1 2011-07-11 00:33:32 <Kiba> yo
  2 2011-07-11 00:33:39 <lfm> hi
  3 2011-07-11 00:36:14 <Kiba> a new Bitcoin Weekly t-shirt is coming out
  4 2011-07-11 02:13:23 <osmosis> anyone take ING P2P ?
  5 2011-07-11 02:17:45 <jgarzik> osmosis: #bitcoin-otc / #bitcoin-pit
  6 2011-07-11 02:20:20 <osmosis> yah, sorry
  7 2011-07-11 05:35:50 <mekel_> anyone use diablo miner nowadays>
  8 2011-07-11 05:36:22 <Diablo-D3> uh, pretty much everybody
  9 2011-07-11 05:36:28 <mekel_> lol
 10 2011-07-11 05:36:59 <mekel_> i just updated to ur newer software.. i hadnt messed with it in so long. i went from 235 m/hashs to 310
 11 2011-07-11 05:37:28 <Diablo-D3> yeah, you should update frequently
 12 2011-07-11 05:37:36 <mekel_> clearly
 13 2011-07-11 05:37:49 <mekel_> altho im new to this rejected/accepted blocks
 14 2011-07-11 05:37:59 <mekel_> im assuming a rejected block isnt worth anything?
 15 2011-07-11 05:38:29 <Diablo-D3> the pool rejected it and it didnt count
 16 2011-07-11 05:38:46 <mekel_> damn so thats wasted gpu time..
 17 2011-07-11 05:38:52 <mekel_> im getting literally almost half rejected
 18 2011-07-11 05:39:59 <mekel_> would u consider that average?
 19 2011-07-11 05:40:10 <Diablo-D3> uh, no
 20 2011-07-11 05:40:13 <Diablo-D3> what pool are you on?
 21 2011-07-11 05:40:29 <mekel_> slushs
 22 2011-07-11 05:40:33 <mekel_> api2.mining.cz
 23 2011-07-11 05:40:36 <Diablo-D3> dont use slushes.
 24 2011-07-11 05:40:43 <mekel_> relly?
 25 2011-07-11 05:40:50 <mekel_> sad face
 26 2011-07-11 05:40:53 <mekel_> hes been my fav
 27 2011-07-11 05:41:04 <Diablo-D3> he wont fix his pool to deal with the fact diablominer is awesome
 28 2011-07-11 05:41:10 <mekel_> lmao
 29 2011-07-11 05:41:20 <redhatzero> ^^
 30 2011-07-11 05:41:29 <mekel_> do u  hav an unbiased opinion on what pool works best with ur miner
 31 2011-07-11 05:42:21 <Diablo-D3> eligius seems to suck the least
 32 2011-07-11 05:42:42 <mekel_> ill check it out, thx chief
 33 2011-07-11 05:42:43 <phedny> Diablo-D3: hmm.. can you explain what's the cause of the mismatch between DM and Slushes?
 34 2011-07-11 05:43:02 <redhatzero> diablo, what's broken on slush?
 35 2011-07-11 05:43:36 <Diablo-D3> his pool has obsessive ntime checking
 36 2011-07-11 05:43:37 <slush> redhatzero: my pool reject shares with moved ntime
 37 2011-07-11 05:43:49 <Diablo-D3> but dont worry, Im going to soon "fix" it
 38 2011-07-11 05:44:01 <Diablo-D3> multiple pool support.
 39 2011-07-11 05:44:23 <mekel_> leet
 40 2011-07-11 05:44:44 <mekel_> that sux slush i hav to switch off ur pool though
 41 2011-07-11 05:44:53 <slush> ok
 42 2011-07-11 05:44:54 <mekel_> <3 ur pool
 43 2011-07-11 05:45:16 <slush> that change on diablo side is backward incompatible
 44 2011-07-11 05:45:28 <Diablo-D3> you know, adding multipool support was easier than I thought
 45 2011-07-11 05:45:43 <redhatzero> ah, i see thanks..
 46 2011-07-11 05:46:35 <mekel_> on eligius.. for "address" is it meaning my wallet id?
 47 2011-07-11 05:46:41 <Diablo-D3> yes
 48 2011-07-11 05:46:49 <mekel_> k
 49 2011-07-11 05:54:00 <mekel_> ok
 50 2011-07-11 05:54:04 <mekel_> up and mining on eligius
 51 2011-07-11 05:54:06 <mekel_> thanks
 52 2011-07-11 05:55:22 <reflect_> I'm mining 10 coins an hour
 53 2011-07-11 05:55:53 <mekel_> well
 54 2011-07-11 05:56:00 <mekel_> u should b realtively wealthy then
 55 2011-07-11 05:56:04 <mekel_> with current btc prices
 56 2011-07-11 05:56:11 <mekel_> relatively*
 57 2011-07-11 05:56:53 <mekel_> at current prices, mining 24/7
 58 2011-07-11 05:57:05 <mekel_> thats 1.26 million usd annually..
 59 2011-07-11 05:57:06 <slush> only 10 coins per hour? phew
 60 2011-07-11 05:58:25 <reflect_> mekel_: correct
 61 2011-07-11 05:58:31 <mekel_> what cards are u running reflect
 62 2011-07-11 05:59:08 <mekel_> my little brother is hashing 270m/hashes with his cheapy 5830's
 63 2011-07-11 05:59:23 <mekel_> its sad cuz i have the 5950 and i am hashing 310
 64 2011-07-11 05:59:45 <reflect_> 20 ps3s
 65 2011-07-11 05:59:53 <mekel_> what card is in a ps3
 66 2011-07-11 05:59:57 <mekel_> and that
 67 2011-07-11 06:00:03 <mekel_> is a brilliant idea..
 68 2011-07-11 06:00:08 <reflect_> and 4 mining rigs with 5870s
 69 2011-07-11 06:00:20 <mekel_> how many hashes does a single ps3 pull in?
 70 2011-07-11 06:00:22 <reflect_> + 10 of my friends corssfire 5950 rigs
 71 2011-07-11 06:00:27 <reflect_> like 300
 72 2011-07-11 06:00:39 <mekel_> not bad
 73 2011-07-11 06:00:42 <mekel_> what miner do u run
 74 2011-07-11 06:00:55 <reflect_> python
 75 2011-07-11 06:00:57 <reflect_> pocdlbm
 76 2011-07-11 06:01:06 <reflect_> modified to run on ps3
 77 2011-07-11 06:01:16 <mekel_> i see
 78 2011-07-11 06:01:24 <reflect_> also my friend runs a cpu mining farm with about 200 old shit rigs
 79 2011-07-11 06:01:30 <reflect_> each doing 1mhash/sec
 80 2011-07-11 06:01:39 <mekel_> is that effecient with electricity?
 81 2011-07-11 06:01:42 <reflect_> nope
 82 2011-07-11 06:01:52 <mekel_> lol
 83 2011-07-11 06:02:33 <molecular> mekel_, a ps3 does around 20-26 mhash/s according to https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mining_hardware_comparison, so I call bs on reflect_ "mining 10 coins per hour" using "20 ps3s"
 84 2011-07-11 06:02:55 <reflect_> molecular: firstly, wrong, secondly, 20 ps3s, 4 4870 mining rigs and 10 5950 mining rigs
 85 2011-07-11 06:02:56 <redhatzero> molecular, but he's not only using the ps3
 86 2011-07-11 06:03:17 <molecular> reflect_, what's the total hashing speed you got there
 87 2011-07-11 06:03:20 <reflect_> molecular: a ps3 may do 26 mhash/s using something shit
 88 2011-07-11 06:03:34 <reflect_> it does like 200 using a good miner
 89 2011-07-11 06:03:57 <molecular> really? that's pretty awesome taken the power consumption
 90 2011-07-11 06:04:12 <mtrlt> 200MH/s on a ps3?
