1 2012-11-28 00:00:00 <sipa> which mining pools use coinbase payouts? eligius, p2pool, ... any others?
2 2012-11-28 00:00:01 <sipa> which mining pools use coinbase payouts? eligius, p2pool, ... any others?
3 2012-11-28 00:00:02 <kjj> sipa: what I'm talking about is when you load a pubkey and chain code onto a smartcard (just an example of a pathetic little CPU)
4 2012-11-28 00:00:38 <Luke-Jr> Karmaon_: no, there is no secure way to do that really
5 2012-11-28 00:00:39 <Luke-Jr> Karmaon_: no, there is no secure way to do that really
6 2012-11-28 00:00:42 <sipa> kjj: well they need to do EC multiplications anyway, which is a lot harder than reconstructing y
7 2012-11-28 00:00:43 <sipa> kjj: well they need to do EC multiplications anyway, which is a lot harder than reconstructing y
8 2012-11-28 00:01:08 <sipa> kjj: but yes, it's true
9 2012-11-28 00:01:09 <sipa> kjj: but yes, it's true
10 2012-11-28 00:02:26 <kjj> sipa: hmm, I thought that solving the square root in EC was a LOT more work than just doing a single multiply
11 2012-11-28 00:02:27 <kjj> sipa: hmm, I thought that solving the square root in EC was a LOT more work than just doing a single multiply
12 2012-11-28 00:02:46 <sipa> kjj: it's solving a square root mod p
13 2012-11-28 00:02:47 <sipa> kjj: it's solving a square root mod p
14 2012-11-28 00:02:49 <sipa> not in EC
15 2012-11-28 00:02:50 <sipa> not in EC
16 2012-11-28 00:03:04 <kjj> but not so much more than a user would be put off waiting for it to happen, provided the device has enough power to do the multiplication in a reasonable time
17 2012-11-28 00:03:05 <kjj> but not so much more than a user would be put off waiting for it to happen, provided the device has enough power to do the multiplication in a reasonable time
18 2012-11-28 00:03:25 <sipa> (EC is multiplication of numbers and points, a square or square root makes no sense there)
19 2012-11-28 00:04:19 <kjj> heh. I don't do this stuff much, I tend to talk about the field and the curve in the same terms.
20 2012-11-28 00:04:20 <kjj> heh. I don't do this stuff much, I tend to talk about the field and the curve in the same terms.
21 2012-11-28 00:06:06 <kjj> maybe I just need to look at a more clever implementation for modsqrt. at any rate, that was the only possible objection that I saw having any potential, and not enough, even when I thought that it was harder than ECmul
22 2012-11-28 00:06:07 <kjj> maybe I just need to look at a more clever implementation for modsqrt. at any rate, that was the only possible objection that I saw having any potential, and not enough, even when I thought that it was harder than ECmul
23 2012-11-28 00:06:54 <sipa> i estimate that an EC multiplication is around 2 orders of magnitude harder :)
24 2012-11-28 00:07:07 <sipa> (though i never implemented either...)
25 2012-11-28 00:08:04 <kjj> anyhow, time for me to go home. been up for ~22 hours and I want to drive home while my 3rd wind is still active
26 2012-11-28 00:15:42 <theymos> luke-jr: You figure out what happened with blockexplorer.com's blk database?
27 2012-11-28 00:16:55 <Luke-Jr> theymos: maybe. gmaxwell had a theory at the meetup
28 2012-11-28 00:16:56 <Luke-Jr> theymos: maybe. gmaxwell had a theory at the meetup
29 2012-11-28 00:17:03 <Luke-Jr> theymos: were you by any chance deleting blkindex.dat?
30 2012-11-28 00:17:16 <theymos> Not that I know of.
31 2012-11-28 00:17:19 <Luke-Jr> hmm
32 2012-11-28 00:17:20 <Luke-Jr> hmm
33 2012-11-28 00:17:30 <Luke-Jr> theymos: can you verify? I think stat should tell you when the file is created
34 2012-11-28 00:19:27 <theymos> I deleted the original blkindex.dat and didn't save the timestamp info.
35 2012-11-28 00:21:06 <theymos> I'm pretty sure that my scripts would never delete blkindex.dat without deleting the other .dat files.
36 2012-11-28 00:21:07 <theymos> I'm pretty sure that my scripts would never delete blkindex.dat without deleting the other .dat files.
37 2012-11-28 00:22:10 <Luke-Jr> the problem stopped then?
38 2012-11-28 00:22:11 <Luke-Jr> the problem stopped then?
39 2012-11-28 00:22:17 <theymos> Yes.
40 2012-11-28 00:22:19 <theymos> Disk corruption, maybe? Running BBE seems to kill disks -- I've gone through 2-3 already.
41 2012-11-28 00:22:25 <Diablo-D3> ha ha theymos broke something
42 2012-11-28 00:22:26 <Diablo-D3> ha ha theymos broke something
43 2012-11-28 00:22:38 <Luke-Jr> hmm
44 2012-11-28 00:22:39 <Luke-Jr> hmm
45 2012-11-28 00:22:42 <Luke-Jr> I'll have to look into it more
46 2012-11-28 00:22:43 <Luke-Jr> I'll have to look into it more
47 2012-11-28 00:22:46 <sipa> use ZFS!
48 2012-11-28 00:22:47 <sipa> use ZFS!
49 2012-11-28 00:22:53 <Luke-Jr> gmaxwell's theory sounded so convincing I stopped looking <.<
50 2012-11-28 00:22:54 <Luke-Jr> gmaxwell's theory sounded so convincing I stopped looking <.<
51 2012-11-28 00:22:55 <Diablo-D3> fuck yeah zfs
52 2012-11-28 00:23:06 <sipa> ACTION zZzZ
53 2012-11-28 00:23:07 <sipa> ACTION zZzZ
54 2012-11-28 00:23:18 <theymos> luke-jr: You think it's probably some database bug and not a DoS attack?
55 2012-11-28 00:23:19 <theymos> luke-jr: You think it's probably some database bug and not a DoS attack?
56 2012-11-28 00:23:59 <gmaxwell> theymos: luke found the files were filled with valid blocks. That doesn't completely preclude a DoS attack but it makes it seem much less likely... as I couldn't find any obvious way to keep writing the same blocks if the database was still there.
57 2012-11-28 00:24:02 <Luke-Jr> theymos: or both
58 2012-11-28 00:24:03 <Luke-Jr> theymos: or both
59 2012-11-28 00:27:20 <Diablo-D3> ;;halfreward
60 2012-11-28 00:27:21 <Diablo-D3> ;;halfreward
61 2012-11-28 00:27:21 <gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Wed Nov 28 19:17:21 2012 UTC | Time remaining: 17 hours, 50 minutes, and 0 seconds.
62 2012-11-28 00:27:22 <gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Wed Nov 28 19:17:21 2012 UTC | Time remaining: 17 hours, 50 minutes, and 0 seconds.
63 2012-11-28 00:28:44 <sipa> ;;bc,blocks
64 2012-11-28 00:28:45 <gribble> 209893
65 2012-11-28 00:28:45 <sipa> ;;bc,blocks
66 2012-11-28 00:31:39 <theymos> gmaxwell: Sounds like maybe some strange problem with BBE's server then. Much less interesting than a DoS attack. :( I'll have to watch to see if something like that happens again. Thanks for looking into it.
67 2012-11-28 00:49:51 <etotheipi_> sipa: one other thing about BIP 32, which I don't think we ever resolved...
68 2012-11-28 00:50:10 <etotheipi_> you specify a "fingerprint" but it's binary
69 2012-11-28 00:50:25 <etotheipi_> and I'd like to specify an ASCII representation of it
70 2012-11-28 00:50:53 <etotheipi_> so that there is a human-identifiable way to refer to wallets (such as wallet 2Bdjk542)
71 2012-11-28 00:51:17 <etotheipi_> also I'd like a few more bytes in the in fingerprint than 4, to avoid collisions... but I don't know if I can avoid that entirely without going to 16 bytes
72 2012-11-28 00:55:20 <fiesh> is there a standardzied way to create a wallet that does not contain the private keys any more, so that one can comfortably use a bitcoind to follow balances without having to actually use a "hot" wallet?
73 2012-11-28 00:56:06 <etotheipi_> fiesh: www.bitcoinarmory.com
74 2012-11-28 00:56:47 <etotheipi_> create a wallet on a computer that never touches the internet, then create a watching-only copy to put on your online computer
75 2012-11-28 00:57:01 <etotheipi_> you can generate addresses with the watching-only wallet, and confirm incoming payments
76 2012-11-28 00:57:37 <etotheipi_> and use a USB key to shuttle unsigned transactions to the offline computer for signing
77 2012-11-28 00:58:51 <fiesh> etotheipi_: hmm, it doesn't have any rpc interface, does it? I don't want some graphical front end and that
78 2012-11-28 00:59:03 <etotheipi_> fiesh: no rpc interface
79 2012-11-28 00:59:15 <etotheipi_> didn't realize you were looking for that
80 2012-11-28 00:59:22 <etotheipi_> it has a python interface though
81 2012-11-28 00:59:23 <etotheipi_> it has a python interface though
82 2012-11-28 00:59:36 <etotheipi_> there's a thread I can link you to about setting up an Armory server
83 2012-11-28 01:00:04 <etotheipi_> or rather, how to create and access Armory wallets like this from a webserver
84 2012-11-28 01:00:12 <etotheipi_> (or any process)
85 2012-11-28 01:00:29 <fiesh> hmm, if you have the link, I'll take a look, thanks
86 2012-11-28 01:00:38 <etotheipi_> if you don't use python.... not much for you there :-/
87 2012-11-28 01:00:47 <fiesh> heh then never mind ;) but thanks
88 2012-11-28 01:00:48 <fiesh> heh then never mind ;) but thanks
89 2012-11-28 01:01:08 <fiesh> seems like a feature one would expect in the standard bitcoind -- strip a wallet of its private keys
90 2012-11-28 01:01:17 <etotheipi_> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=92496.0
91 2012-11-28 01:01:29 <etotheipi_> actually I think mav did create an RPC interface to it
92 2012-11-28 01:01:35 <fiesh> or, probably better, just allow the specification of addresses to be used in accounts, without having the private key
93 2012-11-28 01:02:21 <etotheipi_> fiesh: this is why I made Armory -- I couldn't believe that no one else was making such a system
94 2012-11-28 01:02:38 <etotheipi_> plus I had a lot of other ideas to integrate... like deterministic wallets so you only have to backup your wallet once, ever
95 2012-11-28 01:02:42 <fiesh> etotheipi_: hehe yes
96 2012-11-28 01:02:58 <fiesh> etotheipi_: yes that's really neat for users
97 2012-11-28 01:03:24 <etotheipi_> fiesh: mav posted his Armory mod to github and it does have a RPC interface similar to bitcoind: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=92496.20
98 2012-11-28 01:03:52 <etotheipi_> one day, I'll merge it into the main branch...
99 2012-11-28 01:04:34 <fiesh> etotheipi_: the features of armory are really nice
100 2012-11-28 01:04:39 <fiesh> oh, thanks, I'll take a look!
101 2012-11-28 01:05:16 <etotheipi_> fiesh: yeah, the problem (from your perspective) is that it's more directed at desktop users
102 2012-11-28 01:05:17 <etotheipi_> fiesh: yeah, the problem (from your perspective) is that it's more directed at desktop users
103 2012-11-28 01:05:37 <fiesh> yes
104 2012-11-28 01:06:20 <etotheipi_> but I did market it as being useful for webservers, etc, I just hadn't gotten around to developing that part of it, yet
105 2012-11-28 01:06:28 <etotheipi_> apparently mav started that for me:)
106 2012-11-28 01:06:57 <fiesh> the deterministic wallet approach is actually very interesting for professional use
107 2012-11-28 01:07:40 <fiesh> so a server can produce as many addresses as desirable without having the private key for a single one
108 2012-11-28 01:07:46 <etotheipi_> exactly
109 2012-11-28 01:08:05 <fiesh> but it's not yet implemented?
