1 2011-08-13 00:07:50 <b4epoche_> anyone know what font the official bitcoin B is?
  2 2011-08-13 00:08:33 <tcatm> b4epoche_: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/50/Bitcoin.png this?
  3 2011-08-13 00:09:01 <b4epoche_> well, the font used to create that
  4 2011-08-13 00:09:18 <shadders> luke-jr I'll use the address when my balance is higher than: 0.0595
  5 2011-08-13 00:17:46 <tcatm> b4epoche_: "what the font" can't detect it (after making it black/white and reducing it to a normal B)
  6 2011-08-13 00:18:12 <shadders> luke-jr: "specifically, miners work in little endian, but network is big endian"
  7 2011-08-13 00:18:15 <b4epoche_> hmm&  never heard of "what the font"
  8 2011-08-13 00:18:23 <luke-jr> tcatm: did you rotate it?
  9 2011-08-13 00:18:32 <shadders> is there a current consensus or still being argued about?
 10 2011-08-13 00:18:36 <tcatm> luke-jr: no. why should I?
 11 2011-08-13 00:18:40 <b4epoche_> and I couldn't find anything on my laptop the same
 12 2011-08-13 00:19:04 <luke-jr> shadders: right now everyone simply assumes little-endian
 13 2011-08-13 00:19:17 <luke-jr> tcatm: presumably the original font wasn't rotated like that
 14 2011-08-13 00:20:50 <b4epoche_> rotated?
 15 2011-08-13 00:23:39 <luke-jr> at least the one on bitcoin.org looks rotated
 16 2011-08-13 00:27:27 <tcatm> luke-jr: that's not the "official logo"
 17 2011-08-13 00:27:44 <luke-jr> tcatm: &&&
 18 2011-08-13 00:28:06 <tcatm> we were talking about this one: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/50/Bitcoin.png
 19 2011-08-13 00:28:56 <luke-jr> ok
 20 2011-08-13 00:29:12 <luke-jr> someone needs to make a font that renders it that way
 21 2011-08-13 00:31:22 <tcatm> I've got a SVG
 22 2011-08-13 00:31:54 <luke-jr> I could make the actual glyph in fontforge, but I don't know how to designate it as the right character
 23 2011-08-13 00:32:08 <luke-jr> since it's a B with overlapping double-vertical-lines
 24 2011-08-13 00:32:19 <luke-jr> ligature maybe? but I don't know how&
 25 2011-08-13 00:32:55 <tcatm> the character doesn't exist yet. that's the problem
 26 2011-08-13 00:33:24 <luke-jr> it does
 27 2011-08-13 00:33:41 <luke-jr> B??
 28 2011-08-13 00:34:04 <luke-jr> U+0042 U+20E6
 29 2011-08-13 00:42:09 <tcatm> the closest match I could find is "Tanger Serif"
 30 2011-08-13 01:02:39 <gribble> gmaxwell was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 4 days, 7 hours, 49 minutes, and 20 seconds ago: <gmaxwell> quick, split the chain.
 31 2011-08-13 01:02:39 <jrmithdobbs> ;;seen gmaxwell
 32 2011-08-13 01:19:33 <b4epoche_> hmm& did JSTOR get him
 33 2011-08-13 05:13:00 <blob> When you close the windows client with the X button, the window is disappearing but ixcoin.exe is still running...
 34 2011-08-13 05:13:23 <blob> If you use file->exit, it's fine...
 35 2011-08-13 05:13:34 <blob> this in server-mode
 36 2011-08-13 05:46:01 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * e5d4eabe34f7 r13 / (15 files in 5 dirs):
 37 2011-08-13 05:46:02 <CIA-101> poolserverj: - update procrunsrv to 1.07 to support wildcard classpaths
 38 2011-08-13 06:00:41 <Plasma-> blob, its probably minimised to sys tray?
 39 2011-08-13 06:01:55 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * b196b2cacdce r14 /.hgtags: Added tag 0.2.5 for changeset e5d4eabe34f7
 40 2011-08-13 06:05:33 <blob> Couldn't find it anywhere... :)
 41 2011-08-13 06:05:55 <blob> maybe the window-close is not calling the server-close function...
 42 2011-08-13 06:06:01 <blob> if in server mode
 43 2011-08-13 06:06:50 <diki> ok
 44 2011-08-13 06:06:52 <diki> small suggestion
 45 2011-08-13 06:07:09 <diki> allow a user to execute the getinfo rpc command from the UI
 46 2011-08-13 06:07:28 <diki> in fact, let the user be able to execute any rpc command via the ui
 47 2011-08-13 06:07:32 <diki> clickable of course
 48 2011-08-13 06:08:31 <blob> you mean full blockexplorer funktionality ? ^^
 49 2011-08-13 06:08:36 <diki> yes
 50 2011-08-13 06:08:45 <diki> the ui will be faster than blockexplorer
 51 2011-08-13 06:09:01 <diki> just one or two clicks
 52 2011-08-13 06:09:56 <diki> under the hood, bitcoin might have a lot of work put in it
 53 2011-08-13 06:10:05 <diki> but in it's outer appearance, it doesnt
 54 2011-08-13 06:28:37 <topi`> why is there a delay when bitcoin client starts, between the point where several connections have been acquired and when it first starts downloading the missing blocks for the blockchain
 55 2011-08-13 06:29:04 <topi`> I think it takes 20-30 seconds to get full 10 connections but then it thinks really long until new blocks start coming in
 56 2011-08-13 06:56:34 <lfm> topi`: it varies
 57 2011-08-13 06:58:13 <lfm> topi`: it needs to get the "inventory" announcements from the connections so it can know what to ask for from each node.
