2011-07-07 03:33:26 <lolwat`> i had a thread on main forum that pissed a bunch of people off
354 2011-07-07 03:33:36 <lolwat`> describing what I would consider the ideal bitcoin client
355 2011-07-07 03:33:42 <luke-jr> democracy is fundamentally flawed
356 2011-07-07 03:33:48 <nameless> |I disagree
357 2011-07-07 03:33:58 <lolwat`> one that gave very precise control over all parameters
358 2011-07-07 03:34:13 <lolwat`> er consists of two parts
359 2011-07-07 03:34:16 <luke-jr> not the content
360 2011-07-07 03:34:34 <lolwat`> 1) a bitcoin client where you can modify ALL parameters (BTC issued per block, difficulty, etc)
361 2011-07-07 03:34:58 <lolwat`> 2) a method of "announcing" your acceptable parameter ranges, which would be included in your shares
362 2011-07-07 03:35:10 <lolwat`> basically imagine the big-scoreboard hash model
363 2011-07-07 03:35:28 <lolwat`> where people submit their shares, but it also includes their "acceptable parameters" range
364 2011-07-07 03:38:42 <lolwat`> really this is how things are now, just if I want to change something I need to go write a new client
365 2011-07-07 03:38:54 <lolwat`> the purpose of this would be to recognize that, and make it really easy
366 2011-07-07 03:40:24 <lolwat`> blacklist addresses
367 2011-07-07 03:40:28 <lolwat`> revoke namecoin names
368 2011-07-07 03:40:30 <lolwat`> etc
369 2011-07-07 03:40:52 <lolwat`> it's dishonest to say these things aren't possible now -- they are, just noone's written a client to do them
370 2011-07-07 03:41:13 <lolwat`> I say write the client to do all these things and sit back and watch and see if 50% will do them
371 2011-07-07 03:41:52 <justmoon> lolwat`, it doesn't matter how many people adopt a different client, if they change the rules they'll be on a separate network
372 2011-07-07 03:42:18 <justmoon> it could be 30% of the people adopting the new rules, then they'll have their little 30% network and the other will have their 70% network
373 2011-07-07 03:42:22 <lolwat`> justmoon, what do you mean
374 2011-07-07 03:42:31 <lolwat`> yes exactly
375 2011-07-07 03:42:37 <lolwat`> er but the point is
376 2011-07-07 03:42:49 <lolwat`> if you want to do business with those 70% you need to maintain a chain consistent with theirs
377 2011-07-07 03:43:33 <lolwat`> so the idea is that the scoreboard is like a public poll/verifiable way to tell what everyone's thinking
378 2011-07-07 03:43:37 <lolwat`> and what they're willing to accept
379 2011-07-07 03:44:10 <justmoon> I wouldn't use a democratic client. democracy is flawed like luke said, it justifies 51% stealing from the remaining 49%
380 2011-07-07 03:44:15 <lolwat`> once you have that it seems much easier to make changes
381 2011-07-07 03:44:27 <lolwat`> justmoon, but the current bitcoin client *is* democratic
382 2011-07-07 03:44:50 <lolwat`> 51% can wreak havoc on the network
383 2011-07-07 03:45:07 <justmoon> ok so the 51% debate again
384 2011-07-07 03:45:18 <lolwat`> er
385 2011-07-07 03:45:25 <lolwat`> what can people do in my system
386 2011-07-07 03:45:31 <lolwat`> that they can't do in bitcoin
387 2011-07-07 03:45:43 <justmoon> I've got my mum on the phone waiting for tech support, gotta run
388 2011-07-07 03:46:08 <lolwat`> by writing a new client
389 2011-07-07 04:43:19 <marvin_> ;;bc,stats
390 2011-07-07 04:43:27 <gribble> Current Blocks: 135133 | Current Difficulty: 1563027.9961162 | Next Difficulty At Block: 137087 | Next Difficulty In: 1954 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 6 days, 9 hours, 52 minutes, and 2 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1607537.91959202
391 2011-07-07 04:48:50 <dikidera> fail difficulty
392 2011-07-07 04:56:42 <rurufufuss> question to all the dev's, what's a good way to start delving into bitcoin networks?
393 2011-07-07 04:56:49 <lfm> seconds 1h
394 2011-07-07 04:57:03 <rurufufuss> I'm trying to make a tool to draw network charts/graphs
395 2011-07-07 04:57:13 <rurufufuss> of the bitcoin network
396 2011-07-07 04:57:58 <justmoon> rurufufuss, are you looking for information or for a tool/program that can help you?
397 2011-07-07 04:58:14 <dikidera> he wants to write a tool
398 2011-07-07 04:58:17 <lfm> rurufufuss: or watch the irc channel(s)
399 2011-07-07 04:58:18 <dikidera> not dl one
400 2011-07-07 04:58:30 <justmoon> yeah, well he'll have to write one
401 2011-07-07 04:58:37 <rurufufuss> information, trying to plug the graph into a graph visualization tool
402 2011-07-07 04:58:46 <rurufufuss> namely skyrails
403 2011-07-07 04:59:13 <justmoon> rurufufuss, ok, my question was kind of unclear
404 2011-07-07 04:59:19 <rurufufuss> the #bitcoin guys are telling me to look at the source code, but I suppose there might be a protocol reference around?
405 2011-07-07 04:59:31 <justmoon> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Protocol_specification
406 2011-07-07 04:59:36 <lfm> rurufufuss: nice guess, just wrong
407 2011-07-07 05:00:36 <rurufufuss> gracias senor/senorita
408 2011-07-07 05:00:49 <justmoon> rurufufuss, is there any programming language you're particularly comfortable with?