110 2012-11-28 01:08:06 <etotheipi_> Bitcoin-Qt will soon have deterministic addresses, too; see https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/BIP_0032
111 2012-11-28 01:08:07 <etotheipi_> Bitcoin-Qt will soon have deterministic addresses, too; see https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/BIP_0032
112 2012-11-28 01:08:35 <etotheipi_> determinstic wallets are implemented, offline & watching-only wallets are implemented
113 2012-11-28 01:08:36 <etotheipi_> determinstic wallets are implemented, offline & watching-only wallets are implemented
114 2012-11-28 01:08:51 <etotheipi_> I just haven't implemented the direct pieces needed to make webservers, etc
115 2012-11-28 01:09:46 <fiesh> hmm that's really nice
116 2012-11-28 01:10:42 <etotheipi_> try the desktop version, get familiar with the features... all of that *can* be available in the webserver if you need it
117 2012-11-28 01:11:11 <fiesh> hehe yeah but I'm not really into using the desktop version, sorry ;) And I think I can master its features hehe
118 2012-11-28 01:11:12 <fiesh> hehe yeah but I'm not really into using the desktop version, sorry ;) And I think I can master its features hehe
119 2012-11-28 01:11:39 <etotheipi_> fiesh: fair enough
120 2012-11-28 01:12:43 <etotheipi_> I don't know your application, but it only takes a minute to create the wallet in offline mode and create watching-only wallet... then copy that to your webserver
121 2012-11-28 01:13:05 <fiesh> that might even be a software solution that can be marketed, an enterprise level bitcoin implementation that does all these things, not that I would want to develop it or pay for it though, hehe
122 2012-11-28 01:13:07 <etotheipi_> either way... let me know if you have any questions
123 2012-11-28 01:13:20 <fiesh> etotheipi_: is the watching only wallet still readable by bitcoind?
124 2012-11-28 01:13:27 <etotheipi_> fiesh: no
125 2012-11-28 01:13:35 <fiesh> :/
126 2012-11-28 01:13:36 <fiesh> :/
127 2012-11-28 01:13:41 <etotheipi_> fiesh: but it will be in the next couple months once we both upgrade our wallet formats
128 2012-11-28 01:13:51 <etotheipi_> but I don't know if Bitcoin-Qt will be supporting watching-only wallets at all
129 2012-11-28 01:13:52 <etotheipi_> but I don't know if Bitcoin-Qt will be supporting watching-only wallets at all
130 2012-11-28 01:13:56 <fiesh> that's good, so I'll have to wait a little
131 2012-11-28 01:13:57 <fiesh> that's good, so I'll have to wait a little
132 2012-11-28 01:14:13 <etotheipi_> if Bitcoin-Qt supported it, you wouldn't need Armory :)
133 2012-11-28 01:14:29 <fiesh> well if it supports deterministic addresses, it amounts to the same thing, given that one can remove the initial private key?
134 2012-11-28 01:14:31 <etotheipi_> oh, you should look into Electrum too
135 2012-11-28 01:14:59 <fiesh> hmm that's an interesting reference, thanks!
136 2012-11-28 01:15:08 <etotheipi_> I think it does split wallets like that too
137 2012-11-28 01:15:12 <etotheipi_> and may be better for webservers
138 2012-11-28 01:15:26 <etotheipi_> I'm sure others here could speak to that more
139 2012-11-28 01:16:56 <gavinandresen> fiesh: if you encrypt a wallet.dat with a random key and then throw away the key it is essentially a watching-only wallet
140 2012-11-28 01:17:18 <gavinandresen> (copy it somewhere before encrypting, of course)
141 2012-11-28 01:17:45 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: but the watching-only and full wallets will not generate the same addresses
142 2012-11-28 01:17:46 <fiesh> gavinandresen: hmm yes, that's a simpler approach, thanks
143 2012-11-28 01:17:53 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: I'd appreciate feedback on the Invoices/Receipts/Payments proposal, if you have time
144 2012-11-28 01:18:06 <fiesh> so I just have to create a million addresses in advance ;)
145 2012-11-28 01:18:13 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: the watching-only can't generate new addresses if it is always encrypted
146 2012-11-28 01:18:23 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: I've been absorbing it... but my experience with this part of the crypto world is not very exhaustive
147 2012-11-28 01:18:30 <fiesh> deterministic watching-only would be better, but good enough I guess
148 2012-11-28 01:19:31 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: the crypto part is pretty trivial, I'd like feedback on if it is something you can see Armory supporting (do you already use OpenSSL? Protocol buffers?)
149 2012-11-28 01:19:35 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: I want what you are proposing, and I'm willing to support it in Armory, I just don't know if I can contribute to the discussion
150 2012-11-28 01:20:10 <etotheipi_> I don't use either OpenSSL or protocol buffers, but they should both be pretty easy to pull in
151 2012-11-28 01:20:11 <etotheipi_> I don't use either OpenSSL or protocol buffers, but they should both be pretty easy to pull in
152 2012-11-28 01:20:18 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: cool, I just want to make sure nobody who has actually done the work of implementing a client takes a look at it and says "NO WAY NO HOW!"
153 2012-11-28 01:20:19 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: cool, I just want to make sure nobody who has actually done the work of implementing a client takes a look at it and says "NO WAY NO HOW!"
154 2012-11-28 01:21:30 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: I've secretly been looking for an excuse to switch Armory to OpenSSL anyway
155 2012-11-28 01:21:45 <etotheipi_> I'm using the Crypto++ library, which has turned out to be pretty darned slow
156 2012-11-28 01:21:49 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: (I won't tell anybody, that'll be our little secret)
157 2012-11-28 01:23:13 <etotheipi_> I think it's a factor of 10 speed diff
158 2012-11-28 01:23:14 <etotheipi_> I think it's a factor of 10 speed diff
159 2012-11-28 01:30:16 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: how do you feel about creating a unified message-signing protocol?
160 2012-11-28 01:31:59 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: dunno, haven't thought about it. You mean generalizing to: given message m and some public key data p, you get a message with (m,p) signed with signature s ?
161 2012-11-28 01:32:06 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: like I have here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=56424.msg795036#msg795036
162 2012-11-28 01:32:31 <etotheipi_> it doesn't have to be exactly like that... but some way that unambiguously defines both a signature, what is being signed, and by what address
163 2012-11-28 01:32:47 <gavinandresen> ah. I don't see the benefit of signing with addresses.
164 2012-11-28 01:33:04 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: what do you mean?
165 2012-11-28 01:33:12 <etotheipi_> what do you sign with?
166 2012-11-28 01:33:26 <gavinandresen> in the Invoices proposal? SSL certificates.
167 2012-11-28 01:33:40 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: no, general message signing, not related to tthat proposal
168 2012-11-28 01:33:51 <etotheipi_> (sorry, should've made clear I was switching contexts on you)
169 2012-11-28 01:33:52 <etotheipi_> (sorry, should've made clear I was switching contexts on you)
170 2012-11-28 01:34:12 <gavinandresen> oh, you mean to prove that you own a bitcoin address?
171 2012-11-28 01:35:06 <etotheipi_> I don't like to think of it as "proving you own an address", but sending messages that could've only been created by the owner of that address (such as a cashout request with cashout address for some online service)
172 2012-11-28 01:35:54 <gavinandresen> got it. Umm.... not high on my priority list, but I'm not opposed to some standard way of doing it.
173 2012-11-28 01:36:31 <gavinandresen> I'm not a fan of the gpg ASCII-armored style for encoding...
174 2012-11-28 01:37:46 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: another little secret, don't tell anybody: https://gist.github.com/4073937
175 2012-11-28 01:38:40 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: what would you prefer? It seems like an ideal style for transmitting such data
176 2012-11-28 01:38:45 <gavinandresen> (related to the idea of "sending messages that could've only been created by the owner")
177 2012-11-28 01:39:12 <etotheipi_> for both BIP 10 and message signing, I ended up just implementing what met my own needs, because no one else wanted to help develop a more-versatile version
178 2012-11-28 01:39:25 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: protocol buffers are pretty spiffy; extensible, modern, easy to program in any language...
179 2012-11-28 01:39:43 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: for message signing, I want something that is clear text
180 2012-11-28 01:40:17 <etotheipi_> one of the main uses of it would be User:"Request payout", Server:"Please sign this message", User:"Okay, here it is"
181 2012-11-28 01:40:18 <etotheipi_> one of the main uses of it would be User:"Request payout", Server:"Please sign this message", User:"Okay, here it is"
182 2012-11-28 01:40:20 <gavinandresen> uff. Too late at night to get into a clear text versus binary for signing discussion. I started the day with that discussion.
183 2012-11-28 01:40:38 <etotheipi_> I don't want them copying around random byte strings
184 2012-11-28 01:40:41 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: no worries
185 2012-11-28 01:40:58 <gavinandresen> if they have to copy and paste then, in my view, the UI has failed.
186 2012-11-28 01:40:59 <etotheipi_> it's not high on my prioirty list either...
187 2012-11-28 01:41:00 <etotheipi_> it's not high on my prioirty list either...
188 2012-11-28 01:41:13 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: I think there should be a URI version of it too
189 2012-11-28 01:41:53 <gavinandresen> URI version of public_key+message+signature?
190 2012-11-28 01:42:27 <etotheipi_> yes, to accomplish what I just said (server requests a signed confirmation of some action)
191 2012-11-28 01:42:28 <gavinandresen> The Javascript Object Signing and Encryption working group at the IETF has a JSON-based URI version of their stuff...
192 2012-11-28 01:42:46 <gavinandresen> ... but it scares the pants off me.
193 2012-11-28 01:44:02 <etotheipi_> I was thinking the URI version would simply be: signThisText+withThisAddress+sendSigToThisServer
194 2012-11-28 01:44:24 <etotheipi_> and the client would then present the user with what is expected to be signed, and then when they do it, it can dump the result where it was requested...
195 2012-11-28 01:45:20 <etotheipi_> but I don't think it's ridiculous to think that power users might want to manually handle these sigs ... one person creates a signature block and emails it t osomeone else
196 2012-11-28 01:45:30 <gavinandresen> for payouts?
197 2012-11-28 01:45:37 <etotheipi_> for anything account-related
198 2012-11-28 01:45:55 <etotheipi_> you have any kind of account, and you fund it with some initial address
199 2012-11-28 01:46:09 <etotheipi_> then all account actions from there forward would be expected to be confirmed with a sig from that address
200 2012-11-28 01:46:09 <gavinandresen> mmm. I dunno, go too far and you'll reinvent OAuth
201 2012-11-28 01:46:32 <etotheipi_> I don't know what that is... but it does enable completely anonymous online services
202 2012-11-28 01:47:07 <etotheipi_> you no longer need an email address or identity to open account... you just have to be able to sign messages with the initial funding address
203 2012-11-28 01:47:30 <etotheipi_> (I know anonymity is not a central goal of the project, but it's still elegant in my opinion)
204 2012-11-28 01:47:31 <etotheipi_> (I know anonymity is not a central goal of the project, but it's still elegant in my opinion)
205 2012-11-28 01:49:19 <gavinandresen> OAuth (and OAuth2) are designed as secure ways to grant access to accounts, with notions like authorization tokens that can be revoked in case you change your mind and don't actually want Twitter reading your facebook posts (or whatever)
206 2012-11-28 01:49:54 <jgarzik> gmaxwell: To be fair, picocoin does not have a node, really. picocoin is largely an offline client. Of course, the bits that are missing are easy to create, if you can write a Unix TCP server....
207 2012-11-28 01:49:57 <gavinandresen> I'm pretty sure you could use them to give anonymous access to accounts, and they've spent years thinking about how to do it right.
208 2012-11-28 01:50:29 <jgarzik> picocoin's lib already does the network messages and other bits needed to create a fast block relay server
209 2012-11-28 01:50:31 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: I'll look into it
210 2012-11-28 01:50:35 <jgarzik> just need the non-bitcoin bits :)
211 2012-11-28 01:50:36 <jgarzik> just need the non-bitcoin bits :)
212 2012-11-28 01:52:24 <gavinandresen> etotheipi_: of course they probably have a gazillion features that aren't relevant to the problem you want to solve...
213 2012-11-28 01:53:13 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: well you already have a message signing interface in Bitcoin-Qt... I was just suggesting you expand it with something more user-friendly
214 2012-11-28 01:53:35 <etotheipi_> i.e. something that won't fail because of whitespace differences, etc
215 2012-11-28 01:53:36 <etotheipi_> i.e. something that won't fail because of whitespace differences, etc
216 2012-11-28 01:53:39 <etotheipi_> it doesn't have to be my way
217 2012-11-28 01:53:39 <gavinandresen> jgarzik: is it just me, or does 2112 on the forums TRY to be annoying?