 58 2011-08-13 07:03:35 <topi`> is the block acquiring speed limited by the fact that it might take 50 kilobytes to download a single block, or some other limit?
 59 2011-08-13 07:04:09 <Caesium> probably also limited by hte numberof <24 nodes around
 60 2011-08-13 07:04:42 <topi`> hmm, so it's like bittorrent, some of the peers are really really slow, and some might be faster
 61 2011-08-13 07:05:01 <lfm> maybe ya
 62 2011-08-13 07:06:02 <lfm> max block size: 334491 bytes (so far)
 63 2011-08-13 07:06:28 <lfm> most blocks are less than 10 k bytes tho I think
 64 2011-08-13 07:52:05 <ThomasV> is the mybitcoin hack understood and explained ? has it been confirmed that it was a lack of confirmationis ?
 65 2011-08-13 07:52:14 <ThomasV> *confirmations*
 66 2011-08-13 07:54:18 <Eliel> ThomasV: I'm not aware of any information on it other than the public announcement on mybitcoin website.
 67 2011-08-13 07:56:00 <ThomasV> as far as I understand, a double spend attack requires mining power
 68 2011-08-13 07:56:45 <ThomasV> and tom williams said that the attack was made repeatedly, with small quantities
 69 2011-08-13 07:57:22 <ThomasV> this is not consistent with the scenario of mining fake blocks
 70 2011-08-13 07:57:31 <lfm> well they maybe were not waiting for any confirmations. we dont know
 71 2011-08-13 07:57:55 <ThomasV> yes, but he said they were waiting for one
 72 2011-08-13 07:58:35 <Eliel> if they were waiting for one confirmation, then it's reasonably easy to pull off. Especially if you're using the timejacking attack (just google for details)
 73 2011-08-13 07:59:50 <Eliel> http://culubas.blogspot.com/2011/05/timejacking-bitcoin_802.html
 74 2011-08-13 08:02:04 <ThomasV> hmm, so the most sensible target for such an attack would be deepbit
 75 2011-08-13 08:02:21 <Eliel> for timejacking attack? how come?
 76 2011-08-13 08:02:47 <ThomasV> because they have a higher chance of finding a block
 77 2011-08-13 08:03:23 <Eliel> ah, you mean the part where you use timejacking to move miners time backwards?
 78 2011-08-13 08:04:24 <ThomasV> not just that ; you need a miner that announces the fake transaction, unless you are a miner yourself
 79 2011-08-13 08:05:18 <ThomasV> well, it's not very clear to me :-(
 80 2011-08-13 08:36:44 <bbear> Hello.
 81 2011-08-13 08:36:56 <bbear> Do you think it would be possible to design a C library for bitcoins ?
 82 2011-08-13 08:36:57 <lfm> bbear: hi
 83 2011-08-13 08:37:05 <bbear> lfm: did you have a good sleep :)
 84 2011-08-13 08:37:08 <lfm> bbear: yes
 85 2011-08-13 08:37:20 <bbear> yes me too and strong coffee in the morning :D
 86 2011-08-13 08:37:22 <lfm> bbear: no I havent slept
 87 2011-08-13 08:37:33 <bbear> lfm: you ubermenschen
 88 2011-08-13 08:37:47 <lfm> I sed yes to posible to design a lib
 89 2011-08-13 08:38:08 <lfm> 4:39 AM here
 90 2011-08-13 09:13:08 <bbear> Ok, do you think it's 1) possible to design a pure C bitcoin library 2) it's a good idea ?
 91 2011-08-13 09:13:32 <cjdelisle> 1) yes, 2) maybe
 92 2011-08-13 09:13:45 <cjdelisle> it would be a massive project
 93 2011-08-13 09:14:30 <BlueMatt> I would say: dont waste your time, spend your time working on the current bitcoin client and make a nice c lib wrapper around it
 94 2011-08-13 09:14:53 <BlueMatt> writing a bitcoin client from scratch to get all the complicated block chain reorgs handled right is a huge pita
 95 2011-08-13 09:15:04 <bbear> BlueMatt: it's just unusual to use C (low level) to wrap C++ (more abstract)
 96 2011-08-13 09:15:29 <bbear> Any way I am going to do it
 97 2011-08-13 09:15:36 <bbear> I know this is a good idea.
 98 2011-08-13 09:15:45 <BlueMatt> well have fun
 99 2011-08-13 09:16:08 <cjdelisle> If you wanted a C implementation, I would suggest modularizing the existing bitcoind and replacing one module at a time so you always have a tight work/test feedback loop.
100 2011-08-13 09:16:51 <bbear> cjdelisle: is it possible to mix C/C++ in such a way ?
101 2011-08-13 09:17:05 <BlueMatt> or: help others who are currently doing the modularizing work then replace C++ parts
102 2011-08-13 09:17:08 <BlueMatt> bbear: of course
103 2011-08-13 09:17:13 <cjdelisle> extern "C" { .....  } iirc
104 2011-08-13 09:18:19 <bbear> BlueMatt: what is this project ?
105 2011-08-13 09:18:22 <BlueMatt> typically dont even need that much...
106 2011-08-13 09:18:50 <cjdelisle> IDK how people would feel about you suggesting patches written in C but if I was a committer and the patches were of better quality than the existing code I would be happy to accept them.