409 2011-07-07 05:01:09 <rurufufuss> c++
410 2011-07-07 05:01:17 <justmoon> yeah, then you'll probably want to hack the official client to do your bidding
411 2011-07-07 05:01:29 <rurufufuss> not the best answer for getting the right APIs eh?
412 2011-07-07 05:01:35 <rurufufuss> hmm
413 2011-07-07 05:01:37 <rurufufuss> wish there was something like libbitcoin
414 2011-07-07 05:01:41 <justmoon> rurufufuss, often suggested never implemented
415 2011-07-07 05:02:40 <justmoon> (imho)
416 2011-07-07 05:02:49 <rurufufuss> right, that makes sense too I guess
417 2011-07-07 05:02:54 <lfm> all sorts of bitcoin related dev kinda
418 2011-07-07 05:02:57 <rurufufuss> bitcoin startup devs? :p
419 2011-07-07 05:03:11 <justmoon> earlier we were talking to the dev of https://ubitex.org/
420 2011-07-07 05:03:31 <justmoon> so yeah, all kinds of stuff
421 2011-07-07 05:03:57 <rurufufuss> interesting, this is like the new frontier of startups huh
422 2011-07-07 05:04:13 <lfm> one of em
423 2011-07-07 08:22:58 <sipa> except the 111 thing would be so much nicer if it were 128 or 64
424 2011-07-07 08:23:07 <wumpus> yes
425 2011-07-07 08:30:52 <justmoon> JFK911, hm? in the address? o_O
426 2011-07-07 08:31:18 <wumpus> lol JFK911
427 2011-07-07 08:31:32 <wumpus> JFK911: and encode it in  xml, then zip it, then represent it as base58
428 2011-07-07 08:32:08 <sipa> so: bits (128,16,8) define data class, bits (111,91) define network, bits (1,2,4) define version?
429 2011-07-07 08:32:11 <JFK911> well a UUID i think provides enough resolution for any future application
430 2011-07-07 08:32:14 <wumpus> that'd be the one microsoft way :-)
431 2011-07-07 08:32:37 <justmoon> JFK911, yeah, but we don't have a lot of bytes in the address, otherwise it'll get too long
432 2011-07-07 08:32:53 <justmoon> I mean it's not like anybody would type an address by hand
433 2011-07-07 08:32:58 <JFK911> why the limit on address size?  nobody will type them in
434 2011-07-07 08:33:05 <justmoon> but it should still be, you know - manageable
435 2011-07-07 08:33:07 <JFK911> they are all copypasted or possibly scanned from barcodes
436 2011-07-07 08:33:19 <wumpus> I think the addresses are long enough
437 2011-07-07 08:33:25 <justmoon> like not be linewrapped if you write in an email "My bitcoin addres: ...."
438 2011-07-07 08:33:26 <JFK911> i think there is a crc or something in bitcoin addresses now.  don't remove that!
439 2011-07-07 08:33:27 <sipa> maybe we could even state that bit 4 means "extended", meaning there follows another version byte
440 2011-07-07 08:33:43 <sipa> bah
441 2011-07-07 08:33:56 <wumpus> sipa: why not use the upper bit for that, then put the flags in another byte :-)
442 2011-07-07 08:34:14 <sipa> that'd mean changing the private key format, which is already used in some places
443 2011-07-07 08:34:27 <wumpus> or do something like unicode 'read as long as the upper bit is set'
444 2011-07-07 08:34:31 <wumpus> hehe
445 2011-07-07 08:34:44 <wumpus> ah right
446 2011-07-07 08:35:14 <justmoon> wumpus, that's another thing, should we reserve something that will someday tell the client: this is a two byte version
447 2011-07-07 08:35:44 <Zoiah> joepie91: http://www.pastie.org/2173213
448 2011-07-07 08:35:45 <wumpus> exactly, because one extra byte might not be enough forever
449 2011-07-07 08:36:49 <sipa> bits (128,16,8) define the data class - these are defined: 0=address, 128=private key, 152=data class described in next byte
450 2011-07-07 08:37:21 <sipa> bits (111,91) define the network - these are defined: 0=realnet bitcoin, 111=testnet bitcoin, 52=private network
451 2011-07-07 08:38:08 <sipa> bits (1,2,4) define the version - these are defined: 0=currently only one, 7=another version byte follows
452 2011-07-07 08:38:27 <justmoon> sipa: did you see our suggestion to just drop 111 for testnet, reset testnet and use something cleaner?
453 2011-07-07 08:38:51 <sipa> that still leaves you with the namecoin problem
454 2011-07-07 08:39:27 <sipa> to do it really clean, would be (128,64)=network, (32,16,8)=data class, (4,2,1)=version
455 2011-07-07 08:39:49 <sipa> but that means invalidating testnet, namecoin and private keys
456 2011-07-07 08:39:51 <justmoon> hmm, there will be plenty more applications - can we get a range of exact values that includes 52 that is reserved for private networks?
457 2011-07-07 08:40:03 <justmoon> like 32-63 or something?
458 2011-07-07 08:40:12 <sipa> it's just a single value
459 2011-07-07 08:40:36 <justmoon> no I mean if bit 32 has no other meaning it could mean "private network"
460 2011-07-07 08:40:45 <justmoon> then 52 would just one value from that range
461 2011-07-07 08:40:49 <justmoon> just be*
462 2011-07-07 08:41:05 <sipa> right, but what about other data classes in the network?
463 2011-07-07 08:41:14 <justmoon> data classes?
