1 2013-01-15 15:34:35 <Luke-Jr> yeah, don't insult Diapolo like that ;)
  2 2013-01-15 15:35:15 <Diapolo> Luke-Jr: :-P nice you like me more ^^
  3 2013-01-15 16:49:57 <amiller_> what's the current status of the DNS seed rules?
  4 2013-01-15 16:50:20 <amiller_> according to notes here https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/709 the idea is the behavior of dns seeds should be public policy
  5 2013-01-15 16:50:43 <midnightmagic> amiller_: Most if not all of them have source available.
  6 2013-01-15 16:50:51 <amiller_> jgarzik's is the wiki list of fallback nodes, bluematt's seed is described here https://github.com/TheBlueMatt/dnsseed
  7 2013-01-15 16:51:01 <gmaxwell> amiller_: the source is available when there is source at all.
  8 2013-01-15 16:51:19 <BlueMatt> amiller_: nope, thats the old one
  9 2013-01-15 16:51:27 <BlueMatt> amiller_: dont know that anyone runs that one anymore...
 10 2013-01-15 16:51:28 <gmaxwell> (the source to jgarzik is not available, though I heard his wife is working on a fork)
 11 2013-01-15 16:51:40 <BlueMatt> amiller_: dnsseed.bluematt.me is bitcoinj-based
 12 2013-01-15 16:51:52 <midnightmagic> amiller_: Some people implied to me that if I write my own and put it on a reliable server (and publish source) that there's a good chance it'll make it into the dns seeds list..
 13 2013-01-15 16:52:12 <BlueMatt> amiller_: though i think Luke-Jr and sipa both run sipa's dnsseed
 14 2013-01-15 16:52:18 <gmaxwell> midnightmagic: ideally with some TLD diversity.
 15 2013-01-15 16:52:27 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: heh
 16 2013-01-15 16:52:29 <midnightmagic> gmaxwell: I have .ca :-)
 17 2013-01-15 16:53:06 <midnightmagic> hrm..  and .bit too, for what it's worth these days. sigh.
 18 2013-01-15 16:54:33 <midnightmagic> jgarzik's seed is closed?
 19 2013-01-15 16:54:35 <amiller_> ok found it https://github.com/sipa/bitcoin-seeder
 20 2013-01-15 16:54:42 <amiller_> so that accounts for two of the four
 21 2013-01-15 16:54:51 <BlueMatt> midnightmagic: jgarzik doesnt have a dnsseed
 22 2013-01-15 16:54:57 <BlueMatt> midnightmagic: just a static list
 23 2013-01-15 16:55:04 <midnightmagic> ah!
 24 2013-01-15 16:55:12 <midnightmagic> cool
 25 2013-01-15 16:55:27 <gmaxwell> midnightmagic: Note that I said the source to _jgarzik_ isn't available.
 26 2013-01-15 16:55:40 <midnightmagic> gmaxwell: Hence bluematt's "heh".
 27 2013-01-15 16:55:43 <gmaxwell> I understand the fork is being made by binary patching. :P
 28 2013-01-15 16:55:55 <BlueMatt> midnightmagic: gmaxwell was making a pun on the fact that jgarzik's wife is expecting baby verry soon
 29 2013-01-15 16:55:57 <midnightmagic> I've never seen you make a semi-dirty joke before. :)
 30 2013-01-15 16:56:33 <amiller_> hah, that joke went over my head... even though i sat for a while thinking about how to make it into a joke about kids and then decide it wasn't gonna be funny :/
 31 2013-01-15 16:56:42 <midnightmagic> :-)
 32 2013-01-15 16:56:58 <Luke-Jr> midnightmagic: nothing dirty about forking!
 33 2013-01-15 16:57:17 <midnightmagic> Luke-Jr: Depends on how you phrase a joke about it!
 34 2013-01-15 16:57:52 <midnightmagic> Luke-Jr: Also, "Good pun, paranomasiac!"
 35 2013-01-15 16:58:19 <midnightmagic> paro..?
 36 2013-01-15 16:58:37 <midnightmagic> paro.
 37 2013-01-15 16:58:38 <amiller_> BlueMatt, did you modify bitcoinj to be a dnsseed, is that published?
 38 2013-01-15 16:59:01 <BlueMatt> amiller_: its just a very poorly written app which uses bitcoinj
 39 2013-01-15 16:59:15 <BlueMatt> it hasnt been published atm, no
 40 2013-01-15 16:59:18 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: oh you replaced the old one?