107 2011-08-13 09:19:43 <BlueMatt> bbear: well Im working on spliting block/tx store and verification into one module and net into a separate one (via a central hub) and Giel is working on modularizing net code so that it can be partially redone
108 2011-08-13 09:20:48 <BlueMatt> committing straight C to the repo for the sole purpose of replacing C++ with C probably wont fly...but if it actually improves something, Id assume no one will mind (as long as you dont spend needless cpu cycles converting from C++ types to C ones)
109 2011-08-13 09:29:21 <bbear> BlueMatt: My idea is the following.
110 2011-08-13 09:30:02 <bbear> Make something from the top to the bottom. It means that obviously, there is some primitives that the bitcoin clients perform : SendMoneyTo('bitcoinadress')
111 2011-08-13 09:30:12 <bbear> FetchListOfBlocks()
112 2011-08-13 09:30:25 <bbear> ListTransactions()
113 2011-08-13 09:30:34 <bbear> ListOutcomingTransactions()
114 2011-08-13 09:30:40 <bbear> ListIncomingTransactions()
115 2011-08-13 09:31:04 <bbear> I mean, that simple transactions acting on a given wallet are the main primitives a bitcoin client should have, isn't it ?
116 2011-08-13 09:32:54 <BlueMatt> that like .05% of what you need to implement
117 2011-08-13 09:33:09 <BlueMatt> handling block checking/reorgs etc is what actually is hard
118 2011-08-13 09:34:08 <bbear> BlueMatt: what's block checking.
119 2011-08-13 09:34:25 <BlueMatt> check the hash of the headers, but thats the easy part
120 2011-08-13 09:34:33 <bbear> Ah - something I thought of. I think mining should be really separated of my bitcoin client.
121 2011-08-13 09:34:38 <BlueMatt> handling connections to other nodes on the p2p network and then handling block chain reorgs is hard
122 2011-08-13 09:34:52 <bbear> BlueMatt: the p2p part is the less easy I guess.
123 2011-08-13 09:35:17 <bbear> BlueMatt: But it's not related with mining, isn't it ?
124 2011-08-13 09:35:22 <BlueMatt> keep dreaming, it is a /ton/ of work to implement a bitcoin client even half way, if you want to do it by all means do, but know what you are getting into
125 2011-08-13 09:35:50 <bbear> BlueMatt: That's why I keep talking instead of coding. I want to know what I am doing before to get into.
126 2011-08-13 09:36:23 <bbear> I mean, does a p2p module would be used by both the basic client and the miner, through the same primitives (almost)
127 2011-08-13 09:36:33 <bbear> BlueMatt: thank you for the advertising.
128 2011-08-13 09:36:43 <BlueMatt> seriously, dont...ask TD or justmoon how much work it is...its a ton
129 2011-08-13 09:39:20 <Diablo-D3> hrm
130 2011-08-13 09:39:22 <Diablo-D3> this is interesting
131 2011-08-13 09:39:30 <Diablo-D3> I may have fixed phatk's insane array usage
132 2011-08-13 09:39:48 <Diablo-D3> the core of it uses 24 registers
133 2011-08-13 09:40:41 <Diablo-D3> ie, at no point am I holding onto more than 23 (24 if Im using whats in the register this step) things
134 2011-08-13 09:41:21 <tcatm> who runs bitparking.com?
135 2011-08-13 09:42:04 <Diablo-D3> and dear lord this is ugly perl
136 2011-08-13 09:44:01 <Diablo-D3> so lets bloat it up to 32
137 2011-08-13 09:44:49 <Diablo-D3> so I can abuse the register rotation cool down period a little further
138 2011-08-13 09:49:38 <Diablo-D3> hrm if it loads every arg into a reg
139 2011-08-13 09:49:41 <Diablo-D3> thats 26 registers
140 2011-08-13 09:49:51 <Diablo-D3> I have 64, I use 32, I leave it 6 for its own internal use
141 2011-08-13 10:11:33 <Diablo-D3> hrm
142 2011-08-13 10:12:23 <Diablo-D3> if I enforce a "cant use right after it was last read from" rule and a "cant reuse the register in a line that references the register (ie, a = a + b)" rule, I need 25 registers for the core
143 2011-08-13 10:16:09 <cjdelisle> what is this register cooldown period? Can I find some info about it somewhere?
144 2011-08-13 10:17:24 <Diablo-D3> cjdelisle: nope, voodoo magic.
145 2011-08-13 10:18:05 <cjdelisle> ok so it's just a little known fact that things run faster when you interchange which registers you write to?
146 2011-08-13 10:18:05 <makomk> Diablo-D3: do you really need to do that?
147 2011-08-13 10:18:15 <Diablo-D3> cjdelisle: depends on the hardware.
148 2011-08-13 10:18:38 <Diablo-D3> compilers usually produce code that doesnt even look close to what you started with
149 2011-08-13 10:18:44 <Diablo-D3> makomk: who knows
150 2011-08-13 10:18:52 <Diablo-D3> the phatk array works somehow
151 2011-08-13 10:19:04 <Diablo-D3> but its entirely too big
152 2011-08-13 10:19:07 <cjdelisle> That explains why I found it slower when I used 16 int array instead of 64.
153 2011-08-13 10:19:46 <Diablo-D3> cjdelisle: 64 is probably too big
154 2011-08-13 10:19:47 <cjdelisle> what is phatk doing? using an array for each of A,B,C,D,E,F,G,H?