464 2011-07-07 08:41:22 <sipa> private keys, master keys, address
465 2011-07-07 08:41:42 <justmoon> you don't need a whole bit for all of those
466 2011-07-07 08:41:51 <sipa> how so?
467 2011-07-07 08:42:04 <justmoon> well a master key can't also be an address or a private key
468 2011-07-07 08:42:10 <sipa> of course not
469 2011-07-07 08:42:45 <sipa> (32,16,8) define the data class, so there are 8 possible data classes; from those 8, there are currently 3 defined
470 2011-07-07 08:42:57 <sipa> (the third one being "extended", another byte follows)
471 2011-07-07 08:43:12 <sipa> maybe we have enough with 2 bits for data classes
472 2011-07-07 08:43:22 <justmoon> yeah hang on
473 2011-07-07 08:43:49 <justmoon> if 32 and 16 are set it's not a data class, then it's a private network
474 2011-07-07 08:44:01 <justmoon> that would cover namecoin
475 2011-07-07 08:44:23 <sipa> ok, and when it's a private network, version and data class lose their meaning
476 2011-07-07 08:44:28 <justmoon> and that's the first thing we check, so the other bits can be whatever they want
477 2011-07-07 08:44:29 <justmoon> exactly
478 2011-07-07 08:44:55 <MrSam> luke-jr: ?
479 2011-07-07 08:46:50 <sipa> justmoon: ok, good: if bit 32 is set, this is a private network, and no further bits are defined; if not, check whether bit 64 is net - if so: testnet, otherwise: realnet
480 2011-07-07 08:47:03 <sipa> if it is testnet, XOR with 111
481 2011-07-07 08:47:18 <justmoon> -_- just. reset. testnet.
482 2011-07-07 08:47:26 <justmoon> but ok whatever
483 2011-07-07 08:47:26 <sipa> ?
484 2011-07-07 08:47:37 <justmoon> just reset it, change it's version to 48
485 2011-07-07 08:47:40 <justmoon> decimal
486 2011-07-07 11:01:19 <senseles> seems like the program not compiling on one of the most common server distributions would lead to acceptance issues
487 2011-07-07 11:13:39 <Cryo> I think I'm going to build an OSX version that doesn't use the wxWidgets for X11, but the Cocoa ones, like I did for the otr-proxy app
488 2011-07-07 11:16:18 <jav__> do any of you guys have some insight into the state of things of the ripple project? (do they have an IRC channel?)
489 2011-07-07 11:18:49 <jav__> It's my understanding, that the Ripple software currently only supports centralized server setups ... but that they are working on a decentralized solution
490 2011-07-07 11:19:41 <jav__> although I wonder how feasible that is... you then have to find trust paths that might span over multiple servers.. sounds like a pretty hard problem
491 2011-07-07 11:32:10 <b4epoche> Cryo:  OSX version?
492 2011-07-07 11:34:08 <Cryo> yeh
493 2011-07-07 11:34:16 <b4epoche> of what?
494 2011-07-07 11:34:34 <Cryo> the client from the git repo
495 2011-07-07 11:34:43 <b4epoche> you want to test mine?
496 2011-07-07 11:35:12 <Cryo> is it cocoa, fat, and 10.4+?
497 2011-07-07 11:35:18 <Cryo> if so, yes.
498 2011-07-07 11:35:37 <b4epoche> fat?  ppc+intel?  no
499 2011-07-07 11:35:47 <b4epoche> and 10.5.6+
500 2011-07-07 11:35:53 <Cryo> ppc is borked, but fat for 32/64
501 2011-07-07 11:36:01 <jrmithdobbs> Cryo: huh? bitcoin doesn't use wx for x11 it uses cocoa wx bindings
502 2011-07-07 11:36:07 <doublec> jav__: there are threads in the forums about it
503 2011-07-07 11:36:14 <Cryo> hmm, I was reading the makefile wrong?
504 2011-07-07 11:36:19 <jrmithdobbs> Cryo: and someone already has a native cocoa ui implemented
505 2011-07-07 11:36:25 <doublec> jav__: including from ripple developers
506 2011-07-07 11:36:27 <b4epoche> me! ;-)
507 2011-07-07 11:36:32 <jrmithdobbs> yes him!
508 2011-07-07 11:36:42 <jav__> doublec: about ripple in general? or the path finding in a decentralized setting in particular?
509 2011-07-07 11:37:02 <b4epoche> but I would be willing to have help
510 2011-07-07 11:37:06 <Cryo> then, yes I'll gladly test instead of hacking it
511 2011-07-07 11:37:11 <doublec> jav__: both
512 2011-07-07 11:37:18 <jrmithdobbs> Cryo: you can't tell from the makefile which it uses seeing as all that is decided by how wx is built not how bitcoin is built
513 2011-07-07 11:37:20 <doublec> jav__: eg http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=4334.0
514 2011-07-07 11:37:38 <b4epoche> Cryo:  it's only 32-bit at the moment because I didn't compile all the libs it needs for 64-bit
515 2011-07-07 11:37:41 <jav__> doublec: thx, I'll check it out
516 2011-07-07 11:37:44 <jrmithdobbs> Cryo: if the version of wx you build against is built for x11 then sure, bitcoin will use that, but the build instructions provided do not tell you to do that
517 2011-07-07 11:37:52 <doublec> jav__: look up any posts by Daniel, who is the original poster of that thread
518 2011-07-07 11:38:14 <Cryo> hrm
519 2011-07-07 11:38:48 <Cryo> DEPSDIR=/Users/macosuser/bitcoin/deps
520 2011-07-07 11:38:53 <Cryo> that could be part of the problem
521 2011-07-07 11:38:59 <b4epoche> I'm just trying to get the stuff implemented on i386 first&  but it shouldn't be a big deal to get x86_64 too
522 2011-07-07 11:39:10 <Cryo> WXLIBS=$(shell $(DEPSDIR)/bin/wx-config --libs --static)
523 2011-07-07 11:39:40 <b4epoche> yea, uh, that needs changed for your env
524 2011-07-07 11:39:54 <jrmithdobbs> b4epoche: pretty sure your code will build 64bit as is no problem
525 2011-07-07 11:39:56 <Cryo> 0939][cryo@Slurm:~/bitcoin/src]$ wx-config --list
526 2011-07-07 11:40:00 <Cryo> Default config is mac-unicode-release-static-2.8
527 2011-07-07 11:40:27 <jrmithdobbs> at least, assuming you ever updated git with a buildable version ;p
528 2011-07-07 11:40:41 <b4epoche> jrmithdobbs:  I'm sure /my/ code will
529 2011-07-07 11:41:05 <b4epoche> it's just that the dylibs with it are not univeral
530 2011-07-07 11:41:11 <jrmithdobbs> b4epoche: which libs?