 91 2011-07-11 06:04:15 <reflect_> power consumption is huge for all my rigs
 92 2011-07-11 06:04:30 <molecular> how much power does a ps3 draw mining at 200mh/s
 93 2011-07-11 06:04:32 <reflect_> since i have about 35 in total + 200 shit cpu miners I pay easily $1000 a week in electricity
 94 2011-07-11 06:04:33 <mtrlt> i'd like to see some evidence :p
 95 2011-07-11 06:04:49 <mekel_> pic!
 96 2011-07-11 06:05:15 <reflect_> and my friends set up of 25 crossfire 5870 rigs is quite beast
 97 2011-07-11 06:05:17 <reflect_> we share that too
 98 2011-07-11 06:05:26 <mekel_> where do u store all this
 99 2011-07-11 06:05:32 <reflect_> I have a warehouse
100 2011-07-11 06:05:36 <reflect_> hooked up to lots of electricity
101 2011-07-11 06:06:31 <reflect_> total cost of all the rigs was about 100k
102 2011-07-11 06:06:59 <molecular> reflect_, I don't believe a ps3 can do 200mhash/s
103 2011-07-11 06:07:04 <molecular> can you point me to some evidence?
104 2011-07-11 06:07:05 <mekel_> O_O
105 2011-07-11 06:07:18 <mekel_> 100 grand for 25 ps3's and 4 pc's?
106 2011-07-11 06:07:41 <reflect_> mekel_: 20 ps3s, about 50 pcs most of them crossfire 5870s incl my friends
107 2011-07-11 06:07:44 <reflect_> and then 200 cpu miners
108 2011-07-11 06:07:50 <sipa> why do you leave the cpus running, if you pay power yourself?
109 2011-07-11 06:07:57 <reflect_> well
110 2011-07-11 06:07:59 <reflect_> they do like
111 2011-07-11 06:08:01 <reflect_> 1000mhashes
112 2011-07-11 06:08:03 <reflect_> together
113 2011-07-11 06:08:06 <reflect_> so it's useful
114 2011-07-11 06:08:09 <sipa> so?
115 2011-07-11 06:08:13 <mekel_> u should sell them
116 2011-07-11 06:08:16 <mekel_> and reinvest in more gpus
117 2011-07-11 06:08:20 <sipa> buying btc is cheaper
118 2011-07-11 06:08:28 <reflect_> is it cheaper than 1.2 mil a year i make
119 2011-07-11 06:08:29 <sipa> than letting them run
120 2011-07-11 06:08:40 <reflect_> no
121 2011-07-11 06:08:41 <reflect_> they make
122 2011-07-11 06:08:42 <reflect_> like
123 2011-07-11 06:08:43 <reflect_> a little over
124 2011-07-11 06:08:45 <reflect_> what they cost
125 2011-07-11 06:08:48 <reflect_> in electricity
126 2011-07-11 06:08:57 <sipa> right
127 2011-07-11 06:09:07 <mekel_> how much r u charged for electricity
128 2011-07-11 06:09:19 <reflect_> they make like $15k anually and cost about $13k
129 2011-07-11 06:09:24 <reflect_> $52k annually
130 2011-07-11 06:09:37 <sipa> the cpus alone?
131 2011-07-11 06:09:42 <reflect_> no
132 2011-07-11 06:09:43 <reflect_> all
133 2011-07-11 06:09:45 <reflect_> combined
134 2011-07-11 06:09:50 <sipa> sigh
135 2011-07-11 06:10:05 <reflect_> i remember the days
136 2011-07-11 06:10:07 <reflect_> early days
137 2011-07-11 06:10:16 <mekel_> dude i remembr a couple months ago
138 2011-07-11 06:10:18 <reflect_> when i was mining with a cpu browser miner getting 2-3 coins per day
139 2011-07-11 06:10:20 <mekel_> when it was 90 cents a coin
140 2011-07-11 06:10:37 <reflect_> ya
141 2011-07-11 06:10:38 <reflect_> funny days
142 2011-07-11 06:10:41 <mekel_> i wish
143 2011-07-11 06:10:42 <reflect_> really took off
144 2011-07-11 06:10:43 <mekel_> i wish
145 2011-07-11 06:10:46 <mekel_> i wish wish wish
146 2011-07-11 06:10:52 <mekel_> i had bought lik 500 dollars worth of them
147 2011-07-11 06:11:16 <mekel_> my cousin daniel had 750, and he sold all of them at 3.47
148 2011-07-11 06:11:23 <reflect_> LOL
149 2011-07-11 06:11:28 <reflect_> crazy kid
150 2011-07-11 06:11:32 <mekel_> not a bad 3grand tho
151 2011-07-11 06:11:35 <mekel_> for doing nothing
152 2011-07-11 06:11:39 <reflect_> I had knew a guy who had like $5k of them in the beginning
153 2011-07-11 06:11:48 <reflect_> sold them for $50c ea
154 2011-07-11 06:11:49 <reflect_> $2.5 k
155 2011-07-11 06:11:52 <moa7> not nothing ... opportunity cost
156 2011-07-11 06:12:01 <reflect_> would be worth
157 2011-07-11 06:12:03 <mekel_> obviously not nothingg
158 2011-07-11 06:12:03 <reflect_> like
159 2011-07-11 06:12:04 <reflect_> today
160 2011-07-11 06:12:12 <mekel_> that was more of a figure of speach
161 2011-07-11 06:12:16 <mekel_> speech
162 2011-07-11 06:12:22 <moa7> could have bought at 30 and be stewing right now
163 2011-07-11 06:12:37 <mekel_> yep
164 2011-07-11 06:19:56 <reflect_> a buddy of mine is cpu mining with like 20 old rigs
165 2011-07-11 06:20:03 <reflect_> getting 22mhash/se
166 2011-07-11 06:20:04 <reflect_> c
167 2011-07-11 06:20:17 <reflect_> making like 0.1 btc a day
168 2011-07-11 06:20:48 <reflect_> i just give him 50  btc every now and then
169 2011-07-11 06:20:51 <reflect_> because i feel sorry for him
170 2011-07-11 06:22:03 <nus> ;;bc,gen 373000000
171 2011-07-11 06:22:04 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 373000000 Khps, given current difficulty of 1563027.9961162 , is 240.030240591 BTC per day and 10.0012600246 BTC per hour.
172 2011-07-11 06:25:35 <reflect_> that's me
173 2011-07-11 06:25:41 <reflect_> 10 btc an hour or so
174 2011-07-11 06:25:42 <reflect_> ;;bc, gen 999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
175 2011-07-11 06:25:43 <gribble> Error: "bc," is not a valid command.
176 2011-07-11 06:25:58 <reflect_> ;;bc,gen 999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
177 2011-07-11 06:25:59 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 Khps, given current difficulty of 1563027.9961162 , is 643512709359090348976314576765830175066954470366399759242213109616210621882050636017510868058112 BTC per day and (1 more message)
178 2011-07-11 06:26:13 <cuddlefish> who wants some free FTP backup space? It's from a trojan's wallet upload directory
179 2011-07-11 06:26:32 <reflect_> cuddlefish: ill give you 200 btc for 100 gb upload space
180 2011-07-11 06:26:52 <cuddlefish> don't know how much is on there
181 2011-07-11 06:26:58 <cuddlefish> probably just a crap webhosting account
182 2011-07-11 06:27:00 <cuddlefish> FTP: 213.202.225.44. User: user110258. Password: wirklich
183 2011-07-11 06:27:03 <cuddlefish> have at you
184 2011-07-11 06:27:20 <reflect_> kk
185 2011-07-11 06:27:31 <cuddlefish> and as a bonus feature, wallet.dats turn up there ocassionally
186 2011-07-11 07:11:26 <briareus> really
187 2011-07-11 07:12:53 <briareus> why offer that?
188 2011-07-11 07:14:07 <sipa> offer what?
189 2011-07-11 07:14:54 <briareus> the login there
190 2011-07-11 07:27:55 <Diablo-D3> does anyone have a url for the the x-roll-ntime spec?