155 2011-08-13 10:19:55 <Diablo-D3> an array for the Ws
156 2011-08-13 10:20:18 <Diablo-D3> I redid the whole thing
157 2011-08-13 10:20:22 <Diablo-D3> it now uses an array for everything
158 2011-08-13 10:20:33 <Diablo-D3> there are 458 assignments done in my kernel
159 2011-08-13 10:20:51 <cjdelisle> I checked the info from the output, it's not using nearly that much memory so there's some real magic going on in the compiler
160 2011-08-13 10:20:55 <Diablo-D3> I transmuted all of them into a single array of 458
161 2011-08-13 10:21:14 <Diablo-D3> then I transmuted them into recycling "registers" that arent in use
162 2011-08-13 10:21:17 <Diablo-D3> (ie, array indexes)
163 2011-08-13 10:21:23 <Diablo-D3> and then applied those two rules
164 2011-08-13 10:21:29 <Diablo-D3> I need at least 25 registers or I run out.
165 2011-08-13 10:22:24 <cjdelisle> I think you can use boundless memory as long as you never reread it again after you write, read, are finished with it (at least with cuda).
166 2011-08-13 10:22:36 <Diablo-D3> nope
167 2011-08-13 10:22:39 <Diablo-D3> because this isnt memory
168 2011-08-13 10:22:42 <Diablo-D3> read the opencl specification.
169 2011-08-13 10:22:47 <Diablo-D3> it does NOT take arrays apart.
170 2011-08-13 10:23:03 <Diablo-D3> these are usually mapped to actual hardware registers when there is room
171 2011-08-13 10:24:00 <cjdelisle> mm cuda must not be complying because it has about 100 ints and it's surveiving on 60 registers.
172 2011-08-13 10:24:22 <Diablo-D3> yes, it can spill out
173 2011-08-13 10:24:24 <Diablo-D3> which is expensive
174 2011-08-13 10:24:35 <Diablo-D3> I also dont particularly give a fuck what nvidia does
175 2011-08-13 10:26:00 <cjdelisle> /nod
176 2011-08-13 10:26:33 <Diablo-D3> okay so with 16384 registers, 256 work items max, that gives me 64 registers
177 2011-08-13 10:26:41 <cjdelisle> I only care about nvidia because that's what I have and mining isn't that interesting to me, I just like optimizing things.
178 2011-08-13 10:26:54 <Diablo-D3> I use 2, and then the array is min size of 25
179 2011-08-13 10:27:00 <Diablo-D3> so I can bump it to two
180 2011-08-13 10:27:12 <erus`> turn it up to 11
181 2011-08-13 10:27:19 <Diablo-D3> er
182 2011-08-13 10:27:21 <Diablo-D3> to 30
183 2011-08-13 10:27:36 <Diablo-D3> and then have half the register space free.
184 2011-08-13 10:28:42 <cjdelisle> why have half the register space free? doesn't it make more sense to use everything?
185 2011-08-13 10:29:31 <Diablo-D3> nope.
186 2011-08-13 10:29:40 <Diablo-D3> the compiler can do tricks
187 2011-08-13 10:30:25 <cjdelisle> ahh I see
188 2011-08-13 10:59:10 <cuqa> hey, is there still this transaction bug when you send for example amount 1.2, that some bitcoins are lost ?
189 2011-08-13 11:05:34 <cuqa> or isnt this a bug at all. I once transfered 0.12 BTC and had a balance of 0.12719281 .. but my balance was then 0, it took 0.00719281 as transaction fee
190 2011-08-13 11:06:02 <asher^> it happens if you are left with <0.01 i believe
191 2011-08-13 11:07:20 <cuqa> ah okay
192 2011-08-13 11:09:17 <cuqa> and how come bitcoin charges more transaction fees after some time
193 2011-08-13 11:09:41 <cuqa> now I sended 0.0995000 BTC as test and it took 0.00999999 fee
194 2011-08-13 11:11:34 <cuqa> with version 0.324
195 2011-08-13 11:23:27 <cuqa> could it be that when I set paytxfee=0.00000000, that bitcoind decides which fee it sends and if I set paytxfee=0.00050000, that it is fixed 0.0005 fee?
196 2011-08-13 11:46:33 <BlueMatt> ...
197 2011-08-13 11:47:16 <diki> was wondering
198 2011-08-13 11:47:25 <diki> is it possible to make the client not wait for 120 confirms
199 2011-08-13 11:57:45 <Eliel> diki: I guess you mean for generated coins? I seem to remember that the client is hardcoded to not accept their use until 100 confirmations have passed.
200 2011-08-13 12:00:01 <Graet> the 50btc + trans fee dont appear in my pools wallet till 120 confirms, i cover the last 20 and payout at 100
201 2011-08-13 13:10:07 <phungus> when designing an application around bitcoind, is it better to use the bitcoin wallet as a database for storing account balances per use, and just use the label to differentiate, or is it better to roll your own DB?
202 2011-08-13 13:10:09 <yebyen> does anyone have gavin's tutorial on making an incompatible client stashed somewhere?
203 2011-08-13 13:10:20 <phungus> s/use/user/
204 2011-08-13 13:10:52 <yebyen> phungus: you don't want to receive the transactions yourself, do you?