218 2012-11-28 01:53:40 <gavinandresen> jgarzik: is it just me, or does 2112 on the forums TRY to be annoying?
219 2012-11-28 01:55:07 <jgarzik> gavinandresen: indeed :/ _Just_ now was in the process of deep breathing, after reading yet another of his messages in my new picocoin thread.
220 2012-11-28 01:55:43 <gavinandresen> jgarzik: "Here, let me tell you how to do your job. Sorry I can't help, I'm too busy."
221 2012-11-28 01:56:03 <jgarzik> pretty much :)
222 2012-11-28 01:56:10 <gmaxwell> wow, that post is pretty impressive.
223 2012-11-28 01:56:29 <gmaxwell> Just needs a few randomly placed "lol"s to complete the irritation full monty.
224 2012-11-28 01:56:30 <gmaxwell> Just needs a few randomly placed "lol"s to complete the irritation full monty.
225 2012-11-28 01:57:54 <etotheipi_> gavinandresen: I'm not convinced that your OAuth reference is in the same scope -- I'm thinking of things as simple as: I ordered something online, and something went wrong and need a refund or change shipping address. So I email the merchant with a signature block telling them what to do...
226 2012-11-28 01:58:38 <jgarzik> The appropriate reply to 2112 is "you have no fscking clue what you are talking about, and $here's $why" ;p
227 2012-11-28 01:58:48 <jgarzik> I mainly reply to him for other readers, not him
228 2012-11-28 01:58:49 <jgarzik> I mainly reply to him for other readers, not him
229 2012-11-28 01:58:54 <etotheipi_> it kind of accomplishes the reverse of the invoice proposal ...
230 2012-11-28 01:58:55 <etotheipi_> it kind of accomplishes the reverse of the invoice proposal ...
231 2012-11-28 01:59:48 <etotheipi_> we already have 90% of it, I just wanted to expand it to be a little easier to use that copying raw hex strings around
232 2012-11-28 01:59:49 <etotheipi_> we already have 90% of it, I just wanted to expand it to be a little easier to use that copying raw hex strings around
233 2012-11-28 02:44:01 <grondilu> Bitcoin address validation on rosetta-code: http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Bitcoin/address_validation
234 2012-11-28 02:44:13 <grondilu> ^ add yours :)
235 2012-11-28 02:47:10 <jgarzik> BFL update ("chips flawed... delay"): https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/437-asic-update-26-november-2012-a.html
236 2012-11-28 02:49:17 <jgarzik> forum sure is slow
237 2012-11-28 02:50:58 <jgarzik> picocoin report out of the blue: "Everything builds and tests pass on MacOS X 10.7."
238 2012-11-28 02:51:01 <jgarzik> w00t
239 2012-11-28 02:51:02 <jgarzik> w00t
240 2012-11-28 03:03:35 <i18n> oh yeah, i meant to try that on my mac
241 2012-11-28 03:03:47 <i18n> last time i tried it i got 'failed to start engine'
242 2012-11-28 03:05:12 <jgarzik> i18n: about the most exciting thing it can do is pass tests ;-)
243 2012-11-28 03:05:17 <jgarzik> i18n: but that was a big step
244 2012-11-28 03:05:54 <i18n> well if i understand it correctly it seems very cool
245 2012-11-28 03:06:27 <i18n> i'm on 10.8 here anything i can do to help test it?
246 2012-11-28 03:06:54 <jgarzik> i18n: if you can run "make all check" on 10.8, that would be useful
247 2012-11-28 03:07:25 <jgarzik> i18n: build should be familiar, it's autotools: ./autogen.sh ; ./configure ; make -s all check
248 2012-11-28 03:07:37 <jgarzik> Let me know if autogen.sh fails... I can provide a tarball that skips that step
249 2012-11-28 03:08:01 <i18n> autogen works but it gives 3 warnings of the samething
250 2012-11-28 03:08:07 <i18n> lib/Makefile.am:2: warning: 'INCLUDES' is the old name for 'AM_CPPFLAGS' (or '*_CPPFLAGS')
251 2012-11-28 03:08:38 <i18n> All 13 tests passed
252 2012-11-28 03:08:39 <i18n> All 13 tests passed
253 2012-11-28 03:09:22 <jgarzik> yay
254 2012-11-28 03:09:34 <jgarzik> ACTION makes a note re AM_CPPFLAGS
255 2012-11-28 03:09:41 <jgarzik> that warning sounds accurate to me
256 2012-11-28 03:10:17 <jgarzik> now to find someone on BSD...
257 2012-11-28 03:10:18 <jgarzik> ;p
258 2012-11-28 03:10:25 <jgarzik> where is jrmithdobbs when you need him
259 2012-11-28 03:10:31 <i18n> i have an account on a server running freebsd :)
260 2012-11-28 03:10:33 <i18n> friend's server
261 2012-11-28 03:10:34 <i18n> friend's server
262 2012-11-28 03:10:53 <i18n> want me to do the same thing there?
263 2012-11-28 03:10:54 <i18n> want me to do the same thing there?
264 2012-11-28 03:11:24 <jgarzik> i18n: if you don't mind... sure! If autogen.sh fails on BSD, "make dist" on OSX should give you a tarball with working configure script
265 2012-11-28 03:11:26 <i18n> does it actually work yet? i tried running netsync a while ago and just now and i'm getting 'failed to start engine'
266 2012-11-28 03:11:41 <jgarzik> i18n: client does not work yet, no
267 2012-11-28 03:11:45 <i18n> aww
268 2012-11-28 03:12:05 <i18n> that explains the lack of documentation
269 2012-11-28 03:12:23 <jgarzik> well it half works. you can generate an address, and receive payments. but without being able to spend payments, that's a bit useless ;p
270 2012-11-28 03:12:27 <i18n> jgarzik: same three warnings
271 2012-11-28 03:12:28 <i18n> jgarzik: same three warnings
272 2012-11-28 03:13:04 <i18n> i think i have to have the friend install libevent and jansson... and maybe glib
273 2012-11-28 03:13:42 <jgarzik> i18n: bsd ports should likely have libevent and glib. not sure about jansson.
274 2012-11-28 03:13:54 <i18n> he gave me sudo but i don't know how to use ports
275 2012-11-28 03:14:33 <jgarzik> me either :/
276 2012-11-28 03:14:50 <jgarzik> ACTION just knows it's "that place where they stick software everybody needs" ;p
277 2012-11-28 03:15:09 <i18n> emerge libevent jansson
278 2012-11-28 03:16:24 <denisx> jgarzik: you someone with a freebsd machine?=
279 2012-11-28 03:17:27 <jgarzik> denisx: Would be nice to see what happens when you build picocoin on freebsd, yes. https://github.com/jgarzik/picocoin/
280 2012-11-28 03:17:37 <denisx> jgarzik: ok, I give it a go
281 2012-11-28 03:17:38 <denisx> jgarzik: ok, I give it a go
282 2012-11-28 03:18:13 <jgarzik> denisx: build should be familiar, it's autotools: ./autogen.sh ; ./configure ; make -s all check If autogen.sh fails, I can create a tarball for you, that skips that step.
283 2012-11-28 03:18:46 <denisx> autogen worked
284 2012-11-28 03:18:46 <jgarzik> denisx: deps: GLib (from GTK project), OpenSSL w/ ECDSA, libevent, jansson
285 2012-11-28 03:18:47 <denisx> autogen worked
286 2012-11-28 03:19:14 <denisx> libevent or libevent?
287 2012-11-28 03:19:15 <denisx> libevent or libevent?
288 2012-11-28 03:19:19 <denisx> libevent2?
289 2012-11-28 03:19:40 <jgarzik> denisx: libevent2 is what I use here
290 2012-11-28 03:19:44 <denisx> jgarzik: ok
291 2012-11-28 03:19:47 <jgarzik> libevent 1.x might work in a pinch
292 2012-11-28 03:19:48 <jgarzik> libevent 1.x might work in a pinch
293 2012-11-28 03:20:22 <denisx> I upgrded your pushpool last year to libevent2 after hunting for a memory leak
294 2012-11-28 03:20:28 <denisx> with libevent2 it went away
295 2012-11-28 03:20:57 <denisx> btw I'm using clang here already
296 2012-11-28 03:20:58 <denisx> btw I'm using clang here already
297 2012-11-28 03:21:17 <jgarzik> interesting += 2
298 2012-11-28 03:21:35 <jgarzik> denisx: I'd be happy to accept a pushpool pull request for that, FWIW
299 2012-11-28 03:23:05 <denisx> checking for event_base_new in -levent... no
300 2012-11-28 03:23:06 <denisx> checking for event_base_new in -levent... no
301 2012-11-28 03:23:28 <denisx> sure its libevent2?
302 2012-11-28 03:23:29 <denisx> sure its libevent2?
303 2012-11-28 03:24:04 <jgarzik> libevent-2.0.18-1.fc17.x86_64
304 2012-11-28 03:24:05 <jgarzik> libevent-devel-2.0.18-1.fc17.x86_64
305 2012-11-28 03:24:09 <denisx> ok
306 2012-11-28 03:24:45 <jgarzik> denisx: maybe they renamed the lib, on bsd?
307 2012-11-28 03:24:50 <denisx> no
308 2012-11-28 03:24:51 <denisx> no
309 2012-11-28 03:25:39 <jgarzik> odd
310 2012-11-28 03:27:08 <denisx> I think it simply does not know they are in /usr/local/lib...
311 2012-11-28 03:27:21 <denisx> same happened to jansson
312 2012-11-28 03:28:00 <denisx> dns.c: In function 'add_seed_addr':
313 2012-11-28 03:28:01 <denisx> dns.c: In function 'add_seed_addr':
314 2012-11-28 03:28:17 <denisx> also in 38
315 2012-11-28 03:28:30 <jgarzik> denisx: ah. so CFLAGS="-O2 -Wall -g -I/usr/include/include" LDFLAGS="-L/usr/local/lib" ./configure
316 2012-11-28 03:29:38 <jgarzik> denisx: /me guesses dns.c wants #include <netinet/in.h> or netinet/in6.h
317 2012-11-28 03:30:58 <denisx> installing jansson...
318 2012-11-28 03:30:59 <denisx> installing jansson...
319 2012-11-28 03:31:20 <denisx> and why you linux guys always assume that everybody uses bash? ;)
320 2012-11-28 03:31:52 <ThiagoCMC> is another shell out there?!
321 2012-11-28 03:31:56 <ThiagoCMC> =P
322 2012-11-28 03:32:05 <denisx> ThiagoCMC: thousands!
323 2012-11-28 03:32:06 <denisx> ThiagoCMC: thousands!