191 2011-07-11 07:30:58 <Blitzboom> i think bitcoin is communism because the majority decides
192 2011-07-11 07:31:11 <Diablo-D3> then FOSS is communism
193 2011-07-11 07:33:17 <Blitzboom> its also fascism/populism because everyone just agreed with satoshis premises
194 2011-07-11 07:33:33 <Blitzboom> people who disagree are met with hostility
195 2011-07-11 07:34:33 <molecular> I don't think in communism, the majority decides.
196 2011-07-11 07:34:46 <molecular> it's "central planning"
197 2011-07-11 07:35:23 <Blitzboom> communism aimed for a classless and stateless society
198 2011-07-11 07:35:37 <Blitzboom> p2p is communism because all clients are equal
199 2011-07-11 07:35:49 <Blitzboom> all nodes
200 2011-07-11 07:37:22 <Blitzboom> mining pools are feudalism because the peasants are mining for their lords
201 2011-07-11 07:39:29 <upb> hahahhaa
202 2011-07-11 08:00:06 <Diablo-D3> [7/11/11 5:59:43 AM] DEBUG: mining.eligius.st: Enabling long poll support
203 2011-07-11 08:00:07 <Diablo-D3> [7/11/11 5:59:43 AM] DEBUG: mining.eligius.st: Enabling roll ntime support
204 2011-07-11 08:00:20 <Diablo-D3> there it actually detects if the pool sucks or not
205 2011-07-11 08:00:59 <redhatzero> that's debug output from your miner?
206 2011-07-11 08:02:04 <Namegduf> Diablo-D3: Messages do not include the word "sucks"
207 2011-07-11 08:02:08 <Namegduf> Please add for clarity
208 2011-07-11 08:02:51 <Rabbit67890> ^^
209 2011-07-11 08:03:49 <Diablo-D3> I need to remember my slushpool login
210 2011-07-11 08:17:23 <Diablo-D3> [7/11/11 6:17:03 AM] DEBUG: Attempt 1 from Cypress (#1)
211 2011-07-11 08:17:25 <Diablo-D3> ehehehehe
212 2011-07-11 08:17:26 <Diablo-D3> it works
213 2011-07-11 08:25:38 <BlueMatt> multi-pool miner?
214 2011-07-11 08:40:08 <lfm> mtgox getting ddos again?
215 2011-07-11 08:45:26 <f33x> w
216 2011-07-11 09:11:33 <kreal-> so
217 2011-07-11 09:12:03 <kreal-> Do you think it would give anything to run bitcoind, pushpoold and so on in a ram drive enviroment?
218 2011-07-11 09:13:47 <lfm> give ?
219 2011-07-11 09:13:53 <kreal-> performance wise.
220 2011-07-11 09:14:09 <kreal-> just playing.
221 2011-07-11 09:14:26 <lfm> not much, maybe a little
222 2011-07-11 09:14:43 <kreal-> it has 8gb ram to play with.
223 2011-07-11 09:14:49 <kreal-> 500mb for the ram drive.
224 2011-07-11 09:15:00 <BlueMatt> bitcoin maybe
225 2011-07-11 09:15:09 <BlueMatt> probably not much though
226 2011-07-11 09:15:13 <kreal-> nah
227 2011-07-11 09:15:18 <kreal-> but its very ram hungry.
228 2011-07-11 09:15:24 <BlueMatt> it helps a lot when first downloading the chain
229 2011-07-11 09:15:27 <BlueMatt> but after that...
230 2011-07-11 09:15:30 <lfm> make sure you have wallet backups, maybe the whole datadir backup in case of powr fails
231 2011-07-11 09:15:54 <kreal-> I rsync the folder.
232 2011-07-11 09:16:05 <BlueMatt> no, use backupwallet rpc command
233 2011-07-11 09:16:12 <kreal-> hmm
234 2011-07-11 09:16:20 <BlueMatt> rsync might copy the db in an inconsistent state
235 2011-07-11 09:16:23 <lfm> or only rsync when bitcoin(d) is not running
236 2011-07-11 09:16:28 <BlueMatt> all the files but the wallet dont matter
237 2011-07-11 09:16:34 <kreal-> yes.
238 2011-07-11 09:18:22 <BlueMatt> lol, you know xkcd just invented a new erotic fan fiction with today's comic...
239 2011-07-11 09:21:48 <kreal-> anyhow just an idea.
240 2011-07-11 09:22:22 <BlueMatt> I do it all the time when testneting to get the chain quicker, but for a node with real coins...probably not good
241 2011-07-11 09:22:34 <kreal-> probably not.
242 2011-07-11 09:27:41 <minus> <cuddlefish> [10:26:13] who wants some free FTP backup space? It's from a trojan's wallet upload directory ??? does anyone actually fall for these?
243 2011-07-11 09:27:57 <BlueMatt> minus: yes
244 2011-07-11 09:28:25 <Xunie> minus, yes, else they wouldn't exist.
245 2011-07-11 09:28:29 <sacarlson> I plan to follow and have added a copy to my release of Multicoin for this new address version spec http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_name=20110707111557.GA5231%40ulyssis.org&forum_name=bitcoin-development
246 2011-07-11 09:28:33 <minus> well as long as there's people having fun with trojan FTPs it's fine i guess
247 2011-07-11 09:30:02 <sacarlson> if I understand the spec as far as I need for alternate blocks would be to make sure that my address are over equal or grater than 16 and not 111, is this correct?
248 2011-07-11 09:31:14 <sacarlson> a no responce will be considered a yes
249 2011-07-11 09:31:22 <MrSam> :P
250 2011-07-11 09:35:44 <sipa> sacarlson: according to my proposal, you're free to choose anything that has bit 16 set
251 2011-07-11 09:36:02 <sacarlson> sipa: cool will do
252 2011-07-11 09:36:12 <sipa> so there are 128 numbers to choose from
253 2011-07-11 09:36:16 <sacarlson> sipa: sound like a good idea to me
254 2011-07-11 09:36:30 <sacarlson> sipa: plus the extended
255 2011-07-11 09:37:09 <sipa> ?
256 2011-07-11 09:37:45 <sacarlson> sipa: ** 224 = extended data class, another "data class" byte follows
257 2011-07-11 09:38:17 <sipa> sacarlson: yes, if you're talking about data that is useful in the main bitcoin chain, but is not an address or key
258 2011-07-11 09:38:23 <sacarlson> so if the code for 224 then another byte is added to provide 64k
259 2011-07-11 09:38:51 <sipa> less, actually, since the first is always 224
260 2011-07-11 09:39:39 <sacarlson> sipa: well then I will random pick one of the alternate address as an extended code to provide for expansion
261 2011-07-11 09:39:52 <CIA-103> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * r63d5dbb / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Multiple pool support, use commas - http://bit.ly/reapOO https://github.com/Diablo-D3/DiabloMiner/commit/63d5dbb9732c6253cde2ae962aa2ae456f4ce02f
262 2011-07-11 09:40:05 <sipa> sure, you can define extensions within the private range as well
263 2011-07-11 09:41:17 <sacarlson> sipa: oh you defin private if bit 5 is set?
264 2011-07-11 09:41:29 <sacarlson> sipa: as you call it 16
265 2011-07-11 09:42:16 <sacarlson> opps brain fart  ** 128 = private key
266 2011-07-11 09:43:16 <sacarlson> so binary 10000000
267 2011-07-11 09:43:16 <sipa> valid "private" version numbers would be: 16-31, 48-63, 144-159, 176-191, ...