531 2011-07-07 11:41:13 <jrmithdobbs> cause i'm pretty sure i already have built all the dep libs 64bit no problem as well
532 2011-07-07 11:41:27 <Cryo> I'm going by what errors I was seeing when I was building& but I probably needed more beer
533 2011-07-07 11:41:40 <b4epoche> I got hung up on something with 64bit...
534 2011-07-07 11:41:42 <b4epoche> let me look
535 2011-07-07 11:41:42 <Cryo> yeh, I'm full 64
536 2011-07-07 11:42:29 <b4epoche> hmm&  yea it's just libdb that isn't
537 2011-07-07 11:42:44 <jrmithdobbs> i use libdb from ports
538 2011-07-07 11:42:49 <jrmithdobbs> and it is ;p
539 2011-07-07 11:42:55 <Cryo> I'll dick with it
540 2011-07-07 11:42:58 <b4epoche> I didn't really try to hard&
541 2011-07-07 11:43:02 <b4epoche> one hurdle and I probably quit ;-)
542 2011-07-07 11:43:12 <Cryo> I wanted to import this into pkgsrc-wip
543 2011-07-07 11:44:01 <jrmithdobbs> erm, i can't even find libdb atm
544 2011-07-07 11:44:27 <jrmithdobbs> of there it is
545 2011-07-07 11:44:43 <b4epoche> building with port
546 2011-07-07 11:44:49 <jrmithdobbs> /opt/local/lib/db48/libdb-4.8.dylib: Mach-O 64-bit dynamically linked shared library x86_64
547 2011-07-07 11:44:57 <Cryo> fink or macports?
548 2011-07-07 11:45:03 <b4epoche> macports
549 2011-07-07 11:45:20 <jrmithdobbs> fink is dead
550 2011-07-07 11:45:27 <Cryo> yeh, I'm pkgsrc.
551 2011-07-07 11:45:45 <jrmithdobbs> fink hasn't been even useful since 10.4
552 2011-07-07 11:45:52 <b4epoche> pkgsrc?
553 2011-07-07 11:45:54 <jrmithdobbs> even semi-useful*
554 2011-07-07 11:45:59 <Cryo> NetBSD pkgsrc
555 2011-07-07 11:46:04 <b4epoche> but fink was nice for the binaries
556 2011-07-07 11:46:09 <Cryo> that's why all of the endian crap I was whining about a couple weeks ago
557 2011-07-07 11:46:11 <b4epoche> someone needs to host macport binaries
558 2011-07-07 11:48:58 <jrmithdobbs> what is the damn equiv to HOME on windows?
559 2011-07-07 11:49:08 <jrmithdobbs> the environment variable
560 2011-07-07 11:49:51 <nanotube> %HOME% maybe? heh
561 2011-07-07 11:50:17 <jrmithdobbs> no
562 2011-07-07 11:50:30 <jrmithdobbs> just found it. %HOMEPATH% because they just gots to be slightly different for no goddamned reason
563 2011-07-07 11:51:23 <ZOP> heh w/ windows, depends on what your'e storing, and whether-or-not you want it copied into the network profile or not for domain logins... :D
564 2011-07-07 11:51:35 <ZOP> they made it messy, typical of windows.
565 2011-07-07 11:51:42 <jrmithdobbs> my impression of windows 7 over the last few days is not good
566 2011-07-07 11:51:49 <jrmithdobbs> i thought people said the user experience got better?
567 2011-07-07 11:52:01 <ZOP> it's still windows.
568 2011-07-07 11:52:15 <ZOP> i still have random BSODs
569 2011-07-07 11:52:37 <jrmithdobbs> how is taking >36 hours to get patched passed sp1 "better" including 6 hours of hassling because windows update randomly forgot that sp1 even existed and said i canceled it at some point (didn't) and i had to go grab it from download.microsoft.com to actually get it to apply
570 2011-07-07 11:52:50 <ZOP> it still has the idiocy that it thinks "whatever just happened in any random app is immediately the most important thing in the world so we'll throw a popup box in your face that you'll never get to read coz you just pressed spacebar somewhere"
571 2011-07-07 11:53:04 <JFK911> worked fine for me
572 2011-07-07 11:53:08 <JFK911> never had a stop or anything on windows 7
573 2011-07-07 11:53:26 <b4epoche> hmm&  macports db48 +universal installed fine...
574 2011-07-07 11:53:28 <ZOP> The networking stack is also a pile of dog shit.