324 2012-11-28 03:32:14 <ThiagoCMC> =)
325 2012-11-28 03:32:31 <jgarzik> denisx: confirmed... dns.c needs #include <netinet/in.h>
326 2012-11-28 03:32:32 <jgarzik> denisx: confirmed... dns.c needs #include <netinet/in.h>
327 2012-11-28 03:32:40 <jgarzik> let me know if that fixes that one
328 2012-11-28 03:33:00 <denisx> <netinet/in.h> did help
329 2012-11-28 03:33:08 <denisx> ok, it builds fine
330 2012-11-28 03:33:09 <denisx> ok, it builds fine
331 2012-11-28 03:33:26 <denisx> oh wait, I was only in lib
332 2012-11-28 03:33:27 <denisx> oh wait, I was only in lib
333 2012-11-28 03:33:35 <denisx> main.c: In function 'list_dns_seeds':
334 2012-11-28 03:33:36 <denisx> main.c: In function 'list_dns_seeds':
335 2012-11-28 03:33:37 <denisx> main.c:174: error: storage size of 'saddr' isn't known
336 2012-11-28 03:33:39 <denisx> same thing I assume
337 2012-11-28 03:33:40 <denisx> same thing I assume
338 2012-11-28 03:34:42 <denisx> ok, I added netinet/in.h to main.c
339 2012-11-28 03:34:43 <denisx> ok, I added netinet/in.h to main.c
340 2012-11-28 03:34:48 <denisx> and then this:
341 2012-11-28 03:34:49 <denisx> and then this:
342 2012-11-28 03:34:51 <denisx> net.c:23:19: error: event.h: No such file or directory
343 2012-11-28 03:34:52 <denisx> net.c: In function 'nc_conn_free':
344 2012-11-28 03:35:23 <jgarzik> denisx: just downloaded libevent2 sources. I think the entire project needs s#event.h#event2/event.h#g
345 2012-11-28 03:35:27 <denisx> ah, your CFLAGS needs to be /usr/local/include and not /usr/include/include
346 2012-11-28 03:35:35 <jgarzik> heh
347 2012-11-28 03:35:48 <jgarzik> event.h is deprecated, but should still work
348 2012-11-28 03:36:02 <jgarzik> event2/event.h is preferred in libevent2, it seems
349 2012-11-28 03:37:34 <denisx> ok, problems with linking now:
350 2012-11-28 03:37:35 <denisx> wallet.o: In function `wallet_new':
351 2012-11-28 03:37:51 <denisx> home/denis/picocoin/src/wallet.c:29: undefined reference to `g_ptr_array_new_full'
352 2012-11-28 03:37:52 <denisx> home/denis/picocoin/src/wallet.c:29: undefined reference to `g_ptr_array_new_full'
353 2012-11-28 03:38:30 <denisx> home/denis/picocoin/lib/blkdb.c:241: undefined reference to `fdatasync'
354 2012-11-28 03:38:31 <denisx> home/denis/picocoin/lib/blkdb.c:241: undefined reference to `fdatasync'
355 2012-11-28 03:39:35 <jgarzik> denisx: OK, the latter is expected, and a bug that wants fixing. Just need to s/fdatasync/fsync/ on BSD
356 2012-11-28 03:39:53 <jgarzik> denisx: for the former... can you confirm that your libglib2 has at least _some_ g_ptr_array_* symbols?
357 2012-11-28 03:39:54 <jgarzik> denisx: for the former... can you confirm that your libglib2 has at least _some_ g_ptr_array_* symbols?
358 2012-11-28 03:40:20 <jgarzik> denisx: unclear whether your GLib is missing a new feature picocoin wants, or something else is broken
359 2012-11-28 03:40:49 <denisx> hmm, since configure did not check for glib2...
360 2012-11-28 03:40:50 <denisx> hmm, since configure did not check for glib2...
361 2012-11-28 03:41:24 <denisx> building it right now
362 2012-11-28 03:41:45 <jgarzik> denisx: configure should check for glib >= 2.0.0, but that may be insufficient
363 2012-11-28 03:41:57 <jgarzik> denisx: I need to add an fdatasync check to configure, definitely
364 2012-11-28 03:41:58 <jgarzik> denisx: I need to add an fdatasync check to configure, definitely
365 2012-11-28 03:42:36 <jgarzik> AC_CHECK_FUNCS(fdatasync)
366 2012-11-28 03:42:45 <jgarzik> hah! I do check for it. Just need to actually check the check ;-)
367 2012-11-28 03:46:32 <denisx> I had glib-2.28.8_3
368 2012-11-28 03:46:33 <denisx> I had glib-2.28.8_3
369 2012-11-28 03:46:37 <denisx> now Im building glib-2.28.8_4
370 2012-11-28 03:46:38 <denisx> now Im building glib-2.28.8_4
371 2012-11-28 03:56:50 <denisx> it has lots of g_ptr_array_* but not g_ptr_array_full
372 2012-11-28 03:57:44 <jgarzik> denisx: OK, sounds like my code requires an even newer GLib. can you tell me (or pastebin) what g_ptr_array_new* functions it does have?
373 2012-11-28 03:58:13 <jgarzik> denisx: I presume you mean g_ptr_array_new_full and not g_ptr_array_full ?
374 2012-11-28 03:58:27 <denisx> http://pastebin.com/1PSHn5s9
375 2012-11-28 03:58:47 <denisx> aeh, yes
376 2012-11-28 03:58:48 <denisx> aeh, yes
377 2012-11-28 04:07:05 <jgarzik> denisx: OK, good
378 2012-11-28 04:07:16 <jgarzik> denisx: it supports a freeing function (destructor)
379 2012-11-28 04:07:59 <jgarzik> denisx: g_ptr_array_new_full(n, func) may be safely replaced with g_ptr_array_new_with_free_func(func)
380 2012-11-28 04:08:10 <jgarzik> manually or via #define
381 2012-11-28 04:08:11 <jgarzik> manually or via #define
382 2012-11-28 04:14:53 <denisx> tata: src/picocoin: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (FreeBSD), dynamically linked (uses shared libs), for FreeBSD 9.1 (901501), not stripped
383 2012-11-28 04:14:59 <etotheipi_> did version 0.7.X change the way blkindex.dat is created/stored? I seem to be having an issue with blkindex.dat corruption...
384 2012-11-28 04:15:18 <etotheipi_> it seems to be kind of fragile
385 2012-11-28 04:16:00 <jgarzik> denisx: "make check" work?
386 2012-11-28 04:16:28 <denisx> All 13 tests passed
387 2012-11-28 04:16:29 <denisx> All 13 tests passed
388 2012-11-28 04:16:33 <denisx> (1 test was not run)
389 2012-11-28 04:16:34 <denisx> (1 test was not run)
390 2012-11-28 04:16:43 <denisx> SKIP: chain-verf
391 2012-11-28 04:16:44 <denisx> SKIP: chain-verf
392 2012-11-28 04:16:44 <jgarzik> denisx: hooray! that's the best goal, for now
393 2012-11-28 04:16:45 <jgarzik> denisx: hooray! that's the best goal, for now
394 2012-11-28 04:17:04 <jgarzik> denisx: I've pushed all BSD fixes out to git, except the GLib _new_full one, so far
395 2012-11-28 04:18:00 <gmaxwell> etotheipi_: more details?
396 2012-11-28 04:18:18 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: just more frequently am I observing it, usually due to VM crashing
397 2012-11-28 04:18:37 <etotheipi_> or system crashing
398 2012-11-28 04:18:47 <etotheipi_> just wondering if anything's changed, or if I'm just crashing more
399 2012-11-28 04:18:49 <etotheipi_> :)
400 2012-11-28 04:19:27 <denisx> the bsd diff: http://pastebin.com/hyhK3jmE
401 2012-11-28 04:19:28 <denisx> the bsd diff: http://pastebin.com/hyhK3jmE
402 2012-11-28 04:22:03 <jgarzik> denisx: thanks, this has been a great help
403 2012-11-28 04:22:09 <denisx> your welcome
404 2012-11-28 04:22:34 <jgarzik> denisx: it looks like I got all those except the _new_full change in git
405 2012-11-28 04:22:59 <jgarzik> denisx: any chance you could re-verify vanilla git builds, in about 5 min?
406 2012-11-28 04:23:08 <denisx> sure
407 2012-11-28 04:23:09 <denisx> sure
408 2012-11-28 04:25:15 <jgarzik> or maybe 15 min. gotta find when that func was added ;p
409 2012-11-28 04:25:16 <jgarzik> or maybe 15 min. gotta find when that func was added ;p
410 2012-11-28 04:25:26 <jgarzik> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/commits-list/2011-July/msg08239.html
411 2012-11-28 04:26:59 <jgarzik> 2.30 it seems
412 2012-11-28 04:28:08 <denisx> I updated my ports yesterday
413 2012-11-28 04:28:15 <denisx> so 2.28 is all you get
414 2012-11-28 04:28:16 <denisx> so 2.28 is all you get
415 2012-11-28 04:30:12 <jgarzik> denisx: that's fine. I'm going to add code to detect the version at compile time, and work around automatically, to support all versions. well, looks like this will take a while, so don't wait around for me.
416 2012-11-28 04:30:28 <jgarzik> #if glibversion >= 2.30 blah blah
417 2012-11-28 04:30:43 <denisx> its just three lines...
418 2012-11-28 04:30:44 <denisx> its just three lines...
419 2012-11-28 04:32:47 <jgarzik> denisx: you mean, only three lines to change?
420 2012-11-28 04:33:09 <denisx> you could simply add the code from the new function
421 2012-11-28 04:33:10 <denisx> you could simply add the code from the new function
422 2012-11-28 04:33:18 <denisx> yeah
423 2012-11-28 04:34:03 <jgarzik> denisx: Yes, my plan is basically: if (_new_full not present) { implement _new_full wrapper }
424 2012-11-28 04:34:09 <jgarzik> denisx: that magically makes all callsites work
425 2012-11-28 04:34:19 <jgarzik> and works for older and newer GLib
426 2012-11-28 04:34:43 <jgarzik> however... no clue how to check GLib version at compile time
427 2012-11-28 04:35:03 <jgarzik> I can easily check the version at configure time, but it needs to happen at compile time to implement the wrapper
428 2012-11-28 04:35:29 <denisx> jgarzik: but you dont need to, even if the new glib is there you can use the wrapper
429 2012-11-28 04:35:30 <denisx> jgarzik: but you dont need to, even if the new glib is there you can use the wrapper
430 2012-11-28 04:35:37 <denisx> in the end it is the same code
431 2012-11-28 04:36:18 <jgarzik> ACTION goes to peek at glib git, to see if indeed it is the same code...
432 2012-11-28 04:37:20 <jgarzik> array = g_ptr_array_sized_new (reserved_size);
433 2012-11-28 04:37:21 <jgarzik> g_ptr_array_set_free_func (array, element_free_func);
434 2012-11-28 04:39:32 <jgarzik> ok, found it: /usr/include/glib-2.0/glib/gversionmacros.h
435 2012-11-28 04:51:31 <jgarzik> denisx: fixes pushed out. yell at me, if vanilla picocoin.git HEAD does not build for you.
436 2012-11-28 04:51:51 <denisx> jgarzik: so I can git reset --hard and pull again?
437 2012-11-28 04:52:09 <jgarzik> denisx: yes
438 2012-11-28 04:52:10 <jgarzik> denisx: yes
439 2012-11-28 04:52:40 <denisx> ok
440 2012-11-28 04:54:33 <denisx> jgarzik: I still need to set LDFLAGS="-L/usr/local/lib"
441 2012-11-28 04:54:34 <denisx> jgarzik: I still need to set LDFLAGS="-L/usr/local/lib"
442 2012-11-28 04:54:47 <jgarzik> denisx: yeah that's expected
443 2012-11-28 04:55:01 <jgarzik> denisx: I would have guessed CFLAGS+=-I/usr/local/include too
444 2012-11-28 04:55:11 <denisx> yes, seems so
445 2012-11-28 04:56:13 <denisx> In file included from addr_match.c:11:
446 2012-11-28 04:56:14 <denisx> ../include/ccoin/compat.h:13:48: error: missing binary operator before token "("
447 2012-11-28 04:56:15 <denisx> addr_match.c: In function 'bp_block_match':
448 2012-11-28 04:56:16 <denisx> addr_match.c:129: warning: implicit declaration of function 'g_ptr_array_new_full'
449 2012-11-28 04:56:17 <denisx> addr_match.c:130: warning: initialization makes pointer from integer without a cast
450 2012-11-28 04:56:18 <denisx> *** [addr_match.o] Error code 1
451 2012-11-28 04:57:29 <jgarzik> denisx: does it work if you add parens?
