1 2012-11-19 00:04:27 <rdponticelli> qwebirc75238: Or you can try #bitcoin-mining
  2 2012-11-19 00:49:35 <cryptorific> do vorhees or fireduck ever make an appearance here?
  3 2012-11-19 00:59:28 <weex> once a bitcoin address is base58 decoded should it always be 25 characters in length?
  4 2012-11-19 01:07:03 <Luke-Jr> weex: for now
  5 2012-11-19 01:07:51 <weex> i'm getting the php function to check addresses here: https://bitcointalk.org/?topic=1026.5%3Bwap2
  6 2012-11-19 01:07:54 <weex> failing
  7 2012-11-19 01:08:52 <weex> maybe not though...i'll be back
  8 2012-11-19 05:00:50 <muhoo> early yet, but works: https://github.com/kenrestivo/pawnshop
  9 2012-11-19 05:46:04 <ThomasV> I keep getting this in my log: event=http_multi_fail sender_id=6  url=http://jauspora.com/receive/public response_code='0'
 10 2012-11-19 05:46:08 <ThomasV> any idea?
 11 2012-11-19 05:46:21 <ThomasV> oops, wrong channel, nvm
 12 2012-11-19 10:25:58 <upb> hey Luke-Jr, i found this while looking for a voicexml browser for freeswitch:
 13 2012-11-19 10:26:02 <upb> "Wrote adapters to connect VoiceXML interpretors with both Asterisk and. FreeSWITCH using the Method Integration"
 14 2012-11-19 10:26:07 <upb> which interpreter did you integrate ?:P
 15 2012-11-19 11:25:55 <Luke-Jr> upb: a certain interpretor that I also maintain
 16 2012-11-19 11:26:35 <Luke-Jr> upb: if that is of interest to you, I could get you in touch with the company selling it
 17 2012-11-19 11:34:58 <upb> ahhhh, its commercial :)
 18 2012-11-19 11:35:11 <upb> probably improved openvxi then
 19 2012-11-19 11:55:08 <Luke-Jr> upb: no, it's from scratch in Perl and C
 20 2012-11-19 11:55:43 <Luke-Jr> upb: the biggest external dependencies are the Simple ECMAScript Interpretor and libcurl
 21 2012-11-19 11:58:50 <Viral> hai guis help a friend make bitcoin
 22 2012-11-19 11:59:52 <Luke-Jr> Viral: bitpay offers a simple merchant interface
 23 2012-11-19 12:00:05 <Viral> are you a computer?
 24 2012-11-19 12:00:19 <Viral> its much more than that
 25 2012-11-19 12:00:23 <Viral> i think
 26 2012-11-19 12:00:24 <Viral> a-a
 27 2012-11-19 12:00:36 <Viral> i need a good computer
 28 2012-11-19 12:00:39 <Viral> .
 29 2012-11-19 12:00:48 <sipa> buy oneM
 30 2012-11-19 12:00:56 <cjd> infect one ;)
 31 2012-11-19 12:01:17 <SomeoneWeird> >___>
 32 2012-11-19 12:01:33 <Viral> more subversion i get it
 33 2012-11-19 12:01:49 <sipa> i prefer git
 34 2012-11-19 12:02:06 <Viral> i see what you did there fainting ignoreance good choice.
 35 2012-11-19 12:02:46 <sipa> if you want serious answers, start with a serious question :)
 36 2012-11-19 12:02:55 <Viral> can i infect mit super computer from mirc?
 37 2012-11-19 12:03:37 <Viral> i think the joker said it best, "why so serios"
 38 2012-11-19 12:04:00 <Viral> joker is a god
 39 2012-11-19 12:04:41 <Viral> my questions are simpo
 40 2012-11-19 12:05:10 <Viral> here's 1
 41 2012-11-19 12:05:20 <Viral> when does the 50 key sets drop down to 25 or w/e
 42 2012-11-19 12:07:28 <Viral> *sniff*sniff*
 43 2012-11-19 12:07:39 <Viral> i wish someone would help a lonely soul
 44 2012-11-19 12:07:50 <Viral> *sniff*
 45 2012-11-19 12:08:00 <Viral> HELP ME MAKE BITCO
 46 2012-11-19 12:11:36 <SomeoneWeird> it's simple
 47 2012-11-19 12:11:38 <SomeoneWeird> we kill the trolls
 48 2012-11-19 12:12:05 <sipa> nah, just ignore them
 49 2012-11-19 12:12:09 <Viral> well ide rather get paid
 50 2012-11-19 12:12:47 <Viral> for killing trolls Y_Y
 51 2012-11-19 12:13:05 <SomeoneWeird> if you're good at something
 52 2012-11-19 12:13:08 <SomeoneWeird> never do it for free
 53 2012-11-19 12:13:41 <Viral> i pay you 30$ make me 500 bitco
 54 2012-11-19 12:13:45 <Viral> heuheuheuhe
 55 2012-11-19 12:13:51 <Viral> thats how internet works rite?