575 2011-07-07 11:53:32 <jrmithdobbs> then once actually downloaded sp1 it took ~3 hours to install it. on essentially a fresh install that has um, office (already patched but no settings for any of the apps) installed and that's about it
576 2011-07-07 11:53:44 <ZOP> (again...they had fixed it,t hen they started fuckign with it again)
577 2011-07-07 11:53:54 <jrmithdobbs> 3 hours. on a quadcore i7 w/4G of ram and ssd
578 2011-07-07 11:53:57 <jrmithdobbs> how does that even work?!
579 2011-07-07 11:53:59 <JFK911> why didnt you just install from a dvd with sp1 if you want sp1
580 2011-07-07 11:54:06 <jrmithdobbs> JFK911: have to start with the corp image
581 2011-07-07 11:54:15 <ZOP> jrmithdobbs: yeah and once SP1 gets installed you'll still have a few hundred megs of patches and reboots to do.
582 2011-07-07 11:54:18 <Cryo> because& it's windows?
583 2011-07-07 11:54:19 <JFK911> my corp image has sp1 in it
584 2011-07-07 11:54:24 <JFK911> takes 11 minutes to install it from the deployment server
585 2011-07-07 11:54:36 <b4epoche> eh, doing "open *" in /opt/local/lib is not good ;-)
586 2011-07-07 11:54:38 <JFK911> im pretty sure if i kicked one off now it would patch itself within 1hr too
587 2011-07-07 11:54:52 <jrmithdobbs> JFK911: like i would *purchase* something to run windows on?! shit, the 36 hours patching alone justifies spending ~$500 more on an equiv macbook pro to this thinkpad for me.
588 2011-07-07 11:54:55 <Cryo> your patch server might be local too
589 2011-07-07 11:55:14 <JFK911> Cryo: it is
590 2011-07-07 11:55:24 <jrmithdobbs> JFK911: because the image they've shipped to ibm for the preload doesn't include sp1 yet
591 2011-07-07 11:55:37 <jrmithdobbs> err s/ibm/lenovo/
592 2011-07-07 11:55:47 <JFK911> but it still maxes out my downstream when it syncs from MS
593 2011-07-07 11:55:59 <JFK911> im not sure if its the same mess of serving that handles web updates
594 2011-07-07 11:56:13 <jrmithdobbs> JFK911: my problem was not the downloading.
595 2011-07-07 11:56:29 <JFK911> maybe lenovo put 27 badware memory hog apps on your computer.
596 2011-07-07 11:56:33 <JFK911> like mcaffee.
597 2011-07-07 11:56:37 <JFK911> and thinkpad help
598 2011-07-07 11:56:43 <JFK911> and thinkpad button application
599 2011-07-07 11:56:52 <JFK911> and thinkpad network hog
600 2011-07-07 11:57:10 <ZOP> heh yeah thats another nice problem with the PC vendors
601 2011-07-07 11:57:14 <jrmithdobbs> JFK911: did you skip the part where it's our image?
602 2011-07-07 11:57:20 <JFK911> oh i just read that lenovo imaged the machine
603 2011-07-07 11:57:26 <JFK911> so it is your fault
604 2011-07-07 11:57:30 <ZOP> "lets install a whole pile of shit you'll never use, that we get paid for sending out to you!"
605 2011-07-07 11:57:37 <JFK911> if its your image
606 2011-07-07 11:57:52 <jrmithdobbs> JFK911: it has the thinkpad button stuff, mcaffee, cisco security agent, vpn client, and full disk encryption (but it's aes256 so that *WAS NOT* the slow down)
607 2011-07-07 11:57:56 <b4epoche> that's the PC way...
608 2011-07-07 11:58:17 <jrmithdobbs> JFK911: and office
609 2011-07-07 11:58:30 <jrmithdobbs> JFK911: there's nothing installed that justifies 3 hours for an sp1 install
610 2011-07-07 11:58:45 <JFK911> theres really nothing that justifies installing sp1
611 2011-07-07 11:58:47 <JFK911> im not sure why you did it
612 2011-07-07 11:58:58 <jrmithdobbs> but please keep being a ms fanboy i guess
613 2011-07-07 11:59:09 <JFK911> i declined sp1 on my update server, and the only machines that have it are the ones that got installed post sp1
614 2011-07-07 11:59:24 <jrmithdobbs> why the hell would you do that?
615 2011-07-07 11:59:28 <JFK911> now an office 2010 sp1 appeared recently
616 2011-07-07 11:59:49 <JFK911> did you read what's included on sp1?
617 2011-07-07 11:59:55 <JFK911> nothing i care about and
618 2011-07-07 12:00:21 <JFK911> no sense applying it to machine with current patches
619 2011-07-07 12:00:54 <Diablo-D3> http://rss.slashdot.org/~r/Slashdot/slashdot/~3/Wn4hn_QIkGI/Lawyer-Attempts-To-Trademark-Bitcoin
620 2011-07-07 12:00:59 <Diablo-D3> LOL
621 2011-07-07 12:01:14 <Cryo> nice try.
622 2011-07-07 12:01:29 <JFK911> but i will be pushing office sp1
623 2011-07-07 12:01:41 <jrmithdobbs> considering how quick ms likes to discontinue security patches for machines without sps i don't really care what's in it
624 2011-07-07 12:03:08 <JFK911> im sure five years from now the machines without sp1 right now will be reimaged
625 2011-07-07 12:03:13 <JFK911> it is windoze after all
626 2011-07-07 12:16:03 <Cryo> 10:15  <RangerRick> haven't done binaries for quite some time, but fink is still alive
627 2011-07-07 12:16:49 <jackmcbarn> is there anywhere i can see what times the last few blocks were generated at?