452 2012-11-28 04:57:31 <jgarzik> #if GLIB_VERSION_CUR_STABLE < (G_ENCODE_VERSION (2, 30))
453 2012-11-28 04:57:32 <jgarzik> #if GLIB_VERSION_CUR_STABLE < (G_ENCODE_VERSION (2, 30))
454 2012-11-28 04:57:56 <jgarzik> or if even that fails,
455 2012-11-28 04:58:07 <jgarzik> #if (GLIB_VERSION_CUR_STABLE) < (G_ENCODE_VERSION(2, 30))
456 2012-11-28 04:58:10 <jgarzik> ACTION is paranoid
457 2012-11-28 04:58:22 <jgarzik> sounds like a clang thing
458 2012-11-28 04:58:35 <denisx> clang is very picky
459 2012-11-28 04:58:43 <denisx> and that is a good thing
460 2012-11-28 04:58:44 <denisx> and that is a good thing
461 2012-11-28 04:59:03 <jgarzik> agreed... most of the time ;p
462 2012-11-28 04:59:14 <jgarzik> I worked on getting the kernel to compile under clang, and filed several clang bugs
463 2012-11-28 04:59:33 <denisx> yeah, freebsd did that too
464 2012-11-28 04:59:34 <denisx> yeah, freebsd did that too
465 2012-11-28 04:59:50 <denisx> but also clang found alot of bugs in the kernel too I think
466 2012-11-28 04:59:58 <denisx> so win/win ;)
467 2012-11-28 05:00:10 <denisx> parens does not help
468 2012-11-28 05:00:11 <denisx> parens does not help
469 2012-11-28 05:00:18 <jgarzik> hrm
470 2012-11-28 05:00:59 <jgarzik> denisx: did you try paranoid version #2 as written? I removed a space that might be important to some cpp parsers
471 2012-11-28 05:01:11 <jgarzik> sometimes function macros are detected with "string("
472 2012-11-28 05:07:11 <denisx> hmm, tried alot, but nothing works
473 2012-11-28 05:07:15 <denisx> btw it is still gcc
474 2012-11-28 05:07:16 <denisx> btw it is still gcc
475 2012-11-28 05:07:24 <jgarzik> doubtly odd
476 2012-11-28 05:07:27 <jgarzik> doubly
477 2012-11-28 05:07:38 <denisx> you should use cc and not gcc for CC=
478 2012-11-28 05:08:25 <jgarzik> denisx: how about changing to the simpler
479 2012-11-28 05:08:29 <jgarzik> #ifndef GLIB_VERSION_2_30
480 2012-11-28 05:09:04 <denisx> yes!
481 2012-11-28 05:11:07 <jgarzik> denisx: could you now try git reset / build / check?
482 2012-11-28 05:14:04 <jgarzik> er
483 2012-11-28 05:14:08 <jgarzik> reset/pull/build/check
484 2012-11-28 05:14:09 <jgarzik> reset/pull/build/check
485 2012-11-28 05:14:15 <jgarzik> ITYKWIM
486 2012-11-28 05:14:27 <denisx> how did I check again?
487 2012-11-28 05:14:31 <denisx> builds fine now
488 2012-11-28 05:14:32 <denisx> builds fine now
489 2012-11-28 05:14:45 <denisx> make check all?
490 2012-11-28 05:14:58 <denisx> looks good
491 2012-11-28 05:15:07 <denisx> passed all 13 again
492 2012-11-28 05:15:27 <jgarzik> denisx: gold star for you, sir
493 2012-11-28 05:16:04 <jgarzik> denisx: future BSD users of libccoin will thank you
494 2012-11-28 05:16:05 <denisx> you just need to add usr/local/include and /usr/local/lib somehow for freebsd
495 2012-11-28 05:16:06 <denisx> you just need to add usr/local/include and /usr/local/lib somehow for freebsd
496 2012-11-28 05:16:23 <denisx> then it will be a simple configure/make
497 2012-11-28 05:16:24 <denisx> then it will be a simple configure/make
498 2012-11-28 05:17:11 <jgarzik> denisx: do most other autotools-based packages work out of the box on BSD, automatically including /usr/local as appropriate? It seemed like the GNU folks wanted it this way, but I agree, Just Working seems easier if this is common
499 2012-11-28 05:17:41 <denisx> yes
500 2012-11-28 05:17:42 <denisx> yes
501 2012-11-28 05:18:36 <Gladamas> Does anyone know, if you find a share on p2pool that is lower than the current BTC difficulty (a block) but it gets orphaned on the P2Pool share chain, is it still submitted to the Bitcoin network as a block?
502 2012-11-28 05:19:01 <Gladamas> nvm
503 2012-11-28 05:19:02 <Gladamas> nvm
504 2012-11-28 05:19:22 <denisx> jgarzik: take a look at this: https://github.com/ckolivas/cgminer/commit/30ade169ef08e8222b4de21c844dffd68b07d1a4
505 2012-11-28 05:19:34 <denisx> so you can simply add it to configure.ac
506 2012-11-28 05:28:03 <denisx> jgarzik: and in freebsd 10 there is no gcc anymore by default
507 2012-11-28 05:28:26 <denisx> they switched completely 2 or 3 weeks ago
508 2012-11-28 05:28:27 <denisx> they switched completely 2 or 3 weeks ago
509 2012-11-28 05:28:50 <jgarzik> denisx: yeah saw that. pretty cool.
510 2012-11-28 05:29:28 <jgarzik> denisx: GNU has always been a dinosaur. It shined briefly, in the version 1.x days, on Sun. Other than that, it's been a tech laggart.
511 2012-11-28 05:29:29 <jgarzik> denisx: GNU has always been a dinosaur. It shined briefly, in the version 1.x days, on Sun. Other than that, it's been a tech laggart.
512 2012-11-28 05:30:04 <denisx> jgarzik: I woulndt be that hard, but some other compiler is always a good thing
513 2012-11-28 05:30:05 <denisx> jgarzik: I woulndt be that hard, but some other compiler is always a good thing
514 2012-11-28 05:30:15 <jgarzik> gcc has been an extraordinarily valuable tool from a free-software, freedom perspective. But from a technology perspective, it's a dinosaur.
515 2012-11-28 05:30:16 <jgarzik> gcc has been an extraordinarily valuable tool from a free-software, freedom perspective. But from a technology perspective, it's a dinosaur.
516 2012-11-28 05:30:43 <jgarzik> It's only recently come out of that shell with GIMPLE and other advancements, but LLVM, ORC and other compilers had already surpassed it.
517 2012-11-28 05:30:44 <jgarzik> It's only recently come out of that shell with GIMPLE and other advancements, but LLVM, ORC and other compilers had already surpassed it.
518 2012-11-28 05:31:55 <gmaxwell> meh. LLVM is sexy but the results on actual code are fairly mixed for all it's jazz. GCC is is the unstoppable soviet tank, for better or worse. :P
519 2012-11-28 05:32:15 <jgarzik> Stallman resisted "gcc plugins" for so long, thinking them an avenue for proprietary compiler people to lock away secrets forever. But all he really did was make it difficult to experiment with changing the compiler passes and other core features.
520 2012-11-28 05:32:50 <jgarzik> LLVM got the bitcode/API angle right. LLVM structurally evolves faster.
521 2012-11-28 05:33:58 <jgarzik> Stallman ossified an internal compiler structure, whereas LLVM makes it easier to fork, work around or totally replace internal compiler logic.
522 2012-11-28 05:34:14 <denisx> gmaxwell: but the heavy tank is only rolling because the mass moment of inertia and not because the motor is still running ;)
523 2012-11-28 05:34:38 <gmaxwell> In the meantime, you have companies like qualcomm who are agressively patenting behind contributions to CLANG/LLVM because there is no contributor agreement that discourages them from doing so. BSD-implied-patent-license is untested in court. It's quite possible that that whole thing is just building up to be mobile patent war 2.0. :(
524 2012-11-28 05:34:39 <gmaxwell> In the meantime, you have companies like qualcomm who are agressively patenting behind contributions to CLANG/LLVM because there is no contributor agreement that discourages them from doing so. BSD-implied-patent-license is untested in court. It's quite possible that that whole thing is just building up to be mobile patent war 2.0. :(
525 2012-11-28 05:35:06 <jgarzik> gmaxwell: I'm sure Apple's got some in there too
526 2012-11-28 05:35:15 <gmaxwell> No doubt.
527 2012-11-28 05:35:29 <gmaxwell> And since apple never begins patent wars of agression, everything is safe!
528 2012-11-28 05:35:30 <gmaxwell> And since apple never begins patent wars of agression, everything is safe!
529 2012-11-28 05:35:32 <gmaxwell> :P
530 2012-11-28 05:35:59 <jgarzik> heh, another 2112 reply in my picocoin thread. this should be interesting.
531 2012-11-28 05:36:36 <gmaxwell> denisx: again, go actually benchmark the resulting code. It might be through sheer will or what have you??? but on many (most? a representative sample is hard) codebases GCC continues to generate superior code. It does compile a lot slower at lower optimization levels though.
532 2012-11-28 05:36:55 <gmaxwell> The competition is good though and its improving both of them.
533 2012-11-28 05:37:19 <jgarzik> sure, no argument LLVM generate code can be slower than gcc
534 2012-11-28 05:37:20 <jgarzik> sure, no argument LLVM generate code can be slower than gcc
535 2012-11-28 05:37:41 <denisx> gmaxwell: yes. in most benchmarks they have mixed results
536 2012-11-28 05:37:42 <denisx> gmaxwell: yes. in most benchmarks they have mixed results
537 2012-11-28 05:38:14 <jgarzik> my only argument is the LLVM codebase is better suited for rapid development and rapid improvement, and current pace of improvement bears that out
538 2012-11-28 05:38:22 <gmaxwell> And the llvm/clang ecosystem has some nice things. Clang static analysis is simply fantastic. almost as good as coverity without having to deal with a moronic company.
539 2012-11-28 05:38:28 <jgarzik> llvm code generation on !x86 is still poor
540 2012-11-28 05:38:47 <denisx> except arm?
541 2012-11-28 05:38:56 <jgarzik> yes
542 2012-11-28 05:39:02 <gmaxwell> I was going to say??? well GCC has always been surprisingly .. er. uncreative on arm.
543 2012-11-28 05:39:03 <gmaxwell> I was going to say??? well GCC has always been surprisingly .. er. uncreative on arm.
544 2012-11-28 05:40:35 <jgarzik> there is a mountain of muscle behind x86 opt, for gcc of course, but recently for llvm as well. New graphics default is always-OpenGL, with non-GL situations passed to "LLVMpipe" People have been working hard to bring every little trick to LLVM x86, even outside Apple
545 2012-11-28 05:40:36 <jgarzik> there is a mountain of muscle behind x86 opt, for gcc of course, but recently for llvm as well. New graphics default is always-OpenGL, with non-GL situations passed to "LLVMpipe" People have been working hard to bring every little trick to LLVM x86, even outside Apple
546 2012-11-28 05:40:51 <jgarzik> ARM and PPC limp along on LLVM
547 2012-11-28 05:41:42 <denisx> one should assume that apple does alot for arm on llvm
548 2012-11-28 05:41:49 <denisx> that is not the case?
549 2012-11-28 05:41:50 <denisx> that is not the case?
550 2012-11-28 05:44:09 <gmaxwell> I love how the guy yells at you about 'bare metal' then throws some MSVC C++ code at you. ;P
551 2012-11-28 05:44:35 <jgarzik> denisx: sure doesn't show up in our ARM benchmarks at least.
552 2012-11-28 05:44:43 <jgarzik> we've been looking at ARM on Fedora recently
553 2012-11-28 05:44:44 <gmaxwell> What is his obsession with the unions?
554 2012-11-28 05:44:45 <gmaxwell> What is his obsession with the unions?
555 2012-11-28 05:44:50 <jgarzik> (we == Red Hat)
556 2012-11-28 05:46:05 <gmaxwell> (an the idea of using a single compilation unit for demonstrating the performance implications of ... well anything)
557 2012-11-28 05:46:06 <gmaxwell> (an the idea of using a single compilation unit for demonstrating the performance implications of ... well anything)
558 2012-11-28 05:48:29 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: what
559 2012-11-28 05:48:51 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: was trying to find *BSD builders for my bitcoin lib
560 2012-11-28 05:49:30 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: ISTR you filing BSD build fix reports in the past for the main bitcoin project, and was trolling. denisx helped me out w/ FreeBSD.
561 2012-11-28 05:49:44 <jgarzik> so all good
562 2012-11-28 05:49:45 <jgarzik> so all good
563 2012-11-28 05:50:06 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: i have a couple openbsd 5.1 boxes i could test on if you'd like
564 2012-11-28 05:50:07 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: i have a couple openbsd 5.1 boxes i could test on if you'd like
565 2012-11-28 05:50:23 <jrmithdobbs> (really need to get around to upgrading those to 5.2)
566 2012-11-28 05:50:40 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: on your github somewhere?