 56 2012-11-19 12:14:47 <Viral> i only have so much tiime
 57 2012-11-19 12:22:10 <netuser> how can i earn 5 6 bitcoins?
 58 2012-11-19 12:37:07 <cardpuncher> Hi there, a little question about translations: in "Warning: error reading wallet.dat! All keys read correctly, but...", can this be understood as "Warning: error reading wallet.dat! All keys *were* read correctly, but..."?
 59 2012-11-19 12:51:12 <sipa> cardpuncher: indeed
 60 2012-11-19 12:51:58 <cardpuncher> Thanks sipa.
 61 2012-11-19 14:37:49 <helo> netuser: fake an identity on reddit.com/r/girlsgonebitcoin (NSFW)
 62 2012-11-19 14:39:07 <helo> of course, you'll need a very formidable collection to draw from
 63 2012-11-19 14:40:07 <helo> doh, offtopic O_o
 64 2012-11-19 14:54:10 <Cusipzzz> helo: 0_o
 65 2012-11-19 14:54:58 <helo> indeed
 66 2012-11-19 15:01:10 <netuser> lol helo
 67 2012-11-19 15:02:23 <netuser> u mean pics ? :))
 68 2012-11-19 16:43:52 <Godzilla123> Hi. from the wiki, In a transaction, "An input is a reference to an output in a different transaction."
 69 2012-11-19 16:44:20 <Godzilla123> Is it possible to refer more than one output or must there only be one output of a previous transaction?
 70 2012-11-19 16:45:41 <Godzilla123> sorry
 71 2012-11-19 16:45:44 <Godzilla123> I mistyped
 72 2012-11-19 16:46:39 <Godzilla123> If I send 1 btc from A to X and 1 btc from B to X, and finally send 2 btc from X to Y,
 73 2012-11-19 16:46:55 <Godzilla123> What will the fiinal transaction ,look like
 74 2012-11-19 16:47:26 <Godzilla123> since X is an input, it will reference an output in a "different transaction"
 75 2012-11-19 16:47:29 <Godzilla123> which transaction?
 76 2012-11-19 16:49:48 <Cusipzzz> both A and B are the inputs to X
 77 2012-11-19 16:50:32 <Godzilla123> so we can reference more than one previous transactions?
 78 2012-11-19 16:51:57 <Cusipzzz> not sure what you mean 'we can' - are you trying to build this in one transactions?
 79 2012-11-19 16:52:42 <Godzilla123> I am trying to understand the protocol
 80 2012-11-19 16:52:56 <Godzilla123> so I want to know exactly what this sentence means "An input is a reference to an output in a different transaction."
 81 2012-11-19 16:53:37 <Godzilla123> so it means *one* different transaction
 82 2012-11-19 16:53:43 <Godzilla123> or can there be many
 83 2012-11-19 16:54:04 <kjj_> many
 84 2012-11-19 16:54:22 <kjj_> each transaction has >0 input and >0 output
 85 2012-11-19 16:56:51 <Godzilla123> ok another way to put my question.. again quoted from qiki
 86 2012-11-19 16:56:53 <Godzilla123> wiki
 87 2012-11-19 16:56:55 <Godzilla123> Because an output can only ever be referenced by a single input, the entire combined input value needs to be sent in an output if you don't want to lose it.
 88 2012-11-19 16:57:07 <sipa> every input references exactly one output of exactly one former transaction
 89 2012-11-19 16:57:38 <Godzilla123> so the wiki says that "an output can only ever be referenced by a single input"
 90 2012-11-19 16:57:46 <Godzilla123> I want to know the other way round
 91 2012-11-19 16:58:00 <Godzilla123> can an input reference many other outputs?
 92 2012-11-19 16:58:01 <Godzilla123> can an input reference many other outputs?