628 2011-07-07 12:17:04 <b4epoche> eh, yea, it's alive&  but support seems to have died
629 2011-07-07 12:20:15 <nanotube> jackmcbarn: blockexplorer.com
630 2011-07-07 12:48:05 <justmoon> holy shit, epic hailstorm out here o_O - just woke up
631 2011-07-07 12:48:25 <b4epoche> where?
632 2011-07-07 12:48:33 <justmoon> central switzerland
633 2011-07-07 12:48:54 <justmoon> I woke up and it was load like a football stadion
634 2011-07-07 12:49:00 <b4epoche> isn't all switzerland 'central'?
635 2011-07-07 12:49:17 <justmoon> well in the center of that :)
636 2011-07-07 12:49:28 <justmoon> loud*
637 2011-07-07 12:50:12 <justmoon> anyway
638 2011-07-07 12:50:40 <justmoon> imagine waking up and it sounds like there is at least twenty banging against your windows and walls
639 2011-07-07 12:50:48 <justmoon> twenty people*
640 2011-07-07 12:50:57 <b4epoche> damage?
641 2011-07-07 12:51:18 <justmoon> I had the blinds down, I'll go check damage once it stops completely
642 2011-07-07 12:51:26 <justmoon> at the moment it's died down a bit
643 2011-07-07 12:51:55 <b4epoche> hmm&  waking up?  it's afternoon there, no?
644 2011-07-07 12:52:01 <justmoon> yeah, I worked through the night, just went to bed at 2pm
645 2011-07-07 12:52:37 <justmoon> that just adds to the whole "whaaa... iss goooiingg onn - did someone divide by zero?!" factor
646 2011-07-07 12:53:08 <justmoon> alright anyway, probably gonna catch some more sleep :)
647 2011-07-07 12:54:14 <TD> sleep well :)
648 2011-07-07 12:54:53 <justmoon> TD: did you notice any of that in zurich?
649 2011-07-07 12:54:58 <TD> yeah
650 2011-07-07 12:55:02 <TD> it was real solid for a short while
651 2011-07-07 12:55:17 <TD> but, i have my headphones on
652 2011-07-07 12:55:22 <justmoon> there is like massive piles of ice here now
653 2011-07-07 12:55:34 <TD> only noticed when i looked out of the window
654 2011-07-07 12:55:38 <justmoon> wtf
655 2011-07-07 12:55:43 <TD> oh
656 2011-07-07 12:55:47 <denisx> its 5pm!
657 2011-07-07 12:55:47 <justmoon> yeah, whatever I'll blame that too
658 2011-07-07 12:55:47 <TD> no, we didn't have it that bad
659 2011-07-07 12:55:48 <justmoon> lol
660 2011-07-07 12:55:48 <TD> or maybe US congress, haha :)
661 2011-07-07 12:55:49 <b4epoche> blame the miners adding to global warming
662 2011-07-07 12:55:55 <justmoon> alright, see you around
663 2011-07-07 12:55:57 <justmoon> night! :)
664 2011-07-07 14:07:59 <b4epoche> dumb C++ question:  What does stuff like "ssKey >> strAddress;" do?
665 2011-07-07 14:09:20 <upb> invokes the >> operator
666 2011-07-07 14:10:23 <BlueMatt> b4epoche: http://www.cplusplus.com/reference/string/operator%3E%3E/
667 2011-07-07 14:10:33 <b4epoche> i.e. bitwise right shift?
668 2011-07-07 14:10:39 <enquirer> they use it often to denote stream in/out operation
669 2011-07-07 14:10:56 <BlueMatt> >> and << are typically overrided like crazy depending on the object
670 2011-07-07 14:10:59 <enquirer> something like  "extract address from key"
671 2011-07-07 14:11:03 <BlueMatt> in this case, Im assuming strAddress is a string
672 2011-07-07 14:11:22 <b4epoche> okay, thx BlueMatt, that's what it looked to be doing but the bit shift confused me
673 2011-07-07 14:11:25 <BlueMatt> you need to figure out what type it is
674 2011-07-07 14:11:33 <upb> its not a 'bit shift'
675 2011-07-07 14:11:55 <BlueMatt> why would you have two variables to a bit shift?
676 2011-07-07 14:12:02 <upb> anyway you need to know the types of both objects
677 2011-07-07 14:12:32 <b4epoche> I know it's not a bit shift but >> by default is, no?
678 2011-07-07 14:12:48 <b4epoche> which was really confusing...
679 2011-07-07 14:12:48 <upb> yes
680 2011-07-07 14:12:53 <BlueMatt> no its not
681 2011-07-07 14:13:06 <upb> its a nice way to do dsl
682 2011-07-07 14:13:09 <BlueMatt> it depends on the object too much
683 2011-07-07 14:13:13 <BlueMatt> there isnt much of a default for >> or <<
684 2011-07-07 14:13:20 <BlueMatt> its overrided too much
685 2011-07-07 14:14:56 <b4epoche> http://www.cplusplus.com/doc/tutorial/operators/
686 2011-07-07 14:15:42 <BlueMatt> meh, its rarely used that way...
687 2011-07-07 14:15:52 <b4epoche> kinda sums up the mess&  they use << with strings and then say later it's a shift...
688 2011-07-07 14:16:36 <erus`> deepbit is down :(
689 2011-07-07 14:16:49 <b4epoche> anyway, I understand it now (and all languages have idiosyncrasies)
690 2011-07-07 14:17:17 <erus`> b4epoche: its just context
691 2011-07-07 14:17:29 <dikidera> does a miner also use negative nonces?