268 2011-07-11 09:43:33 <sipa> (nVersion & 0x10) should be nonzero
269 2011-07-11 09:44:31 <sacarlson> ok so my present selected 243 is a 11110011 that falls into the private class
270 2011-07-11 09:45:08 <sipa> indeed
271 2011-07-11 09:46:09 <sacarlson> sipa: I guess that I'm safe to play there then for now and figure out an extended spec at some later time
272 2011-07-11 09:46:34 <sipa> sure
273 2011-07-11 09:46:56 <sacarlson> sipa: ok thank you sir
274 2011-07-11 09:47:18 <sipa> don't call me that
275 2011-07-11 09:47:20 <sipa> :)
276 2011-07-11 09:47:37 <sacarlson> sipa: oh grate one
277 2011-07-11 09:48:00 <sacarlson> sipa: just kiding
278 2011-07-11 09:48:02 <sipa> ok, that's fine, as long as it's not spelled 'great'
279 2011-07-11 09:48:38 <sacarlson> sipa: no I'm not a great speller I'm a grate grate speller
280 2011-07-11 09:58:00 <sacarlson> sipa: oh I think I have a better understanding of ** 224 = extended data class so with this we are still only define at most 510 address
281 2011-07-11 09:58:57 <sipa> depends, but the 'extended' thing is not really well specified now
282 2011-07-11 09:59:10 <sacarlson> sipa: ok
283 2011-07-11 09:59:26 <sipa> you could say that when both data class is 224, and version is 14, you get 2 extra bytes
284 2011-07-11 10:00:06 <sacarlson> sipa: ya extended extended
285 2011-07-11 10:03:22 <sacarlson> sipa: and to make it almost  infinite 224 and version is 15 your next is byte could be number of extra bytes to add
286 2011-07-11 10:03:53 <sipa> haha, possibly
287 2011-07-11 10:04:32 <sacarlson> ok I'll stick that in my docs page of multicoin to make sure people don't think there will be a finite number
288 2011-07-11 10:04:38 <lfm> http://xkcd.com/743/
289 2011-07-11 10:12:06 <upb> lol multicoin
290 2011-07-11 10:15:19 <sacarlson> upb: ya I got my multicoin-qt working now too with qt gui base
291 2011-07-11 10:16:34 <manveru> multicoin?
292 2011-07-11 10:19:22 <sacarlson> manveru: http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=24209.0 https://github.com/sacarlson/MultiCoin-qt
293 2011-07-11 10:43:06 <phungus> does bitcoin using proxy take into account possible latencies? I think I've noticed that since I enabled the proxy config, my hashing stops for around 20-30 seconds with Connection problems.
294 2011-07-11 10:43:13 <phungus> maybe no way to pre-fetch the next work
295 2011-07-11 10:43:29 <phungus> I only noticed because my GPU fan got quieter all of a sudden. :-)
296 2011-07-11 10:43:57 <phungus> price to pay for TOR anonymity?
297 2011-07-11 10:47:04 <sipa> you're talking about bitcoin or about miners?
298 2011-07-11 10:49:24 <cdecker> Why would you mine through TOR?
299 2011-07-11 10:49:39 <lfm> tor adds latency so ya it might pause when getting work
300 2011-07-11 10:51:38 <lfm> phungus: cdecker has a point tho, I dont see why youd use tor for that
301 2011-07-11 10:52:04 <Eliel_> phungus: if you really insist on using a proxy like that, running 2 or more miners at the same time might reduce the problem. Hopefully enough.
302 2011-07-11 10:52:07 <phungus> no, not mining
303 2011-07-11 10:52:09 <phungus> hmm
304 2011-07-11 10:52:18 <phungus> you know, I just confused the two
305 2011-07-11 10:52:27 <phungus> guiminer/bitcoin client, sorry
306 2011-07-11 10:52:45 <phungus> was weird, both btcguild and deepbit connections went down for 30seconds but everything else was fine
307 2011-07-11 10:53:19 <phungus> I changed my actual client to use TOR but I don't mine with it. it's early for me. :-)
308 2011-07-11 10:54:27 <lfm> ok, ya pool servers might have problems for any number of reasons
309 2011-07-11 10:55:13 <phungus> yeah, I just don't know why they both went down at the same time
310 2011-07-11 10:55:48 <phungus> my ssh connections were all working, internet fine, web surfing was fine. :-)
311 2011-07-11 10:55:57 <lfm> maybe both are being ddosed by the same bad guy
312 2011-07-11 10:56:04 <phungus> yik if so
313 2011-07-11 10:56:27 <phungus> they came back up within 30 sec to a minute
314 2011-07-11 10:56:36 <lfm> only a test run?
315 2011-07-11 10:56:46 <phungus> I don't know, been mining this way fine for weeks
316 2011-07-11 10:57:09 <phungus> was just really strange to hear my fans go quiet all of a sudden. :-)
317 2011-07-11 10:57:17 <lfm> worry if it happens again
318 2011-07-11 10:57:21 <phungus> yup
319 2011-07-11 10:57:24 <phungus> thx
320 2011-07-11 11:07:41 <phungus> shit, there it went again
321 2011-07-11 11:07:44 <phungus> just now
322 2011-07-11 11:07:57 <phungus> Connection problems to both deepbit and btc
323 2011-07-11 11:08:25 <kinlo> there are other pools :)
324 2011-07-11 11:08:32 <phungus> yeah I know
325 2011-07-11 11:08:45 <phungus> but this is strange that two of the biggest would go down at the exact same time
326 2011-07-11 11:09:01 <kinlo> did you test the others too then?
327 2011-07-11 11:09:21 <phungus> no, not yet
328 2011-07-11 11:09:36 <phungus> hmm, btc web page is up but they say occassional problems with equipment
329 2011-07-11 11:09:43 <phungus> deepbit.net is timing out over the web though
330 2011-07-11 11:09:53 <phungus> maybe they are both being DDOS'd
331 2011-07-11 11:09:58 <phungus> that sux
332 2011-07-11 11:10:07 <phungus> yah time to find a new pool. :-)
333 2011-07-11 11:12:27 <phungus> and now Deepbit is coming back up
334 2011-07-11 11:12:59 <reflect_> I make 10 btc an hour
335 2011-07-11 11:13:22 <reflect_> guys
336 2011-07-11 11:15:46 <sacarlson> does John Tobey hang out here or anyone ever use bitcoin-abe?
337 2011-07-11 11:24:18 <pakiaries> hi
338 2011-07-11 11:28:58 <sipa> BlueMatt: showwallet is rebased against newenc+cbitcoinaddress now
339 2011-07-11 11:30:57 <sipa> no check for encryption though, and haven't tested it
340 2011-07-11 11:31:13 <sipa> i suppose it will just fail to include "sec" fields in a dump, if the wallet is locked
341 2011-07-11 11:32:04 <pakiaries> Hi
342 2011-07-11 11:32:58 <CIA-103> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * rbc698ab / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Yeah, its not like you've written stupid code before too - http://bit.ly/puUE2K https://github.com/Diablo-D3/DiabloMiner/commit/bc698abfa186705538f34b49ecdbdf363390fb6c
343 2011-07-11 11:35:53 <pakiaries> repaired
344 2011-07-11 11:37:05 <phantomcircuit> i just realized something
345 2011-07-11 11:37:59 <phantomcircuit> on mtgox you can place a buy with 5 places after the decimal
346 2011-07-11 11:38:08 <phantomcircuit> and your account balance is stored with 5 places after the decimal
347 2011-07-11 11:38:22 <Diablo-D3> it is now, yes
348 2011-07-11 11:38:22 <phantomcircuit> so there is necessarily rounding occurring in the order fulfillment
349 2011-07-11 11:38:31 <Diablo-D3> phantomcircuit: yup
350 2011-07-11 11:38:35 <phantomcircuit> that's retarded
351 2011-07-11 11:38:37 <Diablo-D3> but it always rounds in a way that makes tux money
352 2011-07-11 11:38:47 <sipa> phantomcircuit: how would you do it?
353 2011-07-11 11:38:53 <Diablo-D3> sipa: are you retarded?
354 2011-07-11 11:38:53 <sipa> store everything using exact fractions?
355 2011-07-11 11:39:03 <Diablo-D3> BTC is an integer currency.
356 2011-07-11 11:39:05 <Diablo-D3> no floats.