567 2012-11-28 05:51:15 <denisx> I did also complain here about some freebsd love for bitcoind ;)
568 2012-11-28 05:52:04 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: https://github.com/jgarzik/picocoin/
569 2012-11-28 05:52:07 <jrmithdobbs> denisx: i fixed it but broke static building (which as far as my testing can find, is broken anyways everywhere i've tried to use it, but w/e) and then forgot about it :P
570 2012-11-28 05:52:34 <_dr> yeah, bsd support would indeed be nice
571 2012-11-28 05:52:35 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: deps: GLib 2.x, jansson, libevent2, OpenSSL, autotools.
572 2012-11-28 05:52:55 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: ./autogen.sh ; ./configure ; make all check
573 2012-11-28 05:52:56 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: ./autogen.sh ; ./configure ; make all check
574 2012-11-28 05:52:58 <_dr> having a wallet on openbsd makes perfect sense :)
575 2012-11-28 05:53:31 <jrmithdobbs> _dr: oh, openbsd was still broken. I just fixed the building. 5.2 includes some changes that should make it actually *work* (the threading work that was done)
576 2012-11-28 05:54:01 <_dr> i did get it running on 5.1
577 2012-11-28 05:54:10 <jrmithdobbs> but tests fail
578 2012-11-28 05:54:36 <jrmithdobbs> most operations seemed to work but I wouldn't put anything with value through it running on openbsd
579 2012-11-28 05:54:37 <jrmithdobbs> most operations seemed to work but I wouldn't put anything with value through it running on openbsd
580 2012-11-28 05:54:54 <_dr> okay, i wouldn't know about that. i just patched some includes and IFDEFS and was happy the binary actually worked
581 2012-11-28 05:54:59 <denisx> my pool runs on freebsd with bitcoind and pushpoold
582 2012-11-28 05:55:00 <denisx> my pool runs on freebsd with bitcoind and pushpoold
583 2012-11-28 05:55:14 <jrmithdobbs> ya it works correctly on freebsd :P
584 2012-11-28 05:56:19 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: got a link for jansson?
585 2012-11-28 05:56:39 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: http://www.digip.org/jansson/ ?
586 2012-11-28 05:56:50 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: yeah. http://www.digip.org/jansson/releases/
587 2012-11-28 05:56:51 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: yeah. http://www.digip.org/jansson/releases/
588 2012-11-28 05:57:09 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: tested with jansson 2.1
589 2012-11-28 05:57:16 <jgarzik> but probably works with newer
590 2012-11-28 06:00:58 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: there not a way to specify the jansson install location?
591 2012-11-28 06:00:59 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: there not a way to specify the jansson install location?
592 2012-11-28 06:01:26 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: tried --with-jansson and --with-libjansson
593 2012-11-28 06:01:27 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: tried --with-jansson and --with-libjansson
594 2012-11-28 06:01:37 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: dunno. I'm a pampered Linux baby who never worries about that stuff ;p
595 2012-11-28 06:01:37 <jrmithdobbs> (with =PATH obviously)
596 2012-11-28 06:02:03 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: oh, you mean in picocoin?
597 2012-11-28 06:02:07 <jrmithdobbs> yes
598 2012-11-28 06:02:20 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: CFLAGS+=-I/usr/local/include LDFLAGS+=-L/usr/local/lib
599 2012-11-28 06:02:28 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: when running configure
600 2012-11-28 06:02:37 <jgarzik> (depends on your shell, obviously)
601 2012-11-28 06:02:38 <jgarzik> (depends on your shell, obviously)
602 2012-11-28 06:02:42 <jrmithdobbs> k
603 2012-11-28 06:03:20 <jgarzik> CFLAGS="-O2 -Wall -g -I/usr/local/include" LDFLAGS="-L/usr/local/lib" ./configure
604 2012-11-28 06:03:21 <jgarzik> CFLAGS="-O2 -Wall -g -I/usr/local/include" LDFLAGS="-L/usr/local/lib" ./configure
605 2012-11-28 06:03:32 <jgarzik> or appropriate for your shell
606 2012-11-28 06:06:22 <jrmithdobbs> gcc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I.. -I/usr/local/include/glib-2.0 -I/usr/local/lib/glib-2.0/include -I../include -O2 -Wall -g -I/opt/OpenBSD/5.1/amd64/jansson-2.4/include -MT addr_match.o -MD -MP -MF .deps/addr_match.Tpo -c -o addr_match.o addr_match.c
607 2012-11-28 06:06:26 <jrmithdobbs> In file included from addr_match.c:11:
608 2012-11-28 06:06:29 <jrmithdobbs> ../include/ccoin/compat.h:17: error: static declaration of 'g_ptr_array_new_full' follows non-static declaration
609 2012-11-28 06:06:32 <jrmithdobbs> /usr/local/include/glib-2.0/glib/garray.h:116: error: previous declaration of 'g_ptr_array_new_full' was here
610 2012-11-28 06:06:35 <jrmithdobbs> *** Error code 1
611 2012-11-28 06:06:51 <jrmithdobbs> heh
612 2012-11-28 06:06:52 <jrmithdobbs> heh
613 2012-11-28 06:07:01 <jrmithdobbs> fuckin shit glib headers strike again
614 2012-11-28 06:08:28 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: hrm odd
615 2012-11-28 06:08:46 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: what version of GLib is installed?
616 2012-11-28 06:09:23 <jrmithdobbs> glib2-2.30.2p5 general-purpose utility library
617 2012-11-28 06:09:24 <jrmithdobbs> glib2-2.30.2p5 general-purpose utility library
618 2012-11-28 06:10:30 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: GLIB_VERSION_2_30 symbol missing somehow, it seems
619 2012-11-28 06:10:35 <jgarzik> *is missing
620 2012-11-28 06:11:02 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: is that symbol in your local .../gversionmacros.h ?
621 2012-11-28 06:11:03 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: is that symbol in your local .../gversionmacros.h ?
622 2012-11-28 06:12:17 <denisx> I don't have anything with GLIB_VERSION
623 2012-11-28 06:12:18 <denisx> I don't have anything with GLIB_VERSION
624 2012-11-28 06:13:04 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: jgarzik I don't have a gversionmacros.h
625 2012-11-28 06:13:05 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: jgarzik I don't have a gversionmacros.h
626 2012-11-28 06:13:19 <jgarzik> doubly odd
627 2012-11-28 06:13:20 <jgarzik> doubly odd
628 2012-11-28 06:13:22 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: I just defined that and it got quite a bit further (-DGLIB_VERSION_2_30 added to CFLAGS)
629 2012-11-28 06:13:23 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: I just defined that and it got quite a bit further (-DGLIB_VERSION_2_30 added to CFLAGS)
630 2012-11-28 06:13:24 <denisx> but there is GLIB_MAJOR_VERSION, GLIB_MINOR_VERSION and GLIB_MICRO_VERSION
631 2012-11-28 06:14:39 <jgarzik> denisx, jrmithdobbs: any GLIB_VERSION_.* symbols?
632 2012-11-28 06:14:44 <jgarzik> (note trailing '_')
633 2012-11-28 06:14:56 <denisx> no
634 2012-11-28 06:14:58 <jrmithdobbs> not that I see
635 2012-11-28 06:14:59 <jrmithdobbs> not that I see
636 2012-11-28 06:15:05 <jrmithdobbs> think those get defined by autotools
637 2012-11-28 06:16:53 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: more importantly it thinks it's found libevent but apparently it doesn't like this version? all sorts of undefined ref to ... 'event_new' 'event_free' etc
638 2012-11-28 06:16:54 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: more importantly it thinks it's found libevent but apparently it doesn't like this version? all sorts of undefined ref to ... 'event_new' 'event_free' etc
639 2012-11-28 06:17:06 <jrmithdobbs> also, <3 openbsd gcc/clang warning patches:
640 2012-11-28 06:17:07 <jrmithdobbs> /usr/local/lib/libglib-2.0.so.2992.0: warning: stpcpy() is dangerous GNU crap; don't use it
641 2012-11-28 06:17:08 <jrmithdobbs> /usr/local/lib/libglib-2.0.so.2992.0: warning: stpcpy() is dangerous GNU crap; don't use it
642 2012-11-28 06:17:31 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: definitely requires libevent2
643 2012-11-28 06:17:32 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: definitely requires libevent2
644 2012-11-28 06:17:34 <gmaxwell> Only OpenBSD dangerous crap permitted.
645 2012-11-28 06:17:34 <jgarzik> not libevent
646 2012-11-28 06:17:35 <gmaxwell> Only OpenBSD dangerous crap permitted.
647 2012-11-28 06:18:13 <jrmithdobbs> ~/src/picocoin$ pkg_info | grep libevent
648 2012-11-28 06:18:14 <jrmithdobbs> libevent-2.0.13 event notification library
649 2012-11-28 06:18:59 <jrmithdobbs> gmaxwell: i still chuckle at the warnings :P
650 2012-11-28 06:20:55 <jgarzik> -#ifndef GLIB_VERSION_2_30
651 2012-11-28 06:20:56 <jgarzik> -#ifndef GLIB_VERSION_2_30
652 2012-11-28 06:21:07 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs, denisx: that work for you both?
653 2012-11-28 06:21:10 <jgarzik> include/ccoin/compat.h
654 2012-11-28 06:21:40 <denisx> let me check
655 2012-11-28 06:21:41 <denisx> let me check
656 2012-11-28 06:21:58 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: sounds like you got CFLAGS right, but not LDFLAGS
657 2012-11-28 06:22:36 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: no I see what's going on
658 2012-11-28 06:22:37 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: no I see what's going on
659 2012-11-28 06:23:28 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: openbsd also ships libevent (1) in base and your autotools stuff is smart enough to find the includes but not reorder -L's to put /usr/local/lib before /usr/lib explicitly (that's an openbsd annoyance)
660 2012-11-28 06:23:29 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: openbsd also ships libevent (1) in base and your autotools stuff is smart enough to find the includes but not reorder -L's to put /usr/local/lib before /usr/lib explicitly (that's an openbsd annoyance)
661 2012-11-28 06:24:43 <jrmithdobbs> oh wait, no, it wasn't smart enough to find the includes is the problem because they're in /usr/local/include/event2
662 2012-11-28 06:24:44 <jrmithdobbs> oh wait, no, it wasn't smart enough to find the includes is the problem because they're in /usr/local/include/event2
663 2012-11-28 06:24:51 <jrmithdobbs> but it found -levent2 :P
664 2012-11-28 06:25:14 <denisx> for me it works
665 2012-11-28 06:25:49 <jgarzik> cool
666 2012-11-28 06:27:18 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: ya that fixes that
667 2012-11-28 06:27:19 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: ya that fixes that
668 2012-11-28 06:27:51 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: you made it all the way through 'make all check' ?
669 2012-11-28 06:28:28 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: except for the final linking stage, yes
670 2012-11-28 06:28:29 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: except for the final linking stage, yes
671 2012-11-28 06:28:44 <jrmithdobbs> figuring out the libevent linking problem
672 2012-11-28 06:29:24 <jrmithdobbs> i was mixed up, it's finding the headers, but -levent isn't the right thing to link against for the libevent2 port on openbsd i think or something, i've run into this before
673 2012-11-28 06:29:25 <jrmithdobbs> i was mixed up, it's finding the headers, but -levent isn't the right thing to link against for the libevent2 port on openbsd i think or something, i've run into this before
674 2012-11-28 06:30:22 <da2ce7_d> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=69060.0 - Melbourne Meetup 5th December!!
675 2012-11-28 06:30:23 <da2ce7_d> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=69060.0 - Melbourne Meetup 5th December!!
676 2012-11-28 06:36:06 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: ya, if i change the -levent to -levent_core it links and make check works
677 2012-11-28 06:36:35 <sipa> jgarzik: any further errors on vanilla head?
678 2012-11-28 06:36:36 <sipa> jgarzik: any further errors on vanilla head?
679 2012-11-28 06:36:48 <jgarzik> sipa: none. tried restarting a few times.