692 2011-07-07 14:17:36 <erus`> a dogs tail is different to a story tale
693 2011-07-07 14:17:53 <b4epoche> bad analogy ;-)
694 2011-07-07 14:17:59 <b4epoche> tail != tale
695 2011-07-07 14:18:02 <erus`> but they are both ta(i)l(e)s
696 2011-07-07 14:18:19 <erus`> it works if you say it out loud
697 2011-07-07 14:19:03 <b4epoche> but I got it&  like the pointer mess of *'s []'s {}'s &'s
698 2011-07-07 14:20:45 <erus`> pointers are pretty obvious once you 'see the matrix'
699 2011-07-07 14:21:54 <b4epoche> but stuff like *foo[] is inconsistent (imo) but convenient
700 2011-07-07 14:21:56 <erus`> i allways do char **argv
701 2011-07-07 14:22:01 <erus`> i can read it quicker
702 2011-07-07 14:24:42 <b4epoche> okay, I realize the addressBook code has some issues, but shouldn't     pwalletMain->SetAddressBookName(strAddress, strName); also update pwallet->mapAddressBook?
703 2011-07-07 14:26:09 <gim> b4epoche: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/358
704 2011-07-07 14:26:16 <gim> first patch is in git tip
705 2011-07-07 14:27:34 <b4epoche> tip?
706 2011-07-07 14:29:52 <gim> it's included in the 0.3.24rcs
707 2011-07-07 14:29:56 <b4epoche> stuff in https://github.com/sgimenez/bitcoin/commit/4d410cfce967a42cca7db13288b72baec29423d1 ?
708 2011-07-07 14:30:22 <gim> yes
709 2011-07-07 14:31:54 <Eremes> do I need to be online after clicking the send button ?
710 2011-07-07 14:32:28 <Eremes> my bitcoin balance already deducted, but the font still in transparent
711 2011-07-07 14:32:54 <gim> no, if you are connected to some peers it should be fine
712 2011-07-07 14:33:31 <Eremes> cool
713 2011-07-07 14:33:42 <Eremes> so I can just go offline the second I hit the send button rite ?
714 2011-07-07 14:33:52 <gim> your tx is already know all around the world
715 2011-07-07 14:33:56 <Eremes> I mean when I saw the balance already deducted
716 2011-07-07 14:35:27 <wumpus> yes
717 2011-07-07 14:35:44 <gim> i think it might happen that all your connected peer drop the transaction at the same time for some unknown reason, but it is really unlikely
718 2011-07-07 14:36:33 <gim> it no peer have received your tx you are notified
719 2011-07-07 14:39:00 <Eremes> notified "offline" rite ?
720 2011-07-07 14:40:40 <rlifchitz> ;;bc,stats
721 2011-07-07 14:40:44 <gribble> Current Blocks: 135187 | Current Difficulty: 1563027.9961162 | Next Difficulty At Block: 137087 | Next Difficulty In: 1900 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 6 days, 16 hours, 16 minutes, and 40 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1522026.01446035
722 2011-07-07 14:49:48 <he1kki> testing testing, am I allowed to speak here?
723 2011-07-07 14:50:20 <Diablo-D3> he1kki: no.
724 2011-07-07 14:52:01 <he1kki> Yess! Anyway, I have one weird transaction, I got it more than three hours ago, but It's still with zero confirmation. Would you consider that normal?
725 2011-07-07 14:52:41 <he1kki> Cannot find it from block explorer, but I suppose it's not realtime
726 2011-07-07 14:53:01 <BlueMatt> bbe will only show you a tx if its in a block aka confirmed
727 2011-07-07 14:54:49 <BlueMatt> did it have a fee, how much was it for, etc?
728 2011-07-07 14:57:04 <he1kki> Just a sec, noticed that I cannot copy+paste straigth from client
729 2011-07-07 14:59:49 <BlueMatt> if there is enough info that you have to copy/paste, use a pastebin
730 2011-07-07 14:59:51 <he1kki> Well that was ugliest debugging data collection, but pic @ http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2j341uv&s=7
731 2011-07-07 15:01:15 <BlueMatt> cntrl-f it on http://bitcoincharts.com/bitcoin/ its there so it will show up soon
732 2011-07-07 15:01:30 <BlueMatt> but its low priority because its a fairly small amount and no fee was paid
733 2011-07-07 15:03:53 <he1kki> Oh, now I found it also! Thanks for this debug. Betco.in really need to start paying transaction fees then =)
734 2011-07-07 15:03:57 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: any -rc3 bugs cropping up?
735 2011-07-07 15:04:30 <BlueMatt> not afaik, but Im not on the subscription for the announce thread on the forum so...
736 2011-07-07 15:07:44 <BlueMatt> Id like to wait for a response from the guy who reported the win32 doesnt work on win2000- but even if thats not solved we should probably release anyway...
737 2011-07-07 15:08:32 <pakiaries1> hi
738 2011-07-07 15:09:27 <pakiaries1> so bitcoins ay
739 2011-07-07 15:09:34 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: I was hoping for a final release tomorrow, barring regressions/bugs
740 2011-07-07 15:09:42 <jgarzik> tcatm: ^^
741 2011-07-07 15:09:50 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: sounds good to me
742 2011-07-07 15:11:02 <dikidera> jgarzik:would you add a target check before sending work to bitcoin?
743 2011-07-07 15:11:14 <BlueMatt> wtf does that mean?