357 2011-07-11 11:39:19 <infinitevs> lol
358 2011-07-11 11:39:19 <sipa> there are divisions going on when you do a trade
359 2011-07-11 11:39:34 <phantomcircuit> sipa, store balances with twice the prevision allowed in orders
360 2011-07-11 11:39:56 <phantomcircuit> it makes a small amount of your balance un-tradeable, but never rounds
361 2011-07-11 11:40:38 <sipa> you can do that for either BTC or USD, but not both
362 2011-07-11 11:40:52 <BlueMatt> sipa: very nice, now we just need a bit more ack on newenc and can get started on the pull-mania
363 2011-07-11 11:40:53 <infinitevs> what
364 2011-07-11 11:41:02 <sipa> phantomcircuit: wait, i'm not sure
365 2011-07-11 11:41:40 <phantomcircuit> sipa, you can do that for either of them
366 2011-07-11 11:41:43 <sipa> BlueMatt: just look at the commit list of pull req 220 (now closed)
367 2011-07-11 11:42:06 <CIA-103> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * rd1022aa / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Fix up the X-Switch-To code - http://bit.ly/qMuNow https://github.com/Diablo-D3/DiabloMiner/commit/d1022aad1c69ec1aad059737bce6b99a52181a6b
368 2011-07-11 11:42:16 <phantomcircuit> sipa, lets say i store balances with 8 places after the decimal and only allow trades with 4
369 2011-07-11 11:42:27 <phantomcircuit> i would never have to round anything ever
370 2011-07-11 11:43:26 <sipa> you need another 4 decimals for mtgox's *0.9935
371 2011-07-11 11:43:43 <sipa> but i guess you're right
372 2011-07-11 11:44:17 <phantomcircuit> yeah the problem is that the precision of the balance has to be the precision of the orders ^2
373 2011-07-11 11:45:05 <sipa> it needs to be precision of the amount + precision of the exchange rate + 4 :)
374 2011-07-11 11:45:18 <sipa> (precision being a number of digits)
375 2011-07-11 11:45:52 <BlueMatt> sipa: nice
376 2011-07-11 11:46:18 <phantomcircuit> sipa, +4?
377 2011-07-11 11:46:25 <phantomcircuit> sipa, why +4
378 2011-07-11 11:47:18 <sipa> phantomcircuit: for the fee
379 2011-07-11 11:47:23 <phantomcircuit> oh
380 2011-07-11 11:47:32 <phantomcircuit> hadn't thought of that at all
381 2011-07-11 11:49:17 <sipa> BlueMatt: i'm still not sure how to deal with encrypted wallets, though
382 2011-07-11 11:49:33 <sipa> i like to keep the dump format free from implementation-specific things
383 2011-07-11 11:49:54 <phantomcircuit> for($i=0;$i<100000;$i++)
384 2011-07-11 11:49:55 <phantomcircuit> crap
385 2011-07-11 11:49:59 <phantomcircuit> that's a big off by 1 error
386 2011-07-11 11:50:34 <BlueMatt> sipa: well either unlock the wallet, or new implementation to dump them in encrypted forms...
387 2011-07-11 11:50:40 <BlueMatt> personally, I prefer encrypted dumps
388 2011-07-11 11:50:59 <sipa> i see the use for encrypted dumps
389 2011-07-11 11:51:26 <BlueMatt> people can just as easily write the password on the paper...
390 2011-07-11 11:51:33 <sipa> but i don't like including a very implementation-specific thing
391 2011-07-11 11:51:46 <sipa> and the encryption is very specific
392 2011-07-11 11:51:59 <BlueMatt> ...true
393 2011-07-11 11:52:19 <BlueMatt> well its not hard to include the derivation method parameters in the dump of the master key
394 2011-07-11 11:52:39 <sipa> for now: meh
395 2011-07-11 11:52:50 <dsockwell> how will encrypted wallets affect headless installations?
396 2011-07-11 11:53:08 <sipa> dsockwell: there are rpc calls for unlocking
397 2011-07-11 11:53:25 <dsockwell> ok
398 2011-07-11 11:53:41 <BlueMatt> my idea of a dump is effectively just what bitcointools outputs in a much better format...
399 2011-07-11 11:53:54 <sipa> indeed
400 2011-07-11 11:54:04 <dsockwell> any progress on the i/o monstrosity?
401 2011-07-11 11:54:09 <sipa> ?
402 2011-07-11 11:54:40 <dsockwell> am i interrupting?  sorry.
403 2011-07-11 11:54:48 <sipa> no, please ask
404 2011-07-11 11:54:57 <BlueMatt> well theres an addr.dat fix which should help a ton
405 2011-07-11 11:55:10 <dsockwell> ok, i've noticed that big wallets produce lots of sync writes
406 2011-07-11 11:55:24 <dsockwell> not sure if i'm still using the newest version
407 2011-07-11 11:55:33 <BlueMatt> 0.3.24?
408 2011-07-11 11:55:43 <sipa> that fix isn't merged yet
409 2011-07-11 11:55:46 <dsockwell> but i measured a wallet with 7k addresses doing 200k i/o operations when pulling transactions via rpc
410 2011-07-11 11:55:48 <BlueMatt> dont think theres much in terms of fixes yet
411 2011-07-11 11:56:06 <dsockwell> with enough sync writes to hang my server
412 2011-07-11 11:56:32 <dsockwell> so my solution has been to throw it in a ramdisk and wait for a fix
413 2011-07-11 11:58:12 <dsockwell> and that can be made to work out fine, even for production, but still
414 2011-07-11 11:58:47 <sipa> also, the fix is for the ip addresses db, right?
415 2011-07-11 11:58:51 <sipa> not for wallets
416 2011-07-11 11:58:55 <BlueMatt> yea, more are needed
417 2011-07-11 11:59:05 <BlueMatt> though wallet shouldnt be doing much
418 2011-07-11 12:05:15 <dsockwell> i didn't measure exactly what files the i/o was targeting, so i can't say it was wallet itself, I only presumed so because of the large transaction number
419 2011-07-11 12:06:01 <BlueMatt> probably addr and blocks
420 2011-07-11 12:08:56 <lfm> dsockwell: get a ssd
421 2011-07-11 12:09:10 <dsockwell> lfm: wasnt' helpful the last time you said that
422 2011-07-11 12:09:24 <dsockwell> either
423 2011-07-11 12:09:37 <lfm> oh you tried it?
424 2011-07-11 12:09:49 <BlueMatt> lfm: get an ssd isnt a reasonable answer
425 2011-07-11 12:09:53 <BlueMatt> or requirement to run the client
426 2011-07-11 12:09:55 <dsockwell> no i didnt', i'm not going to shell out for hardware just because of inefficient software
427 2011-07-11 12:10:11 <dsockwell> besides, i mention I already crammed it in a tmpfs
428 2011-07-11 12:10:19 <dsockwell> which works fine
429 2011-07-11 12:12:38 <lfm> wasnt trying to say it was a requirement, just that it would speed things up.
430 2011-07-11 12:13:12 <BlueMatt> which is an unreasonable answer to any tech support question
431 2011-07-11 12:13:17 <dsockwell> that's the definition of throwing hardware at a software problem, though, isn't it?
432 2011-07-11 12:13:59 <lfm> Sorry, it is unreasonable to make a suggestion which would speed things up when the complaint seems to be that they are slow?
433 2011-07-11 12:14:12 <WildSoil> tfm is down ?
434 2011-07-11 12:14:27 <dsockwell> anyway i should reiterate that it isn't a crisis for me and I was just curious.
435 2011-07-11 12:16:18 <lfm> and I am also sorry that I forgot I already made the suggestion, my memory aint what it used to be
436 2011-07-11 12:17:19 <TD> dsockwell: i think that will be the addr.dat file
437 2011-07-11 12:17:25 <TD> you could try merging the fix and see if it helps
438 2011-07-11 12:22:47 <lfm> how long a period was the 200k i/o ops?