 93 2012-11-19 16:58:05 <sipa> no
 94 2012-11-19 16:58:17 <sipa> read my last sentence again :)
 95 2012-11-19 16:58:29 <kjj_> but you can have multiple inputs in a transaction
 96 2012-11-19 16:58:36 <Godzilla123> ok
 97 2012-11-19 16:58:43 <Godzilla123> so multiple signatures
 98 2012-11-19 16:58:57 <Godzilla123> even if the inputs are repeated
 99 2012-11-19 16:59:06 <sipa> yes
100 2012-11-19 16:59:12 <kjj_> a transaction is basically just two lists.  an input list, and an output list.
101 2012-11-19 16:59:29 <Godzilla123> ok
102 2012-11-19 16:59:39 <Godzilla123> plus a list of previous outputs
103 2012-11-19 16:59:46 <kjj_> those are the inputs
104 2012-11-19 16:59:52 <Godzilla123> ok
105 2012-11-19 17:00:02 <Godzilla123> i see
106 2012-11-19 17:00:05 <sipa> outputs are amount+pubkey(address)
107 2012-11-19 17:00:28 <Godzilla123> what exactly is an "input"
108 2012-11-19 17:00:28 <sipa> inputs are reference to previous output + signature to prove ownership of it
109 2012-11-19 17:00:36 <Godzilla123> I mean the data inside it
110 2012-11-19 17:00:39 <kjj_> ok, from the beginning
111 2012-11-19 17:00:55 <kjj_> someone finds a block, they are allowed to make a special transaction that has a bogus input, but a valid output
112 2012-11-19 17:01:09 <Godzilla123> ok
113 2012-11-19 17:01:14 <Godzilla123> the coinbase
114 2012-11-19 17:01:14 <kjj_> every other transaction refers to a previous transaction, eventually leading back to one of those generation transactions
115 2012-11-19 17:01:30 <Godzilla123> ok
116 2012-11-19 17:01:52 <kjj_> when you make a transaction, your inputs are members of the output lists of various other previous transactions
117 2012-11-19 17:02:00 <Godzilla123> that clears it up. so the inputs are actually transaction ids
118 2012-11-19 17:02:07 <kjj_> sorta
119 2012-11-19 17:02:08 <kjj_> sorta
120 2012-11-19 17:02:09 <Godzilla123> along with a signature
121 2012-11-19 17:02:22 <sipa> txid + output# + signature
122 2012-11-19 17:02:36 <kjj_> each transaction has a list of outputs.  the full identifier is the txid (the hash of the transaction as a whole) and the sequence along that list
123 2012-11-19 17:03:13 <kjj_> when you go to redeem a transaction from the past, you specify both the txid and that sequence for each one you want to redeem.  those go into a list as your inputs
124 2012-11-19 17:03:35 <Godzilla123> when you say txid + output# + signature
125 2012-11-19 17:03:36 <Godzilla123> when you say txid + output# + signature
126 2012-11-19 17:03:42 <Godzilla123> that is the previous tx output
127 2012-11-19 17:03:54 <kjj_> right
128 2012-11-19 17:04:13 <sipa> txid is 32-bytebtx hash
129 2012-11-19 17:04:14 <sipa> output# is a 4-byte number
130 2012-11-19 17:04:49 <sipa> signature is variable lengtgh (it"'s actually a script)
131 2012-11-19 17:05:06 <Godzilla123> where is the public key supplied?
132 2012-11-19 17:05:07 <sipa> sorry for my typing, i'm on a train :)
133 2012-11-19 17:05:25 <Godzilla123> is it inside signature
134 2012-11-19 17:05:44 <sipa> originally, the output had the public key, and the input hadbthe signature
135 2012-11-19 17:06:11 <sipa> in practice, in almkst every transaction, the output only contains a public key hash
136 2012-11-19 17:06:36 <kjj_> we totally need a boot camp for this
137 2012-11-19 17:06:37 <sipa> and both the public key and the signature are in the input
138 2012-11-19 17:07:39 <Godzilla123> but I get the general idea
139 2012-11-19 17:08:56 <Godzilla123> can outputs be repeated in a tx?
140 2012-11-19 17:09:08 <sipa> how do you mean?
141 2012-11-19 17:10:04 <Godzilla123> like one tx has many inputs which can be repeated. What about the outputs, Will that be a problem?
142 2012-11-19 17:10:18 <Godzilla123> (A, A) --> (B, B)
143 2012-11-19 17:10:19 <Godzilla123> (A, A) --> (B, B)
144 2012-11-19 17:10:33 <Godzilla123> or should it be (A, A) --> B
145 2012-11-19 17:10:43 <sipa> every inputs references exactly one output
146 2012-11-19 17:11:04 <sipa> but there can be several inputs, aand several outputs
147 2012-11-19 17:11:32 <sipa> the different outputs referenced by the inputs of one transaction may but are not requured to belong to the same former transaction
148 2012-11-19 17:12:20 <Godzilla123> yes but I wanted to know if the several outputs need to be unique or repeatable?