744 2011-07-07 15:11:25 <dikidera> if hash > target { return;}
745 2011-07-07 15:11:30 <BlueMatt> oh in pushpool
746 2011-07-07 15:11:36 <dikidera> no
747 2011-07-07 15:11:40 <BlueMatt> well or that
748 2011-07-07 15:11:47 <jgarzik> dikidera: ask conman, he maintains cgminer
749 2011-07-07 15:11:51 <BlueMatt> s/cg/cpu/
750 2011-07-07 15:12:01 <BlueMatt> oh a different miner god
751 2011-07-07 15:12:22 <dikidera> matt:cgminer includes gpu support
752 2011-07-07 15:12:26 <dikidera> and is cool to tweak
753 2011-07-07 15:12:41 <BlueMatt> meh whatever we already have a billion and a half miners
754 2011-07-07 15:12:57 <dikidera> not in C we dont
755 2011-07-07 15:13:07 <BlueMatt> so?
756 2011-07-07 15:13:16 <BlueMatt> for gpu mining language the client was written in really doesnt matter
757 2011-07-07 15:13:16 <dikidera> so...python sucks and i barely understand it
758 2011-07-07 15:13:20 <dikidera> C, much better
759 2011-07-07 15:13:30 <BlueMatt> them are fighting words right there
760 2011-07-07 15:13:52 <erus`> i hate all __this___() crap in python
761 2011-07-07 15:13:55 <dikidera> also the way the other miners are written, you can't change a damn thing
762 2011-07-07 15:13:57 <erus`> otherwise its nice
763 2011-07-07 15:14:01 <dikidera> with cgminer, it gives you options
764 2011-07-07 15:14:23 <BlueMatt> you can change a ton of shit on all the miners I know
765 2011-07-07 15:15:01 <dikidera> i dont understand python..too hard and nothing to do with what i know from PHP, and php is written in C, thus the similarities thus i better understand it
766 2011-07-07 15:18:02 <BlueMatt> php being written in c has nothing to do with what you did/didnt lean by learning php
767 2011-07-07 15:18:08 <dikidera> it has
768 2011-07-07 15:18:11 <dikidera> for me at least
769 2011-07-07 15:18:12 <BlueMatt> lol ok
770 2011-07-07 15:19:36 <erus`> :|
771 2011-07-07 15:20:05 <Theo`> dikidera: python is also written in C
772 2011-07-07 15:20:12 <Theo`> well the interpreter is
773 2011-07-07 15:20:24 <dikidera> doesnt look very C to me
774 2011-07-07 15:20:28 <dikidera> especially them loops
775 2011-07-07 15:20:30 <BlueMatt> just like the interpreter of php is written in c
776 2011-07-07 15:20:33 <dikidera> and this self crap
777 2011-07-07 15:20:51 <BlueMatt> php being written in c == python being written in c
778 2011-07-07 15:21:04 <Theo`> that's because there's no relation between the language and the language in which the interpreter is written
779 2011-07-07 15:21:06 <dikidera> python has nothing to do with c the way i see it
780 2011-07-07 15:21:09 <dikidera> the code is totally different
781 2011-07-07 15:21:11 <BlueMatt> interpreter language has nothing to do with the language
782 2011-07-07 15:21:21 <BlueMatt> same with php
783 2011-07-07 15:21:26 <BlueMatt> php has nothing to do with c
784 2011-07-07 15:22:01 <dikidera> the language is almost visually the same with c
785 2011-07-07 15:22:06 <BlueMatt> lol ok
786 2011-07-07 15:22:06 <dikidera> easy to write...
787 2011-07-07 15:22:30 <BlueMatt> visuals have nothing to do with how you program just the keys you hit
788 2011-07-07 15:23:00 <dikidera> it has...for an example, the font as well
789 2011-07-07 15:23:08 <BlueMatt> the font?????
790 2011-07-07 15:23:19 <dikidera> this is purely something of my own
791 2011-07-07 15:23:21 <BlueMatt> you know you can program in whatever the hell you want, its just plaintext, all three of them
792 2011-07-07 15:23:29 <dikidera> i can't read code if it's not in notepad++
793 2011-07-07 15:23:37 <BlueMatt> oh god
794 2011-07-07 15:23:52 <BlueMatt> then you probably shouldnt be coding anyway
795 2011-07-07 15:24:09 <Titeuf_87> You can program python in notepad++, or c, or php, or (almost) any language really.
796 2011-07-07 15:24:30 <dikidera> yeah...sorry, the colors of python in notepad++ are ugly
797 2011-07-07 15:24:36 <dikidera> i can change them
798 2011-07-07 15:24:38 <dikidera> but it's not the same
799 2011-07-07 15:24:57 <BlueMatt> you cant code in a language because the colors look bad???
800 2011-07-07 15:25:49 <dikidera> i can't follow the code if it's not in those colors..
801 2011-07-07 15:25:59 <dikidera> i've tried using kate in linux...i barely was able to write a line
802 2011-07-07 15:26:04 <BlueMatt> then you probably shouldnt be coding...
803 2011-07-07 15:26:04 <dikidera> i couldnt read the code
804 2011-07-07 15:26:09 <BlueMatt> esp not in c
805 2011-07-07 15:26:15 <K_F> :)
806 2011-07-07 15:26:20 <K_F> seconded
807 2011-07-07 15:27:12 <BlueMatt> dikidera: http://learnpythonthehardway.org/book/
808 2011-07-07 15:27:22 <BlueMatt> have fun
809 2011-07-07 15:27:43 <dikidera> but i dont like python
810 2011-07-07 15:27:48 <dikidera> not just because of the colors