439 2011-07-11 12:23:36 <dsockwell> it was 200k i/o
440 2011-07-11 12:23:44 <dsockwell> so on my disks about 200 seconds
441 2011-07-11 12:23:59 <dsockwell> every time i asked for transactions
442 2011-07-11 12:24:20 <devon_hillard> ok, is anyone actually making a profit from GPU mining? :)
443 2011-07-11 12:24:28 <WildSoil> yes me
444 2011-07-11 12:24:32 <WildSoil> 1 dollar in month
445 2011-07-11 12:24:38 <devon_hillard> what does electricity cost you?
446 2011-07-11 12:24:46 <WildSoil> dunno
447 2011-07-11 12:24:59 <WakiMiko> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J86wrsiR79M i lold
448 2011-07-11 12:25:08 <devon_hillard> it doesn't count if you use 'free' electricity
449 2011-07-11 12:25:11 <lfm> devon_hillard: I dont think I am since the price dropped
450 2011-07-11 12:25:15 <WakiMiko> also this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUH0JpLWKuI
451 2011-07-11 12:25:21 <TD> dsockwell: ok that sounds bogus
452 2011-07-11 12:25:30 <TD> dsockwell: how big is the wallet?
453 2011-07-11 12:25:44 <dsockwell> it was about 7k-10k addresses
454 2011-07-11 12:26:00 <TD> with many transactions associated with each ?
455 2011-07-11 12:26:05 <dsockwell> no, just one
456 2011-07-11 12:26:09 <dsockwell> or two
457 2011-07-11 12:26:45 <dsockwell> also it was testnet if that means anything
458 2011-07-11 12:27:16 <devon_hillard> ;bc,calc 65000
459 2011-07-11 12:27:19 <lfm> ok ya testnet should have a lot less activity on addr.dat
460 2011-07-11 12:27:49 <superman2016> hi
461 2011-07-11 12:27:54 <lfm> hi
462 2011-07-11 12:32:52 <lfm> dsockwell: so wallet.dat is about 10mb?
463 2011-07-11 12:44:39 <Graet> devon_hillard i am and electricity cost me 10caud /Kw/h off peak and 21c onpeak
464 2011-07-11 12:48:09 <lfm> graet what gpu are you using?
465 2011-07-11 12:48:26 <Graet> 11 x 6950 and a 6870
466 2011-07-11 13:21:58 <luke-jr> jgarzik: cpuminer should probably disable scantime or change its default when LP is supported IMO
467 2011-07-11 13:23:48 <pakiaries> hello
468 2011-07-11 13:24:46 <BlueHelix> what can I do to get updated from sourceforge when there is a new release ? is there any RSS ?
469 2011-07-11 13:37:23 <pakiaries> hi
470 2011-07-11 13:47:59 <pakiaries> hello
471 2011-07-11 13:48:15 <pakiaries> hi
472 2011-07-11 13:51:53 <pakiaries> .
473 2011-07-11 14:13:51 <Ramen> ;;bc,stats
474 2011-07-11 14:13:53 <gribble> Current Blocks: 135786 | Current Difficulty: 1563027.9961162 | Next Difficulty At Block: 137087 | Next Difficulty In: 1301 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 1 day, 18 hours, 19 minutes, and 42 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1613890.01506010
475 2011-07-11 14:20:26 <klikklak_> any fpga people around? is there any existing code communicating over jtag? ie. there is pyfpgaminer, but that uses serial. I'd like to see if it can be made for jtag
476 2011-07-11 14:34:39 <Sacrotes> Any of you guys got a work around for db-5.2?
477 2011-07-11 14:37:34 <pakiaries> hello
478 2011-07-11 14:37:34 <superman2015> hello
479 2011-07-11 14:37:45 <Sacrotes> Er.. Hey
480 2011-07-11 14:37:45 <superman2015> hello
481 2011-07-11 14:37:58 <infinitev> lol
482 2011-07-11 14:38:38 <luke-jr> I hate this 100-depth minimum to spend coinbase outputs -.-
483 2011-07-11 14:41:44 <superman2016> /msg nickserv identify superman2016 Bunder99
484 2011-07-11 14:46:09 <Sacrotes> And now we have you pass..
485 2011-07-11 14:46:33 <copumpkin> a good one, too
486 2011-07-11 14:46:48 <BlueMatt> hes not here btw
487 2011-07-11 14:46:48 <Sacrotes> Seems the official bitcoin client is linked to db-5.1 He has an account on roblox..
488 2011-07-11 14:46:53 <Sacrotes> Damn :(
489 2011-07-11 14:47:19 <Sacrotes> Myspace..
490 2011-07-11 14:47:27 <Sacrotes> http://www.myspace.com/superman2016
491 2011-07-11 14:47:32 <copumpkin> I know
492 2011-07-11 14:47:36 <Sacrotes> I wonder if that's him.
493 2011-07-11 14:47:45 <copumpkin> try logging in and see, duh
494 2011-07-11 14:47:57 <Sacrotes> It takes an email..
495 2011-07-11 14:51:00 <Daviey> nice.
496 2011-07-11 14:53:15 <Sacrotes> .. Superman. I can see you
497 2011-07-11 14:53:21 <Sacrotes> He's gone again
498 2011-07-11 14:53:22 <Sacrotes> Right
499 2011-07-11 14:54:20 <marvin_> ;;bc,stats
500 2011-07-11 14:54:24 <gribble> Current Blocks: 135786 | Current Difficulty: 1563027.9961162 | Next Difficulty At Block: 137087 | Next Difficulty In: 1301 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 1 day, 18 hours, 19 minutes, and 42 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1613890.01506010
501 2011-07-11 14:58:33 <upb> is the guy who makes http://mtgoxlive.com/orders?volumeon here ?
502 2011-07-11 14:58:41 <upb> i wonder wwhy the depth is lagging
503 2011-07-11 14:58:54 <upb> showing 1k @ 14.25 atm
504 2011-07-11 14:59:43 <upb> comboy: are you using the cached depth stuff ? i believe they fixed depth websocket
505 2011-07-11 15:05:52 <jgarzik> luke-jr: cpuminer already does that
506 2011-07-11 15:06:16 <luke-jr> jgarzik: oh, I couldn't find it in the code&
507 2011-07-11 15:07:45 <luke-jr> jgarzik: would you accept patches to support X-Roll-Ntime and noncerange?
508 2011-07-11 15:08:47 <nanotube> luke-jr: what's the incremenal cost in bytes of expanding the coinbase transaction from X to X+1 outputs?
509 2011-07-11 15:09:43 <jgarzik> luke-jr: yes
510 2011-07-11 15:10:12 <luke-jr> nanotube: less than using a separate sendmany
511 2011-07-11 15:10:28 <lfm> nanotube: I think its about 50-60 bytes
512 2011-07-11 15:11:09 <knotwork> Does any code actually *check* how many coins miners are giving themselves in the coinbase transactions?