205 2011-08-13 13:11:06 <phungus> well, I just want to keep track of user account balances
206 2011-08-13 13:11:14 <phungus> and I figured that with a new receive address per user, it could do that
207 2011-08-13 13:11:28 <phungus> but I'm unsure if that's a good way to go about it
208 2011-08-13 13:11:40 <yebyen> i think the new bitcoin clients (i call it new if it's released less than 40000 blocks ago)
209 2011-08-13 13:11:47 <yebyen> actually support assigning addresses to accounts
210 2011-08-13 13:11:57 <tcatm> phungus: using bitcoin as a database has some problems. It would be a good idea to keep an ascii log of everything (incoming/outgoing transactions + moves between accounts)
211 2011-08-13 13:12:01 <phungus> yeah, I thought that was part of the spec
212 2011-08-13 13:12:08 <yebyen> right
213 2011-08-13 13:12:10 <phungus> hmm
214 2011-08-13 13:12:11 <phungus> ok
215 2011-08-13 13:12:19 <yebyen> so, do you trust the accounts not to gain or lose money speciously
216 2011-08-13 13:12:22 <phungus> so probably do the account logic in my own DB
217 2011-08-13 13:12:43 <phungus> hmm, I think I would trust them
218 2011-08-13 13:12:47 <yebyen> you have no choice
219 2011-08-13 13:12:49 <phungus> and if they gained money it would be ok
220 2011-08-13 13:12:58 <tcatm> once you grow big (>1000 BTC in wallet) you should consider writing your own database so you don't have to keep all those coins "online"
221 2011-08-13 13:13:05 <yebyen> but you should certainly detect it, if the money disappears, and generate an alert
222 2011-08-13 13:13:11 <phungus> yeah, that's a good thought tcatm
223 2011-08-13 13:13:19 <yebyen> however you are managing alerts
224 2011-08-13 13:13:40 <phungus> this is an IRC bot, so it's already getting complicated. :-)
225 2011-08-13 13:13:54 <phungus> I'm not inventing anything except for the glue though
226 2011-08-13 13:13:56 <yebyen> in that case it ought to get at least as complicated as event-reactor
227 2011-08-13 13:14:33 <phungus> yeah, sounds like a DB is the best way to scale
228 2011-08-13 13:15:02 <phungus> thx for the input
229 2011-08-13 13:16:10 <andyroo> use sqlite
230 2011-08-13 13:16:16 <phungus> I am already
231 2011-08-13 13:16:18 <phungus> :-)
232 2011-08-13 13:16:23 <yebyen> does anyone work with H2?
233 2011-08-13 13:16:42 <andyroo> haskell?
234 2011-08-13 13:16:52 <phungus> We only speak LISP here
235 2011-08-13 13:16:58 <phungus> :-)
236 2011-08-13 13:17:19 <yebyen> it's a database, java rdbms
237 2011-08-13 13:17:23 <yebyen> i guess you don't use it
238 2011-08-13 13:18:32 <andyroo> phungus, it would be nice to have a "standard" lib for sqlite wallets
239 2011-08-13 13:18:43 <andyroo> and network interaction and all that
240 2011-08-13 13:18:52 <andyroo> separate from any specific UI you have in mind
241 2011-08-13 13:19:37 <phungus> hmm
242 2011-08-13 13:19:46 <phungus> I'm working in Perl
243 2011-08-13 13:20:02 <andyroo> damn, i was hoping for C..
244 2011-08-13 13:20:04 <phungus> so nobody would probably be interested in that package from me. :-)
245 2011-08-13 13:20:11 <andyroo> then you could have bindings for perl
246 2011-08-13 13:20:13 <yebyen> what about ruby
247 2011-08-13 13:20:19 <andyroo> and lisp, and haskell, and ruby and python
248 2011-08-13 13:20:22 <phungus> so like a standard way for formatting the database and the methods
249 2011-08-13 13:20:23 <phungus> hmm
250 2011-08-13 13:20:27 <yebyen> how about a ruby/zookeeper implementation of a wallet
251 2011-08-13 13:20:31 <yebyen> for distributed wallet operation
252 2011-08-13 13:20:32 <phungus> zookeeper?
253 2011-08-13 13:20:33 <phungus> ehha
254 2011-08-13 13:20:36 <phungus> LOL
255 2011-08-13 13:20:55 <andyroo> that way people who talk about making SMTP gateways and the like, have something to work from
256 2011-08-13 13:21:00 <phungus> yeah perl is at the bottom of everyone's list but it's what I know. :-)
257 2011-08-13 13:21:33 <andyroo> well, fair enough, don't let me discourage yo
258 2011-08-13 13:21:38 <phungus> that does sound interesting though, because I can see how I'll have to re-invent a wheel to put it in SQL statements
259 2011-08-13 13:21:57 <phungus> and then you need code to sync the bitcoin db with sqlite
260 2011-08-13 13:22:07 <phungus> or at least do the checks?
261 2011-08-13 13:22:22 <phungus> do you just use sqlite to map the bitcoin db and then call the getbalance to bitcoin?