149 2012-11-19 17:12:21 <Godzilla123> yes but I wanted to know if the several outputs need to be unique or repeatable?
150 2012-11-19 17:12:21 <kjj_> you know what would make multisig much easier?  if it sorted the keys before creating the script
151 2012-11-19 17:12:56 <kjj_> each output can be used only once
152 2012-11-19 17:13:05 <sipa> Godzilla123: what is the difference between a unique or repeated output or input?
153 2012-11-19 17:13:12 <Godzilla123> sipa: ok that clears it up
154 2012-11-19 17:13:12 <sipa> they are just pieces of data
155 2012-11-19 17:13:42 <kjj_> so you can refer to different outputs from the same transaction in your input list, but you can't use any of them more than once (ever, not just in a given transaction)
156 2012-11-19 17:14:12 <Godzilla123> <sipa> the different outputs referenced by the inputs of one transaction may but are not requured to belong to the same former transaction
157 2012-11-19 17:14:19 <Godzilla123> this is what I want to know
158 2012-11-19 17:15:25 <kjj_> you have three transactions, each with three outputs.  A.1, A.2, A.3, B.1, B.2, B.3, C.1, C.2, C.3.  You can create a new transaction spending any combination of them.  A.1+A.2+B.3 is fine.  but A.1+A.1 is not because each one can only be used once
159 2012-11-19 17:15:26 <sipa> you can consume outputs created by the same transaction
160 2012-11-19 17:15:43 <Godzilla123> it would not make sense to repeat outputs in a tx, as they can be combined into one
161 2012-11-19 17:15:44 <Godzilla123> it would not make sense to repeat outputs in a tx, as they can be combined into one
162 2012-11-19 17:15:55 <sipa> surebit makes sense
163 2012-11-19 17:16:09 <sipa> if you want to be able to spend the pieces separately
164 2012-11-19 17:16:25 <sipa> "unspent transacrion outputs" are sometikes called coins
165 2012-11-19 17:16:38 <sipa> so transactions create and consuke coins
166 2012-11-19 17:16:41 <sipa> consume
167 2012-11-19 17:17:24 <kjj_> sweet.  got my offline createmultisig function to match the output of bitcoind
168 2012-11-19 17:18:28 <kjj_> trying to decide if I want to tackle compressed pubkeys and WIFs next, or if I just want to keep on with the uncompressed functions that I know and trust
169 2012-11-19 17:18:33 <Godzilla123> thanks. Basically my original question was the one-to-one correspondence between outputs of one tx and inputs of another
170 2012-11-19 17:18:47 <Godzilla123> And it was cleared
171 2012-11-19 17:18:57 <sipa> yw
172 2012-11-19 17:19:24 <Godzilla123> it makes senst to have one output referenced only once to avoid double spending
173 2012-11-19 17:20:37 <sipa> in combination with more complex transactions it's really the only way
174 2012-11-19 17:20:53 <sipa> as you can't have well-defined balances per address anymore
175 2012-11-19 17:21:34 <kjj_> sipa: I'm going to try to write a boot camp tutorial using the raw transaction API.  these questions come up pretty often, and doing it yourself seems to be the best teacher
176 2012-11-19 17:24:45 <kjj_> you know, in my copious free time
177 2012-11-19 18:34:08 <Godzilla123> kjj_: sipa is there any reason, why an input in a transaction refers to exactly one output of a prev transaction?
178 2012-11-19 18:34:18 <Godzilla123> why not more?
179 2012-11-19 18:36:03 <Godzilla123> and 2nd question. How do we check that the referenced output is not referenced more than once in some earlier transaction
180 2012-11-19 18:42:08 <helo> Godzilla123: i think that's just the definition that is used for an input: an unspent output from a previous transaction. you can use multiple inputs in a tx, so it doesn't really limit anything
181 2012-11-19 18:43:24 <Godzilla123> helo: Yes I understand, but how do we enforce this, suppose someone has referenced that output in another block?