513 2011-07-11 15:11:25 <lfm> knotwork: yes
514 2011-07-11 15:11:26 <nanotube> luke-jr: lfm: thanks
515 2011-07-11 15:11:43 <nanotube> knotwork: if it didn't, we'd have a few bitcoin billionaires already :D
516 2011-07-11 15:12:07 <knotwork> Interesting because Unthinkingbit's try at making groupcoin-qt was creating errors instead of valid coinbase transactions
517 2011-07-11 15:12:29 <knotwork> yet was able to just keep mining them endlessly without ever realising no one was getting any coins
518 2011-07-11 15:12:49 <knotwork> I guess he must have hacked out whatever was meant to be checking the number of coins
519 2011-07-11 15:13:21 <knotwork> or, bitcoin-qt itself already had hacked that out before he forked it to start trying to make groupcoin-qt from it
520 2011-07-11 15:13:49 <lfm> knotwork: could be the code doesnt check block it made itself since it trusts itself to make good blocks. The other nodes definatly check tho and would reject bad ones
521 2011-07-11 15:14:35 <knotwork> I had to run at least two instances to make it mine at all. they obviously didnt check each others blocks
522 2011-07-11 15:14:50 <knotwork> not for error in coinbase transaction anyway
523 2011-07-11 15:15:09 <knotwork> unless in fact the code for checking made identical error so was actually checking the error was there
524 2011-07-11 15:15:57 <lfm> knotwork: Really? Ya, run one node with standard code
525 2011-07-11 15:16:00 <luke-jr> knotwork: it only fails if they give themselves TOO MANY
526 2011-07-11 15:16:14 <luke-jr> knotwork: it allows you to make a block with too few
527 2011-07-11 15:16:34 <knotwork> aha well cannot stop people throwing away coins I guess so if they want to give themselves none thats fine
528 2011-07-11 15:18:05 <luke-jr> midnightmagic was silly and generated 4999999999
529 2011-07-11 15:18:10 <luke-jr> on mainnet
530 2011-07-11 16:50:48 <pakimon> hello
531 2011-07-11 16:54:42 <kinlo> if someone would do a transaction, they send the public key of their bitcoin key together with the signature, prooving that they have the private key in the transaction, to proove that they are authorized to to this transaction.  If someone else would then do a second transaction with a different public key (which hashes to the same bitcoin address), what will the btc-client do upon a new public key?
532 2011-07-11 16:55:10 <pakimon> hello
533 2011-07-11 16:58:10 <luke-jr> kinlo: that's a collision, which Bitcoin assumes is impossible
534 2011-07-11 16:58:33 <luke-jr> kinlo: if you start getting collisions, the block chain implodes :P
535 2011-07-11 16:58:58 <gmaxwell> kinlo: It would just work with the current code, I believe. They'd both just be taken to be valid.
536 2011-07-11 16:59:35 <gmaxwell> It doesn't 'remember' the public key in any meaningful way it's either in the input, or it's in the transaction spending the input.
537 2011-07-11 16:59:58 <BlueMatt> well unless they are both solving the same txout
538 2011-07-11 17:02:37 <gmaxwell> Well sure, but the first one would just win there. No? I think it would just be the same as a normal double spend.
539 2011-07-11 17:03:17 <BlueMatt> yep
540 2011-07-11 17:03:59 <kinlo> ofcourse it is just an hypotethical question, as collisions are normally never going to happen
541 2011-07-11 17:04:46 <BlueMatt> well in this particular case, it doesnt really matter
542 2011-07-11 17:05:10 <kinlo> sure, if you have this kind of bad luck, then you just have bad luck :)
543 2011-07-11 17:05:11 <gmaxwell> Right, nothing breaks except perhaps the wealth of the person the collision allows you to rob.
544 2011-07-11 17:05:48 <gmaxwell> And if someone comes up with some way of producing pairs of colliding keys at will, (but not colliding anyone else) then I think nothing breaks.
545 2011-07-11 17:09:19 <kreal-> whats the testnet block size ?
546 2011-07-11 17:09:44 <kinlo> block size?  it's like the regular network: depends on the transactions
547 2011-07-11 17:09:58 <kinlo> you mean difficulty?
548 2011-07-11 17:10:05 <kreal-> so 135798  ?
549 2011-07-11 17:10:13 <kinlo> ?
550 2011-07-11 17:10:22 <kreal-> block count*
551 2011-07-11 17:10:26 <kinlo> ah block count
552 2011-07-11 17:10:31 <kinlo> lemme look that up for you
553 2011-07-11 17:10:38 <kreal-> where would you do that?
554 2011-07-11 17:11:19 <kinlo> about 30K
555 2011-07-11 17:11:39 <kinlo> my test client hasn't downloaded latest blocks so I can't give acurate number
556 2011-07-11 17:11:50 <kreal-> do 52696 sound about right?
557 2011-07-11 17:11:57 <kinlo> nah
558 2011-07-11 17:12:00 <kinlo> too much
559 2011-07-11 17:12:12 <kinlo> "blocks" : 30491,
560 2011-07-11 17:12:13 <kinlo> "connections" : 8,
561 2011-07-11 17:12:14 <kreal-> 30491
562 2011-07-11 17:12:17 <kreal-> youre right$
563 2011-07-11 17:12:19 <kreal-> thanks.
564 2011-07-11 17:13:02 <kinlo> but nobody mines at testnet so the number doesn't increase that much
565 2011-07-11 17:13:17 <kreal-> ok
566 2011-07-11 17:16:21 <kreal-> im building something wonderfull :)
567 2011-07-11 17:17:22 <kinlo> what? :)
568 2011-07-11 17:17:32 <kreal-> a secret for now sorry.
569 2011-07-11 17:18:13 <kinlo> it's not really a secret if you tell something
570 2011-07-11 17:18:21 <kinlo> and if you tell something, you must tell more :p
571 2011-07-11 17:18:21 <kreal-> ok
572 2011-07-11 17:18:42 <kreal-> it involves bitcoins
573 2011-07-11 17:20:18 <kinlo> no
574 2011-07-11 17:20:24 <kinlo> you're lying
575 2011-07-11 17:20:34 <kinlo> you're working on a project related to bitcoins????
576 2011-07-11 17:20:47 <kinlo> I can't believe it!
577 2011-07-11 17:20:48 <kinlo> :p
578 2011-07-11 17:21:02 <kreal-> I kid you not.
579 2011-07-11 17:21:17 <kinlo> :)
580 2011-07-11 17:22:14 <sipa> ;;bc,blocks
581 2011-07-11 17:22:15 <gribble> 135793
582 2011-07-11 17:22:35 <sipa> eh, i'm at 135799
583 2011-07-11 17:23:04 <kinlo> so am I
584 2011-07-11 17:23:09 <kinlo> gribble is behind
585 2011-07-11 17:23:10 <ThomasV> kreal-: it involves the same kind of bitcoins as in satoshi's paper ?
586 2011-07-11 17:24:15 <sipa> anyone know how to split a commit in two in git?
587 2011-07-11 17:24:43 <kinlo> is it your last commit?
588 2011-07-11 17:24:50 <kinlo> or did you do commits on top of it?
589 2011-07-11 17:25:01 <sipa> oh, i just found the section "splitting commits" in man git-rebase
590 2011-07-11 17:25:25 <kinlo> if it's your last commit it is easyer
591 2011-07-11 17:25:42 <kinlo> is blockexplorer down?
592 2011-07-11 17:25:45 <sipa> it is, actually
593 2011-07-11 17:25:54 <kinlo> sipa: type git reset --soft HEAD^
594 2011-07-11 17:26:02 <kinlo> that undoes the last commit
595 2011-07-11 17:26:42 <kinlo> but only the 'commit' part, so the changes you have staged to do that commit become again staged as if you would have typed everything except the final git commit
596 2011-07-11 17:26:52 <sipa> yes, i see
597 2011-07-11 17:26:53 <Ramen> ;;bc,stats
598 2011-07-11 17:26:56 <gribble> Current Blocks: 135793 | Current Difficulty: 1563027.9961162 | Next Difficulty At Block: 137087 | Next Difficulty In: 1294 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 1 day, 17 hours, 54 minutes, and 56 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1607018.66395394
599 2011-07-11 17:27:07 <sipa> comparable to what is described on that man page, only not within a rebase
600 2011-07-11 17:27:17 <sipa> reset the HEAD, but leave the working tree the same
601 2011-07-11 17:27:25 <sipa> thanks
602 2011-07-11 17:33:18 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: has Gavin reappeared, and commented on wallet enc?