262 2011-08-13 13:22:33 <phungus> so many questions
263 2011-08-13 13:22:50 <andyroo> i would store the keypairs in the db with a "last seen balance" and cache date
264 2011-08-13 13:23:05 <andyroo> and that's it
265 2011-08-13 13:23:16 <andyroo> everything else would have to ask the bitcoin network
266 2011-08-13 13:23:56 <andyroo> i'd be hesitant to do any logic in sqlite, because it isn't designed for anything complex
267 2011-08-13 13:23:57 <phungus> hmm, ok
268 2011-08-13 13:24:09 <andyroo> mainly for storing music libraries and such
269 2011-08-13 13:25:34 <andyroo> i think, for what i'm suggesting, we'd need to write up and API and discuss it before doing any implementation
270 2011-08-13 13:25:44 <andyroo> which might be a much bigger scale that what you'd planned
271 2011-08-13 13:25:52 <phungus> yeah, maybe
272 2011-08-13 13:25:57 <phungus> I'm not a developer
273 2011-08-13 13:25:59 <phungus> :-(
274 2011-08-13 13:26:13 <phungus> would certainly love to learn more though
275 2011-08-13 13:26:30 <phungus> have to run and be with kids since I've now been on IRC for 4 hours and 21 minutes. agh!
276 2011-08-13 13:27:55 <andyroo> haha, seeya
277 2011-08-13 15:40:56 <EvanR> slush: i quit mining, you can have whats left in my slush pool account
278 2011-08-13 16:35:21 <CodeForFood> I'm programming with PHP and I got line "$bitcoin->sendtoaddress($_POST['addr'],(float)$amount);" but it sends only 0 + tx fee even when $amount is example 1. What is the problem? :(
279 2011-08-13 16:55:25 <Eliel> CodeForFood: 1) not really the channel for this 2) do you still have the problem? /msg me if you do, I'll see if I can help you figure it out.
280 2011-08-13 16:55:59 <CodeForFood> what is the right channel then?
281 2011-08-13 16:57:24 <Eliel> #php or something like that I guess.
282 2011-08-13 16:58:14 <neofutur> shouldnt the amount be an int ?
283 2011-08-13 16:58:33 <Eliel> neofutur: that would depend on the php library he's using.
284 2011-08-13 16:58:39 <CodeForFood> I have tried nearly everything, int returns [code] => -1 [message] => value is type bool, expected real
285 2011-08-13 16:58:55 <Eliel> but if it's sensibly made library, it really ought to take an int there.
286 2011-08-13 16:59:18 <CodeForFood> I'm using lib made by  Copyright (c) 2011 Schalk Bower <schalk@hotmail.co.nz>, is that too old?
287 2011-08-13 17:00:24 <Eliel> not a question of too old with that new library. More like, it might be an alpha release of the library
288 2011-08-13 17:01:06 <CodeForFood> I tested now with sendtoaddress($_POST['addr'],0.01); and it works. Arrgghh
289 2011-08-13 17:01:29 <Eliel> CodeForFood: well, then, something screws up $amount before it gets to that point in code.
290 2011-08-13 17:01:53 <CodeForFood> yeh it looks like
291 2011-08-13 17:02:29 <Eliel> if things don't work the way you expect it to, always make sure the parameters it gets are what you expect.
292 2011-08-13 17:03:01 <CodeForFood> I get right value out of it just before that function
293 2011-08-13 17:04:12 <CodeForFood> and I have now converted it to all types (int, float....) and it only returns "value is type bool, expected real" and I don't really get what that means
294 2011-08-13 17:04:39 <Habbie> for a website that only receives payments but never sends any, i could really use a bitcoind rpc setting that allows me to make readonly clients, is anyone aware of a patch for that?
295 2011-08-13 17:05:31 <Habbie> like in https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=19137.msg283624#msg283624
296 2011-08-13 17:05:39 <Habbie> luke-jr, ^^ have you seen code for this?
297 2011-08-13 17:08:27 <CodeForFood> lol now I don't get error but still sending 0 + tx fee -.-
298 2011-08-13 17:09:17 <Eliel> CodeForFood: if it's a string in the variable $amount, you might have to convert it with a proper conversion function to get it right.
299 2011-08-13 17:09:50 <CodeForFood> If I convert it to anything else than float it returns that "value is type bool, expected real"
300 2011-08-13 17:10:53 <rickyC> Is this channel for the bitcoin client only, or any bitcoin related software?
301 2011-08-13 17:11:09 <Habbie> rickyC, anything bitcoin-related that doesn't have a more specific channel. just ask your question :)
302 2011-08-13 17:11:38 <Eliel> rickyC: it's a bit of a fuzzy line on what's acceptable. I expect it'll get defined more strictly as the channel gets more popular.
303 2011-08-13 17:14:05 <rickyC> I'm trying to use jsonrpc in php using ssl. After enabling ssl, do you still connect the same way? "$bitcoin = new jsonRPCClient('http://user:password@127.0.0.1:8332/');"
304 2011-08-13 17:14:16 <Habbie> rickyC, #bitcoin-dev is for this question
305 2011-08-13 17:14:31 <Habbie> oh oops
306 2011-08-13 17:14:34 <Habbie> this is #bitcoin-dev ;)
307 2011-08-13 17:14:47 <Habbie> just ignore my other line too
308 2011-08-13 17:15:11 <Habbie> rickyC, my guess would be https instead of http
309 2011-08-13 17:17:20 <rickyC> It seem to work for me. "Exception: Unable to connect to https://user:pw@192.168.1.19:8332/ in XXwwwjsonRPCClient.php on line 140"
310 2011-08-13 17:17:38 <Eliel> rickyC: also, that question is directly related to bitcoin client :)
311 2011-08-13 17:22:03 <vegard> !seen justmoon
312 2011-08-13 17:22:04 <spaola> justmoon (~justmoon@fsf/member/justmoon) was last seen quitting from #bitcoin-dev 5 days, 5 hours, 2 minutes ago stating (Quit: Leaving).