182 2012-11-19 18:43:32 <helo> Godzilla123: and for 2: the client just keeps track of the set of unspent transaction outputs. if an input in a new transaction isn't there, the transaction isn't valid
183 2012-11-19 18:44:26 <Godzilla123> ok
184 2012-11-19 18:45:28 <Godzilla123> so the client keeps this list of unspend outputs all the time
185 2012-11-19 18:46:21 <helo> yes
186 2012-11-19 18:48:19 <sipa> Godzilla123: well because you need to provide the signature for precisely that output
187 2012-11-19 18:48:45 <sipa> Godzilla123: if you'd reference multiple inputs, you'd still need to provide a signature for each
188 2012-11-19 18:49:10 <sipa> there is no point in combining them
189 2012-11-19 18:49:18 <Godzilla123> sipa: which question is this regarding?
190 2012-11-19 18:50:12 <Godzilla123> the first one
191 2012-11-19 18:50:16 <Godzilla123> I guess
192 2012-11-19 18:50:48 <Godzilla123> sipa: yes that makes sense
193 2012-11-19 18:51:36 <Godzilla123> sipa: its just a matter of convention. I thought there was a deeper logic
194 2012-11-19 18:51:45 <Godzilla123> as in the other way round.. (to avoid double spending)
195 2012-11-19 18:53:10 <Godzilla123> https://en.bitcoin.it/w/images/en/6/67/Transaction.png this makes it clear
196 2012-11-19 19:02:57 <Luke-Jr> block 210000 should be the first 25 BTC block, right? that's what we concluded the other day?
197 2012-11-19 19:03:04 <Godzilla123> I guess the inputs can also refer to outputs in other unconfirmed transactions
198 2012-11-19 19:03:05 <Godzilla123> I guess the inputs can also refer to outputs in other unconfirmed transactions
199 2012-11-19 19:10:36 <xorgate> one would suspect the start to be at block 0
200 2012-11-19 19:16:40 <helo> Godzilla123: yes, they can
201 2012-11-19 19:22:56 <sipa> Luke-Jr: correct
202 2012-11-19 20:00:28 <D34TH> hey sipa, does importprivkey rescan so it shows the correct balance? if not, why?
203 2012-11-19 20:00:38 <kjj_> yes, it does
204 2012-11-19 20:00:54 <D34TH> thanks kjj_
205 2012-11-19 20:01:22 <D34TH> while i was taking a shower the idea popped in my head and if it wasnt implemented, i was going to suggest it
206 2012-11-19 20:02:01 <kjj_> I think one of the pull requests adds a birthday to keys, and lets you specify it when importing.  to avoid the lengthy full rescan
207 2012-11-19 20:02:04 <DMCommit> [DiabloMiner] Diablo-D3 pushed 4 new commits to master: http://git.io/1B8-2w
208 2012-11-19 20:04:35 <joepie91> anyone knows if there is some kind of development channel for BitcoinArmory?
209 2012-11-19 20:04:48 <joepie91> or some kind of fork that rapes your RAM less
210 2012-11-19 20:04:51 <joepie91> :P
211 2012-11-19 20:10:31 <helo> to ensure i'm not giving out bad advice... is running HEAD with a (backed-up) wallet with some coin in it, but not creating any transactions, foolish?
212 2012-11-19 20:14:58 <kjj_> HEAD?
213 2012-11-19 20:16:43 <kjj_> sweet!
214 2012-11-19 20:18:14 <kjj_> all of my offline key stuff works with compressed pubkeys
215 2012-11-19 20:19:13 <maaku> helo: no, but you're probably doing something foolish that put you in that situation
216 2012-11-19 20:20:27 <helo> just someone interested in the speedups that will be in 0.8
217 2012-11-19 20:20:28 <helo> just someone interested in the speedups that will be in 0.8
218 2012-11-19 20:29:36 <kjj_> the data: URI type is now officially my favorite
219 2012-11-19 20:38:05 <edcba> kjj_: it became supported by IE ?
220 2012-11-19 20:38:15 <Luke-Jr> gavinandresen: ping?
221 2012-11-19 20:39:29 <kjj_> what's IE?
222 2012-11-19 20:42:32 <kjj_> witness the power of the data: URI.  http://www.jerviss.org/bitcointalk.org/keyB.html
223 2012-11-19 20:47:26 <kjj_> I've been working on scripts to generate new offline multisig keys.  now with embedded 128B and QR codes for ease of entry off paper
224 2012-11-19 20:48:05 <kjj_> that key and address is live, by the way.  if anyone wants to guess one of the other two keys before my return gets confirmed, there is 0.1 BTC in it for you
225 2012-11-19 22:41:32 <Karmaon> enhancement!