603 2011-07-11 17:33:47 <sipa> not afaik
604 2011-07-11 17:34:34 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: no
605 2011-07-11 17:35:06 <TD_> jgarzik: any idea where gavin is? he seems to have retreated from bitcoin lately
606 2011-07-11 17:35:24 <BlueMatt> Australia
607 2011-07-11 17:35:26 <jgarzik> TD: month-long trip to Australia
608 2011-07-11 17:35:29 <TD> oh, wow
609 2011-07-11 17:35:30 <TD> nice
610 2011-07-11 17:35:42 <jgarzik> TD: said Internet would be spotty for a few days, then would be back online with reliable internet
611 2011-07-11 17:35:58 <BlueMatt> s/a few days/a week or so/
612 2011-07-11 17:36:00 <sipa> until wednesday, iirc
613 2011-07-11 17:36:01 <BlueMatt> (IIRC)
614 2011-07-11 17:36:27 <sipa> he was planning to work on the test framework
615 2011-07-11 17:36:42 <BlueMatt> and the headers-only branch
616 2011-07-11 17:37:27 <sipa> jgarzik: what's your opinion about anti-compatibility with bitcoin versions not supporting wallet encryption?
617 2011-07-11 17:38:14 <senseles> it would be really cool if the program supported at least some basic form of encryption for the wallet
618 2011-07-11 17:38:17 <senseles> maybe optional
619 2011-07-11 17:38:24 <senseles> allow users to enter a password when they run the program
620 2011-07-11 17:38:42 <jgarzik> sipa: you mean BlueMatt's latest patch, to intentionally corrupt and crash wallets?
621 2011-07-11 17:39:01 <sipa> jgarzik: well just, there are two options: either matt's fix now, or rename wallets
622 2011-07-11 17:39:16 <BlueMatt> or nothing, but thats bad too
623 2011-07-11 17:39:23 <BlueMatt> worse than the two
624 2011-07-11 17:39:46 <sipa> nothing: wallet gets into mixed state, confuses user, no automated recovery
625 2011-07-11 17:39:49 <jgarzik> sipa: at the moment, I like the "corrupt old wallet" option...  renaming is a bit of a pain with bdb
626 2011-07-11 17:40:09 <sipa> matt's fix: confuse user, but wallet is never harmed
627 2011-07-11 17:40:17 <sipa> indeed
628 2011-07-11 17:40:50 <BlueMatt> well all of the fixes confuse the user
629 2011-07-11 17:41:15 <sipa> jgarzik: so, ACK for encryption?
630 2011-07-11 17:41:48 <jgarzik> sipa: I want to see what is Gavin's opinion, and read the code a bit more first
631 2011-07-11 17:42:10 <sipa> ok, sure
632 2011-07-11 17:43:24 <sipa> last i heard, gavin liked the wallet renaming idea, but that was before the possibility of "safe corruption" was known
633 2011-07-11 17:45:50 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: has anyone run the stats on uptake of 0.3.24?
634 2011-07-11 17:45:58 <jgarzik> gmaxwell?
635 2011-07-11 17:46:12 <BlueMatt> I have them...let me go check
636 2011-07-11 17:46:27 <BlueMatt> last I checked it wasnt good
637 2011-07-11 17:46:50 <gmaxwell> lets see.. my high connection node has
638 2011-07-11 17:46:55 <BlueMatt> kinda think alert might be necessary...
639 2011-07-11 17:47:00 <gmaxwell> lemme restart it and see how big a flash mob I get.
640 2011-07-11 17:47:17 <Blitzboom> does anyone besides satoshi have an alert key?
641 2011-07-11 17:47:24 <BlueMatt> Blitzboom: gavin
642 2011-07-11 17:47:38 <Blitzboom> also, how does an alert look like?
643 2011-07-11 17:47:39 <BlueMatt> 32400
644 2011-07-11 17:47:45 <Blitzboom> pop up in bitcoin with msg?
645 2011-07-11 17:48:20 <BlueMatt> Blitzboom: its in the status bar
646 2011-07-11 17:48:35 <BlueMatt> Blitzboom: and can also put you in safe mode which prevents sending
647 2011-07-11 17:48:39 <BlueMatt> and a ton of stuff
648 2011-07-11 17:48:45 <BlueMatt> check rpc.cpp for allowedinsafemode
649 2011-07-11 17:48:46 <Blitzboom> WTF
650 2011-07-11 17:48:48 <WakiMiko_> steal your wallet, etc.
651 2011-07-11 17:48:49 <gmaxwell> At the moment I'd be kind of disinclined for an alert. There are a number of other improvements we could get in during the next month...
652 2011-07-11 17:48:50 <Blitzboom> that worries me
653 2011-07-11 17:48:55 <jrmithdobbs> gmaxwell: i'm seeing 80+ on mine since i put the block download fix in place
654 2011-07-11 17:48:59 <BlueMatt> Blitzboom: you can override alerts
655 2011-07-11 17:49:02 <jrmithdobbs> without any other code fixes
656 2011-07-11 17:49:13 <BlueMatt> yes
657 2011-07-11 17:49:17 <gmaxwell> jrmithdobbs: yea, well, mine gets more because its uncapped and joins all the irc channels.
658 2011-07-11 17:49:19 <jrmithdobbs> gmaxwell: but it's still just .23 + block download fix cause i'm lazy
659 2011-07-11 17:49:20 <Blitzboom> BlueMatt: how?
660 2011-07-11 17:49:26 <BlueMatt> its like -overridealert or something, dont remember the exact thing
661 2011-07-11 17:49:35 <gmaxwell> "connections" : 1000,
662 2011-07-11 17:49:42 <Blitzboom> still it is spooky
663 2011-07-11 17:49:43 <jrmithdobbs> gmaxwell: right, i'm saying it's looking better than it did
664 2011-07-11 17:49:52 <BlueMatt> Blitzboom: yea, but very neccessary
665 2011-07-11 17:49:58 <Blitzboom> but i guess i trust satoshi/gavin for now
666 2011-07-11 17:50:02 <jrmithdobbs> used to hover around 20-30 until the block download fix
667 2011-07-11 17:50:12 <gmaxwell> Yea, so restarting (and thus triggering an IRC join) is still getting me a flash mob. Which I think indicate that there are a lot of nodes hurting for connections still.
668 2011-07-11 17:50:13 <jrmithdobbs> Blitzboom: satoshi is gone so w/e
669 2011-07-11 17:50:28 <Blitzboom> jrmithdobbs: lol, as if he would just "forget" about bitcoin
670 2011-07-11 17:52:26 <Blitzboom> im still mad that he has never explained why he chose the seemingly arbitrary constants in bitcoin
671 2011-07-11 17:52:50 <Blitzboom> why the fuck would you not mention that when introducing a new monetary system?
672 2011-07-11 17:52:58 <gmaxwell> Blitzboom: meh. There aren't really any that matter that aren't explained.
673 2011-07-11 17:53:20 <Blitzboom> blocks every 10 minutes, the distribution curve?
674 2011-07-11 17:53:24 <gmaxwell> er.....
675 2011-07-11 17:53:26 <b4epoche> satoshi is clearly an academic...
676 2011-07-11 17:53:33 <gmaxwell> The block timing was explained.
677 2011-07-11 17:53:47 <Blitzboom> it was explained why 10 and not 20 minutes?
678 2011-07-11 17:53:55 <Blitzboom> why retarget every 2016 blocks?
679 2011-07-11 17:53:56 <BlueMatt> b4epoche: where did you get that idea?
680 2011-07-11 17:53:59 <Blitzboom> why maximum 4x?
681 2011-07-11 17:54:02 <jgarzik> the currency distribution is IMO largely satoshi's taste
682 2011-07-11 17:54:12 <jgarzik> 21M, 50/25/12.5/...
683 2011-07-11 17:54:17 <b4epoche> BlueMatt:  because I can identify with him ;-)
684 2011-07-11 17:54:21 <TD> Blitzboom: he did explain them
685 2011-07-11 17:54:24 <gmaxwell> Yea, distribution was "to simulate exploitation of a natural resource" which is kinda handwavy.
686 2011-07-11 17:54:27 <Blitzboom> TD: source?
687 2011-07-11 17:54:29 <BlueMatt> b4epoche: that doesnt exactly mean much...
688 2011-07-11 17:54:32 <TD> various emails and forum posts