680 2012-11-28 06:36:52 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: that's a broken test in autotools, not your fault tbqh
681 2012-11-28 06:37:08 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: I disagree. It is my fault ;p
682 2012-11-28 06:37:09 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: I disagree. It is my fault ;p
683 2012-11-28 06:37:12 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: it seems to falsely think /usr/lib/libevent.so is new enough
684 2012-11-28 06:37:13 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: it seems to falsely think /usr/lib/libevent.so is new enough
685 2012-11-28 06:38:32 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs, denisx: I would like to add the following to configure.ac (requires autogen.sh to be re-run):
686 2012-11-28 06:38:33 <jgarzik> -AC_CHECK_LIB(event, event_base_new, EVENT_LIBS=-levent,
687 2012-11-28 06:38:34 <jgarzik> -AC_CHECK_LIB(event, event_base_new, EVENT_LIBS=-levent,
688 2012-11-28 06:38:41 <jgarzik> works here
689 2012-11-28 06:40:03 <denisx> event_core?
690 2012-11-28 06:40:04 <denisx> event_core?
691 2012-11-28 06:40:07 <denisx> whats that?
692 2012-11-28 06:40:08 <denisx> whats that?
693 2012-11-28 06:40:51 <sipa> wow, this must be the very first time i see 2112 backing up his ramblings with actual code
694 2012-11-28 06:40:52 <sipa> wow, this must be the very first time i see 2112 backing up his ramblings with actual code
695 2012-11-28 06:41:03 <denisx> all 13 tests passed
696 2012-11-28 06:41:31 <jrmithdobbs> sipa: ?
697 2012-11-28 06:42:00 <sipa> jrmithdobbs: in jgarzik's announce post
698 2012-11-28 06:42:01 <sipa> jrmithdobbs: in jgarzik's announce post
699 2012-11-28 06:42:15 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: linking script is broken too
700 2012-11-28 06:42:16 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: linking script is broken too
701 2012-11-28 06:42:18 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: /home/mith/src/picocoin/lib/script_eval.c:26: undefined reference to `memmem'
702 2012-11-28 06:42:21 <jrmithdobbs> ../lib/libccoin.a(script_eval.o)(.text+0x19c9):/home/mith/src/picocoin/lib/script_eval.c:26: undefined reference to `memmem'
703 2012-11-28 06:43:42 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: hum. I guess OpenBSD lacks that one.
704 2012-11-28 06:44:00 <jrmithdobbs> indeed
705 2012-11-28 06:44:27 <jrmithdobbs> why memmem and not strstr?
706 2012-11-28 06:44:28 <jrmithdobbs> why memmem and not strstr?
707 2012-11-28 06:46:04 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: dealing with binary data, not nul-terminated strings
708 2012-11-28 06:46:24 <jrmithdobbs> then what's it doing in a GString? :P
709 2012-11-28 06:46:25 <jrmithdobbs> then what's it doing in a GString? :P
710 2012-11-28 06:47:54 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: GString is religiously used with binary data. GByteArray might be more appropriate, but it's also more annoying for minor reasons ;p
711 2012-11-28 06:49:10 <jgarzik> bah, stupid licenses, now I must find a BSD-licensed memmem
712 2012-11-28 06:49:11 <jgarzik> bah, stupid licenses, now I must find a BSD-licensed memmem
713 2012-11-28 06:49:29 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: ya, I was looking for one
714 2012-11-28 06:49:30 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: ya, I was looking for one
715 2012-11-28 06:49:37 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: there's one in freebsd
716 2012-11-28 06:49:40 <jgarzik> presumably fBSD has it
717 2012-11-28 06:50:21 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: it's in lib/libc/string/memmem.c
718 2012-11-28 06:50:24 <jrmithdobbs> in the source tree
719 2012-11-28 06:54:19 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: OK, pushed out to picocoin.git HEAD
720 2012-11-28 06:56:18 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: err, I thought the -levent_core change fixed it but I apparently didn't clear things right after manually fixing that
721 2012-11-28 06:56:19 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: err, I thought the -levent_core change fixed it but I apparently didn't clear things right after manually fixing that
722 2012-11-28 06:56:51 <jrmithdobbs> i cleaned out the CFLAGS crap I'd added and it now does:
723 2012-11-28 06:57:21 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: You will still need -I/usr/local/blah and -L/usr/local/lib in CFLAGS/LDFLAGS
724 2012-11-28 06:57:22 <jrmithdobbs> works if I put -L/usr/local/lib -L/usr/lib at the end of the LDFLAGS
725 2012-11-28 06:57:28 <jrmithdobbs> ya
726 2012-11-28 06:57:57 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: yah BSD will require CFLAGS/LDFLAGS/LIBS tweaking for now. Given that assumption, does it fully build and 'make check'?
727 2012-11-28 06:58:43 <jrmithdobbs> ok it builds/links now
728 2012-11-28 06:58:45 <jrmithdobbs> and only one test failure
729 2012-11-28 06:58:46 <jrmithdobbs> and only one test failure
730 2012-11-28 06:58:47 <jrmithdobbs> http://pastebin.com/E9Jhndqj
731 2012-11-28 06:59:57 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: interesting
732 2012-11-28 06:59:57 <jrmithdobbs> how much ram is that allocating? probably default ulimit getting hit
733 2012-11-28 06:59:58 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: interesting
734 2012-11-28 06:59:58 <jrmithdobbs> how much ram is that allocating? probably default ulimit getting hit
735 2012-11-28 07:00:14 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: quite a bit. it loads 193,000 block headers into RAM, plus metadata
736 2012-11-28 07:00:49 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: on disk file size is around 20MB
737 2012-11-28 07:00:50 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: on disk file size is around 20MB
738 2012-11-28 07:02:21 <jrmithdobbs> ya bumped data seg ulimit to 16G (ram in box) and it all passes
739 2012-11-28 07:02:22 <jrmithdobbs> ya bumped data seg ulimit to 16G (ram in box) and it all passes
740 2012-11-28 07:02:43 <jrmithdobbs> it skipped chain-verf
741 2012-11-28 07:03:57 <jrmithdobbs> get a no such file or directory abort from line 28 of chain-verf.c if i try to run it
742 2012-11-28 07:03:58 <jrmithdobbs> get a no such file or directory abort from line 28 of chain-verf.c if i try to run it
743 2012-11-28 07:04:42 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: great!
744 2012-11-28 07:05:05 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: that's where we need to be. chain-verf requires a specially prepared file you probably don't have (block chain from pynode).
745 2012-11-28 07:05:51 <jgarzik> jrmithdobbs: thanks for the help. I'm going to go collapse now. :)
746 2012-11-28 07:06:01 <jgarzik> denisx: ditto
747 2012-11-28 07:06:21 <sipa> ACTION calculates jgarzik's local time
748 2012-11-28 07:06:22 <sipa> ACTION calculates jgarzik's local time
749 2012-11-28 07:06:35 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: if anyone asks:
750 2012-11-28 07:06:35 <sipa> oh, only 3am?
751 2012-11-28 07:06:36 <sipa> oh, only 3am?
752 2012-11-28 07:06:37 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: AUTOMAKE_VERSION=1.11 AUTOCONF_VERSION=2.68 ./autogen.sh && CC=clang LD=llvm-ld CFLAGS='-O2 -Wall -g -I/usr/local/include/event2 -I/opt/OpenBSD/5.1/amd64/jansson-2.4/include -I/usr/local/include/event2' LDFLAGS='-L/opt/OpenBSD/5.1/amd64/jansson-2.4/lib -L/usr/local/lib -L/usr/lib' ./configure --prefix=/opt/OpenBSD/5.1/amd64/picocoin-0.0 && make all check
753 2012-11-28 07:06:38 <jrmithdobbs> jgarzik: AUTOMAKE_VERSION=1.11 AUTOCONF_VERSION=2.68 ./autogen.sh && CC=clang LD=llvm-ld CFLAGS='-O2 -Wall -g -I/usr/local/include/event2 -I/opt/OpenBSD/5.1/amd64/jansson-2.4/include -I/usr/local/include/event2' LDFLAGS='-L/opt/OpenBSD/5.1/amd64/jansson-2.4/lib -L/usr/local/lib -L/usr/lib' ./configure --prefix=/opt/OpenBSD/5.1/amd64/picocoin-0.0 && make all check
754 2012-11-28 07:06:53 <sipa> ;;bc,halfreward
755 2012-11-28 07:06:54 <gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Wed Nov 28 08:46:00 2012 | Time remaining: 8 hours, 40 minutes, and 0 seconds
756 2012-11-28 07:06:54 <sipa> ;;bc,halfreward
757 2012-11-28 07:06:55 <gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Wed Nov 28 08:46:00 2012 | Time remaining: 8 hours, 40 minutes, and 0 seconds
758 2012-11-28 07:07:11 <jrmithdobbs> not sure if that -I for the libevent2 includes is needed, but the rest is (it'll build fine with the system gcc/ld though)
759 2012-11-28 11:08:50 <abrkn> the end is near.
760 2012-11-28 11:39:58 <Graet> ends lead to new beginnings
761 2012-11-28 11:48:00 <t7> multibit is quite nice
762 2012-11-28 11:50:32 <t7> i did think something dramatic was going to happen on mtgox in the week leading up to it...
763 2012-11-28 11:50:45 <drizztbsd> ;;halfreward
764 2012-11-28 11:50:45 <gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Wed Nov 28 16:20:45 2012 UTC | Time remaining: 3 hours, 30 minutes, and 0 seconds.
765 2012-11-28 12:07:30 <t7> is there a lightweight client/library in c/c++ ?
766 2012-11-28 12:08:41 <sipa> picocoin
767 2012-11-28 12:10:44 <t7> is this like bitcoinj? (doesnt download the entire blockchain)
768 2012-11-28 12:14:09 <sipa> yes
769 2012-11-28 12:14:24 <sipa> it verifies the block headers, but not the blocks
770 2012-11-28 12:51:00 <Hasimir> quick question: was the genesis block numbered as 0 or 1?
771 2012-11-28 12:51:10 <sipa> 0
772 2012-11-28 12:51:53 <Hasimir> thanks
773 2012-11-28 12:53:38 <sipa> ;;bc,halfreward
774 2012-11-28 12:53:43 <gribble> Error: invalid syntax (<string>, line 1)
775 2012-11-28 12:54:03 <gribble> Error: "bc,height" is not a valid command.
776 2012-11-28 12:54:03 <sipa> ;;bc,height
777 2012-11-28 12:54:08 <sipa> ;;bc,stats
778 2012-11-28 12:54:23 <sipa> ;;bc,count
779 2012-11-28 12:54:31 <Cylta> Sooo, great experiment is just to begin? :-D
780 2012-11-28 12:54:34 <gribble> Error: invalid syntax (<string>, line 1)
781 2012-11-28 13:01:39 <stamit> all of a sudden, i notice that my bank isn't giving me my transactions log
782 2012-11-28 13:01:58 <stamit> not via ebanking. i am forced to go in person
783 2012-11-28 13:03:23 <stamit> got to receive your "spanking", stamit
784 2012-11-28 13:04:25 <stamit> or maybe they just like seeing me
785 2012-11-28 13:10:42 <jgarzik> ;;bc,halfreward
786 2012-11-28 13:10:52 <gribble> Error: invalid syntax (<string>, line 1)
787 2012-11-28 13:11:29 <_dr> i thought the blockchain was supposed to break
788 2012-11-28 13:11:31 <_dr> not the bot
789 2012-11-28 13:11:59 <jgarzik> luke-jr, sipa: hazek reports next-test crash, https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=127864.msg1363172#msg1363172
790 2012-11-28 13:12:24 <Graet> ;;halfreward
791 2012-11-28 13:12:25 <gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Wed Nov 28 15:12:24 2012 UTC | Time remaining: 1 hour and 0 seconds.
792 2012-11-28 13:12:26 <Graet> works
793 2012-11-28 13:13:12 <sturles> The bc, subcommands are broken today.
794 2012-11-28 13:14:34 <jgarzik> ;;halfreward
795 2012-11-28 13:14:35 <gribble> Estimated time of bitcoin block reward halving: Wed Nov 28 15:14:34 2012 UTC | Time remaining: 1 hour and 0 seconds.
796 2012-11-28 13:17:58 <topi`> I wonder if there are any pools out there who have hardcoded the reward at 50 btc ;) I might try and exploit it ;)
797 2012-11-28 13:19:25 <Graet> i know one, but the poolop is awake and ready to change it :P
798 2012-11-28 13:19:48 <Graet> i do wonder about some of the less maintained pools though
799 2012-11-28 13:20:56 <jgarzik> topi`: definitely a few hardcoded pools out there, as of a few weeks ago
800 2012-11-28 13:22:26 <UukGoblin> guys just realized
801 2012-11-28 13:22:35 <UukGoblin> has EVERYTHING been tested for B210k bug safety?