313 2011-08-13 17:22:04 <TiggrBot> justmoon was last seen speaking 125 hours, 45 minutes, 52 seconds ago.
314 2011-08-13 17:22:49 <vegard> any bitcoinjs developers here?
315 2011-08-13 17:27:16 <neofutur> rickyC: perhaps you have a firewall blocking the port ?
316 2011-08-13 17:27:35 <Habbie> rickyC, did it work with http: before you enabled ssl?
317 2011-08-13 17:27:36 <neofutur> rickyC: try it on your browser too
318 2011-08-13 17:28:24 <rickyC> It worked before ssl, and "openssl s_client -connect localhost:8332" works on the host
319 2011-08-13 17:28:49 <Habbie> does s_client work from the host you're doing your php on?
320 2011-08-13 17:34:12 <CodeForFood> Got my script working, added $amount+0.000000000001, lol
321 2011-08-13 17:37:57 <rickyC> I get "CONNECTED(000000D8)".
322 2011-08-13 17:39:22 <rickyC> Im running wamp as a test server. Does apache or php need https settings enabled first? I didn't copy any .cert yet either
323 2011-08-13 18:21:19 <Eliel> http://www.readwriteweb.com/cloud/2011/08/google-officially-announces-cc.php
324 2011-08-13 18:21:42 <Eliel> well, there it is... bitcoin for the browser... at least, that should make it _really simple_.
325 2011-08-13 18:27:43 <ThomasV> Eliel: and really insecure ?
326 2011-08-13 18:28:22 <Eliel> ThomasV: depends on the implementation.
327 2011-08-13 18:28:27 <Habbie> programming language is hardly the hurdle
328 2011-08-13 18:29:01 <ThomasV> "hi guys. try the bitcoin client implemented on my homepage :-) "
329 2011-08-13 18:29:22 <Eliel> ThomasV: yes, that's an example of insecure implementation
330 2011-08-13 18:29:22 <ThomasV> (the server is in russia)
331 2011-08-13 18:29:56 <luke-jr> Habbie: not yet
332 2011-08-13 18:30:24 <Habbie> luke-jr, ah - thanks for letting me know :)
333 2011-08-13 18:30:34 <Eliel> what I'm more interested in, though, is that if/when firefox gets the plugin, it could allow writing firefox plugins with C/C++ then.
334 2011-08-13 18:32:23 <ThomasV> Eliel: how are firefox plugins currently xritten ?
335 2011-08-13 18:32:34 <ThomasV> *written*
336 2011-08-13 18:32:44 <Habbie> C/C++ :)
337 2011-08-13 18:33:05 <Eliel> oh, I thought they were written with XUL :P
338 2011-08-13 18:33:07 <b4epoche_> does the browser grab a binary?
339 2011-08-13 18:33:07 <Habbie> i'm guessing Eliel meant addons
340 2011-08-13 18:33:12 <Habbie> addons are written in XUL
341 2011-08-13 18:33:36 <Eliel> ah, yes, I meant addons
342 2011-08-13 18:34:08 <ThomasV> xul is just for the ui
343 2011-08-13 18:34:24 <b4epoche_> so, essentially you write an app that uses HTML for the UI?
344 2011-08-13 18:34:39 <luke-jr> down with NaCL!
345 2011-08-13 18:34:46 <Habbie> ThomasV, XUL+JS indeed, then
346 2011-08-13 18:35:10 <ThomasV> there's even xul+python
347 2011-08-13 18:35:17 <b4epoche_> and the browser graps a binary (platform specific?) and runs it dynamically linked to the UI stuff?
348 2011-08-13 18:36:09 <phantomcircuit> Eliel, that article doesn't load
349 2011-08-13 18:36:22 <phantomcircuit> is that the crap about chrome running x86 binaries
350 2011-08-13 18:36:30 <Eliel> phantomcircuit: loads for me
351 2011-08-13 18:37:47 <Eliel> phantomcircuit: I don't think it's using x86 binaries internally but they've made a C/C++ compiler that compiles into format their the new Beta Chrome can run.
352 2011-08-13 18:38:18 <phantomcircuit> lol the dude in the video is awkward as fuck
353 2011-08-13 18:38:23 <phantomcircuit> i love that they use engineers
354 2011-08-13 18:39:29 <Habbie> Eliel, nacl binaries are a subset of x86 binaries, actually
355 2011-08-13 18:40:29 <phantomcircuit> yeah im guessing they're basically taking their javascript JIT engine and have changed it to use c/c++
356 2011-08-13 18:40:58 <Habbie> phantomcircuit, that's not even close to true
357 2011-08-13 18:44:05 <Eliel> phantomcircuit: the compiler they're providing is a modified GCC
358 2011-08-13 18:44:52 <b4epoche_> sounds like they're basically using the browser as the UI environment
359 2011-08-13 18:44:55 <phantomcircuit> Habbie, well godo thing i said guess
360 2011-08-13 18:45:39 <Habbie> phantomcircuit, :)
361 2011-08-13 18:46:19 <Eliel> this is one of the more concrete steps towards detaching programs from individual computers.
362 2011-08-13 18:46:34 <b4epoche_> 2a.
363 2011-08-13 18:46:45 <b4epoche_> step 2a doesn't sound good
364 2011-08-13 18:54:29 <BlueMatt> ;;seen gavinandresen
365 2011-08-13 18:54:29 <gribble> gavinandresen was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 21 hours, 58 minutes, and 3 seconds ago: <gavinandresen> (when I wasn't enjoying the beach...)