802 2012-11-28 13:22:44 <UukGoblin> there is still time!
803 2012-11-28 13:24:14 <topi`> let's get some consultants and pay up
804 2012-11-28 13:24:39 <topi`> I thought the world was gonna end on Y2K
805 2012-11-28 13:24:56 <sipa> it did
806 2012-11-28 13:24:58 <topi`> thinking about all those nuclear reactors being run by old Windows installations
807 2012-11-28 13:25:06 <_dr> better not
808 2012-11-28 13:25:08 <sipa> your brain wasn't Y2K compliant however, so you didn't notice
809 2012-11-28 13:28:03 <sipa> hmm, one can argue that the bitcoin timeline started when satoshi *started* mining for block 0
810 2012-11-28 13:28:05 <t7> "block reward halving parties" haha
811 2012-11-28 13:28:23 <sipa> so the switchover to the "second cycle" happens at block 209999
812 2012-11-28 13:29:07 <sipa> it also makes sense, because at that point miners will start working on blocks with 25 BTC subsidy
813 2012-11-28 13:32:05 <kjj> 3...
814 2012-11-28 13:32:15 <UukGoblin> sipa, or stop
815 2012-11-28 13:32:38 <sipa> UukGoblin: exactly
816 2012-11-28 13:33:03 <kjj> I wonder how many people are hoping to switch to pools that don't handle the switch properly
817 2012-11-28 13:34:42 <MC1984> where did all this hashpowercome from
818 2012-11-28 13:34:59 <kjj> what hash power?
819 2012-11-28 13:35:19 <MC1984> over 30
820 2012-11-28 13:35:27 <MC1984> bad estimate?
821 2012-11-28 13:35:45 <jgarzik> 11/28/12 14:35:21 Starting 1 BitcoinMiner threads
822 2012-11-28 13:35:46 <edcba> halving already happened ?
823 2012-11-28 13:35:48 <kjj> hash power isn't measured, it is estimated
824 2012-11-28 13:36:00 <jgarzik> damn right, baby. mainnet CPU mining FTW.
825 2012-11-28 13:36:39 <_dr> if you get the last 50-block you'll be my new personal hero
826 2012-11-28 13:37:10 <kjj> 2...
827 2012-11-28 13:37:12 <sipa> 2 more
828 2012-11-28 13:37:42 <kinlo> :)
829 2012-11-28 13:37:55 <kinlo> I really need another 50 btc block :/
830 2012-11-28 13:37:59 <UukGoblin> 'nd then what
831 2012-11-28 13:38:01 <TD_> BlueMatt: just find the last post from gavin and pick up from that point. your input would be appreciated.
832 2012-11-28 13:40:46 <sipa> TD_: uh-oh; someone had an unclean shutdown on Win7, and LevelDB failed to load afterwards...
833 2012-11-28 13:42:13 <sipa> i'm not sure about that LevelDB port to Win32 (including my own modifications to make it run on pre-C++11)
834 2012-11-28 13:42:30 <TD> sipa: how did it fail to load
835 2012-11-28 13:42:56 <sipa> LevelDB read failure: IO error: C:\\Users\\Administrator\\AppData\\Roaming\\Bitcoin\\coins/036518.sst: No such file or directory
836 2012-11-28 13:48:11 <ThomasV> UukGoblin: I think I just found a bug
837 2012-11-28 13:48:28 <ThomasV> :)
838 2012-11-28 13:48:43 <ThomasV> (just kidding)
839 2012-11-28 13:48:45 <TD> sipa: :(
840 2012-11-28 13:48:46 <UukGoblin> ;-]
841 2012-11-28 13:48:58 <MC1984> has the subsidy code been tested before now?
842 2012-11-28 13:49:29 <UukGoblin> MC1984, no, but we still have a few minutes to test it
843 2012-11-28 13:49:34 <lianj> no we all gonna die
844 2012-11-28 13:49:35 <UukGoblin> MC1984, (jk)
845 2012-11-28 13:49:39 <topi`> I wonder if Satoshi ever tested the halving of reward... it is a simple snippet of code, yet everything can go wrong as always :D
846 2012-11-28 13:49:44 <ThomasV> it's being tested right now. lpease do not mine so that we have more time
847 2012-11-28 13:50:02 <sipa> TD: i haven't ever been able to reproduce that, and iirc i tried things like hard poweroff
848 2012-11-28 13:50:10 <MC1984> what if it starts producing 2500000000000 coins per block :/
849 2012-11-28 13:50:11 <lianj> ThomasV: hehe, yea that will work
850 2012-11-28 13:50:22 <andrew12-> block party time
851 2012-11-28 13:50:37 <sipa> andrew12-: easy now, 2 more blocks to go
852 2012-11-28 13:51:01 <ThomasV> heh, did you guys test what happens if there is a reorg at the 210000th block?
853 2012-11-28 13:51:03 <MC1984> i wonder if it will have any visible effect on the fees market
854 2012-11-28 13:51:15 <andrew12-> ACTION switches over to solo mining for this
855 2012-11-28 13:51:30 <MC1984> if the fees will actually start to become a market after this
856 2012-11-28 13:51:36 <sipa> i doubt it
857 2012-11-28 13:51:41 <TD> sipa: yes it may well be a windows specific issue. perhaps we should re-read over the win32 port
858 2012-11-28 13:52:01 <sipa> TD: there are tons of win32 ports of leveldb out there, it seems
859 2012-11-28 13:52:39 <MC1984> sipa got any new .8 builds?
860 2012-11-28 13:52:45 <sipa> MC1984: no
861 2012-11-28 13:52:46 <lianj> andrew12-: lets hope you target the last 50er block and not the first 25er ;)
862 2012-11-28 13:52:48 <TD> yeah. nobody ever does the work to get it all upstream, unfortunately
863 2012-11-28 13:52:54 <gribble> 209997
864 2012-11-28 13:52:54 <TD> ;;blocks
865 2012-11-28 13:52:58 <TD> wow
866 2012-11-28 13:52:59 <TD> nearly there
867 2012-11-28 13:53:01 <_dr> *boring*
868 2012-11-28 13:53:21 <sipa> c'mon BFL just bring those ASICs online for half an hour, will ya?
869 2012-11-28 13:53:23 <topi`> anyone got champagne? this is almost like millennium :D
870 2012-11-28 13:53:33 <andrew12-> lianj: i only have 100mhash so i don't expect any amazing luck here
871 2012-11-28 13:54:04 <topi`> andrew12-: in a lottery, every ticket counts!
872 2012-11-28 13:54:28 <MC1984> if the hash estimates are even close to accurate i think they already did
873 2012-11-28 13:54:42 <andrew12-> like two weeks ago i was going to try to mine solo to see if i could get lucky... after about a week i switched to p2pool
874 2012-11-28 13:55:08 <MC1984> solo mining LOL
875 2012-11-28 13:55:13 <andrew12-> :D
876 2012-11-28 13:55:56 <topi`> hey, millions of ppl waste money on lottery
877 2012-11-28 13:55:59 <_dr> bfl is way too busy moving to the bahamas
878 2012-11-28 13:56:01 <lianj> i guess you have more luck to put a tx in that block :D
879 2012-11-28 13:56:57 <sipa> _dr: fail, if they're still doing that now :)
880 2012-11-28 13:57:10 <andrew12-> wonder how many pools will stop working
881 2012-11-28 13:57:23 <_dr> i mailed them about a prospective bulk order and academic pricing a while back
882 2012-11-28 13:57:41 <_dr> haven't heard back yet, they must be really eager to sell their product :]
883 2012-11-28 13:58:03 <sipa> they answered me nicely when i asked to change the delivery address
884 2012-11-28 13:58:10 <sipa> took a while, though
885 2012-11-28 13:59:06 <_dr> mh, i should change the address, too, and send it to someone in the us
886 2012-11-28 13:59:10 <topi`> MC1984: any idea where genjix has gone? he's just disappeared.
887 2012-11-28 13:59:14 <_dr> i wonder how much eu customs are going to charge
888 2012-11-28 13:59:32 <MC1984> i heard hes still in london
889 2012-11-28 13:59:53 <gmaxwell> >>> 2012-11-28 14:59:48,803 merkleMaker INFO New block: 00000000000000c6d9b57b9db3f318d9a3080a6182afa43718f45cdf962448ac (height: 209999; bits: 1a04e0ea)
890 2012-11-28 13:59:56 <kjj> 1...
891 2012-11-28 14:00:16 <MC1984> i think he was mega down about what happened with intersango and bitcoinica etc
892 2012-11-28 14:00:27 <topi`> MC1984: that was my impression as well
893 2012-11-28 14:01:07 <thermoman> how is this 50BTC/block and in the future 25BTC/block implemented? i mean who says "as of now you only get 25BTC per block"?
894 2012-11-28 14:01:14 <kinlo> gmaxwell: are you using eloi, or am I misinterpreting that output ? :)
895 2012-11-28 14:01:23 <gmaxwell> kinlo: yea, thats eloi
896 2012-11-28 14:01:41 <kjj> thermoman: subsidy = 50*COIN >> (block_count/210000)
897 2012-11-28 14:01:54 <kinlo> gmaxwell: I was assuming you were a p2pool fan
898 2012-11-28 14:01:58 <gmaxwell> thermoman: everyone says.
899 2012-11-28 14:02:13 <MC1984> poor guy did a lot of good work even outside his immediate business
900 2012-11-28 14:02:19 <sipa> *BING*
901 2012-11-28 14:02:25 <gmaxwell> kinlo: I am, of course. I swtiched to solo for a last effort to get a solo 50 btc block. :)
902 2012-11-28 14:02:26 <edcba> we have a winner ?
903 2012-11-28 14:02:29 <kjj> 0!
904 2012-11-28 14:02:30 <gmaxwell> 2012-11-28 15:02:10,687 merkleMaker INFO New block: 00000000000000f3819164645360294b5dee7f2e846001ac9f41a70b7a9a3de1 (height: 210000; bits: 1a04e0ea)
905 2012-11-28 14:02:34 <kinlo> ic :)
906 2012-11-28 14:02:42 <gmaxwell> ... which failed. :P
907 2012-11-28 14:02:55 <kinlo> :p
908 2012-11-28 14:02:55 <thermoman> kjj, gmaxwell: so if everyone (or at least more than the active peers) would use a modified bitcoin client they could change that?
909 2012-11-28 14:03:06 <edcba> yes
910 2012-11-28 14:03:16 <gmaxwell> thermoman: you made two statements, one is wrong.
911 2012-11-28 14:03:19 <lianj> yay, at least my tx made it into the block
912 2012-11-28 14:03:35 <thermoman> gmaxwell: which one is one? :)
913 2012-11-28 14:03:43 <edcba> one
914 2012-11-28 14:03:43 <TD> oh noooo
915 2012-11-28 14:03:44 <TD> i have a meeting
916 2012-11-28 14:03:47 <TD> gonna miss the big block
917 2012-11-28 14:03:59 <gmaxwell> thermoman: if everyone, sure??? dur. if everyone switched their bitcoin client for a paypal interface then they'd all be using paypal. .... If "more". No. Thats not how it works. Bitcoin is not a democracy.
918 2012-11-28 14:04:00 <TD> hope nothing explodes
919 2012-11-28 14:04:06 <sipa> 15:28:03 < sipa> hmm, one can argue that the bitcoin timeline started when satoshi started mining for block 0
920 2012-11-28 14:04:12 <sipa> 15:28:23 < sipa> so the switchover to the "second cycle" happens at block 209999
921 2012-11-28 14:04:13 <MC1984> whats everyone using to watch the network?
922 2012-11-28 14:04:25 <edcba> eyes
923 2012-11-28 14:04:31 <MC1984> hue
924 2012-11-28 14:04:44 <lianj> matrix scrolling bitcoin decoder
925 2012-11-28 14:04:48 <topi`> so who got the last 50btc block??
926 2012-11-28 14:04:53 <sipa> MC1984: bitcoind getinfo
927 2012-11-28 14:05:25 <kinlo> topi`: blockorigin will have it soon
928 2012-11-28 14:05:26 <kjj> tail