366 2011-08-13 19:01:16 <BlueMatt> b4epoche_: the whole idea is that you do everything you can in html/js/css and then just the really perf-critical stuff gets dropped to native code so...bitcoin doesnt really fit
367 2011-08-13 19:01:31 <BlueMatt> (and hopefully they block access to just about everything)
368 2011-08-13 19:03:06 <b4epoche_> so, it's kinda the opposite of using the browser as the UI&  you just call compiled libraries when you need speed.
369 2011-08-13 19:03:35 <b4epoche_> like writing some assembly code for your C app but one level up?
370 2011-08-13 19:19:54 <BlueMatt> essentially
371 2011-08-13 19:20:27 <BlueMatt> its a good idea if, like google, you think everything should be done in a browser
372 2011-08-13 19:21:33 <BlueMatt> b4epoche_: if, like everyone else, you think native apps have a purpose, it has no use case
373 2011-08-13 19:23:42 <b4epoche_> honestly, I'd rather have seen them going the other way as I thought they might have
374 2011-08-13 19:23:56 <BlueMatt> other way meaning?
375 2011-08-13 19:24:19 <b4epoche_> basically the broswer as the UI
376 2011-08-13 19:24:26 <BlueMatt> the browser is the ui here
377 2011-08-13 19:24:31 <b4epoche_> instead of what sounds like calling binaries from javascript
378 2011-08-13 19:24:37 <BlueMatt> the goal is to replace perf-critical js with c/c++
379 2011-08-13 19:24:44 <b4epoche_> no, the browser as the ui api
380 2011-08-13 19:24:51 <BlueMatt> ah, interesting
381 2011-08-13 19:25:09 <BlueMatt> so...run everything in C++ and just call browser libs for ui instead of gtk...
382 2011-08-13 19:25:16 <b4epoche_> yepper
383 2011-08-13 19:25:38 <BlueMatt> mm, well that would pretty much defeat the purpose of using a browser at all
384 2011-08-13 19:26:00 <b4epoche_> well, isn't that what google wants anyway?  ui = os?
385 2011-08-13 19:26:04 <b4epoche_> damn it
386 2011-08-13 19:26:08 <b4epoche_> browser = os
387 2011-08-13 19:26:11 <BlueMatt> yea
388 2011-08-13 19:26:28 <BlueMatt> well that would replace html, js, and css and replace it with libchromerender
389 2011-08-13 19:26:44 <BlueMatt> so...its not really the web anymore
390 2011-08-13 19:27:11 <b4epoche_> no, not really&  but what is the web anyway?
391 2011-08-13 19:27:24 <BlueMatt> hehe, well that does open an entirely new can of worms doesnt it
392 2011-08-13 19:27:34 <b4epoche_> I mean every api out there makes it almost trivial to connect to services of the network anyway
393 2011-08-13 19:27:50 <b4epoche_> s/of/on
394 2011-08-13 19:29:32 <b4epoche_> and so many apps essentially use 'webviews' anyway, it's hard to know sometimes what's being grabbed from a server and what's stored locally
395 2011-08-13 20:26:48 <eps> ;;bc,stats
396 2011-08-13 20:26:51 <gribble> Current Blocks: 140850 | Current Difficulty: 1888786.7053531 | Next Difficulty At Block: 141119 | Next Difficulty In: 269 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 23 hours, 26 minutes, and 55 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1819602.56609019
397 2011-08-13 20:26:56 <eps> ;;bc,mtgox
398 2011-08-13 20:26:56 <gribble> {"ticker":{"high":10.05,"low":9.28,"avg":9.639486416,"vwap":9.723660143,"vol":25025,"last":9.8,"buy":9.78481,"sell":9.8}}
399 2011-08-13 21:12:59 <OneFixt> is thre a way to force bitcoind to re-send a tx?
400 2011-08-13 21:15:16 <OneFixt> re-broadcast i should say
401 2011-08-13 21:58:52 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * c2057ecee4bd r15 / (10 files in 8 dirs):
402 2011-08-13 21:58:53 <CIA-101> poolserverj: - enable different DB connection parameters (and engines) for shares and workers
403 2011-08-13 22:40:05 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Luke Dashjr * rb93a99c2bba9 gentoo/net-p2p/wxbitcoin/ (4 files): net-p2p/wxbitcoin: Add missing languages: pl sv
404 2011-08-13 22:47:29 <CIA-101> bitcoinjs/node-bitcoin-p2p: Stefan Thomas master * r5156381 / lib/schema/transaction.js : Cast outpoint spent query to Binary. - http://bit.ly/nJBXXW
405 2011-08-13 23:40:12 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r639d38fbd427 cgminer/ (main.c miner.h): Revert "Make sure to give work items a starting time only once when they're staged."
406 2011-08-13 23:40:13 <CIA-101> libbitcoin: genjix * r1b6d8d50b9e8 /bitcoin.sql: Added INDEXes to SQL
407 2011-08-13 23:40:15 <CIA-101> libbitcoin: genjix * r69b68f005f01 / (10 files in 6 dirs): postgresql post()'s to itself internally.
408 2011-08-13 23:50:13 <CIA-101> libbitcoin: genjix * r5e8e2b234720 / (examples/poller.cpp tests/psql.cpp): poller has quicker wait time now.