 41 2013-01-15 16:59:25 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: yea, the php one was awful
 42 2013-01-15 16:59:28 <amiller_> ok so it would just behave roughly equivalent to an ordinary p2p nodes query
 43 2013-01-15 16:59:30 <BlueMatt> the bitcoinj one is only bad
 44 2013-01-15 16:59:43 <BlueMatt> amiller_: they all er
 45 2013-01-15 16:59:44 <BlueMatt> are
 46 2013-01-15 16:59:54 <gmaxwell> well jeff isn't.
 47 2013-01-15 17:00:07 <gmaxwell> But sipa's is... it does some logic about which nodes it excludes.
 48 2013-01-15 17:00:46 <Joric> does bootstrap.dat really speed up things? i see no essential difference
 49 2013-01-15 17:03:12 <Joric> also it would be great if bdb wouldn't be so fragile
 50 2013-01-15 17:06:29 <sipa> Joric: compared to what?
 51 2013-01-15 17:07:13 <Joric> compared to usual bootstrap
 52 2013-01-15 17:07:31 <sipa> BlueMatt: from what i see on g+, jgarzik's child node has been instanciated succesfully
 53 2013-01-15 17:07:39 <midnightmagic> yay
 54 2013-01-15 17:08:17 <BlueMatt> sipa: ahh, nice
 55 2013-01-15 17:08:51 <sipa> Joric: well, the block fetching logic is quite crappy and can get confused when a new block is announced during IBD, or the sync node goes away
 56 2013-01-15 17:08:52 <Joric> idk maybe it's because of slow cpu here and the whole bottleneck is verification
 57 2013-01-15 17:08:57 <sipa> Joric: so it can stall for several minutes
 58 2013-01-15 17:10:42 <Joric> i thought it would import the whole blockchain.dat at once without querying the network
 59 2013-01-15 17:11:03 <sipa> Joric: yes
 60 2013-01-15 17:11:18 <sipa> so that's the difference with network IBD
 61 2013-01-15 17:11:26 <Joric> it didn't, maybe i forgot to give a key?
 62 2013-01-15 17:11:35 <sipa> ... a key?
 63 2013-01-15 17:12:35 <Joric> i run 0.7.2 on linux i downloaded bootstrap.dat (2.4 gb) to the datadir looks it won't import it automatically
 64 2013-01-15 17:13:06 <sipa> why does it look like that?
 65 2013-01-15 17:13:49 <Joric> well it's been 5 hours since it started and blk0001.dat is just 500 mb
 66 2013-01-15 17:14:10 <sipa> do you see the GUI?
 67 2013-01-15 17:14:18 <Joric> nope, console version
 68 2013-01-15 17:14:27 <sipa> is it RPC reachable?
 69 2013-01-15 17:14:39 <Joric> yeah it should be
 70 2013-01-15 17:15:01 <sipa> 0.7.x imports bootstrap.dat before the node is started
 71 2013-01-15 17:17:39 <sipa> Joric: should it be, or is it? :p
 72 2013-01-15 17:19:52 <Joric> oh you mean it won't work before it would be fully imported well seems it's just ignoring bootstrap.dat in a whole
 73 2013-01-15 17:20:06 <sipa> indeed
 74 2013-01-15 17:20:58 <sipa> it should write "Importing bootstrap blockchain data file." to debug.log
 75 2013-01-15 17:21:15 <sipa> and rename to bootstrap.dat.old after import
 76 2013-01-15 17:24:11 <Joric> well it's not happening i have no idea why i placed it in a data directory and gave a proper -datadir
 77 2013-01-15 17:24:32 <sipa> and it's called exactly bootstrap.dat ?
 78 2013-01-15 17:24:44 <Joric> yep
 79 2013-01-15 17:24:46 <sipa> and in the directory supplied as -datadir ?
 80 2013-01-15 17:24:50 <Joric> yep
 81 2013-01-15 17:24:56 <sipa> very strange
 82 2013-01-15 17:25:14 <Joric> bitcoind is from bitcoin.org, 0.7.2
 83 2013-01-15 17:26:01 <sipa> and nothing about boostrap in debug.log at startup?
 84 2013-01-15 17:27:08 <Joric> nothing, it just starts bootstrapping from the network
 85 2013-01-15 17:27:33 <sipa> and it also reports beging 0.7.2? (first line in debug.log)
 86 2013-01-15 17:27:41 <sipa> or getinfo
 87 2013-01-15 17:29:08 <Joric> Bitcoin version v0.7.2-beta
 88 2013-01-15 17:29:48 <Joric> doesn't mention bootstrap.dat in log
 89 2013-01-15 17:30:01 <sipa> just "bootstrap"
 90 2013-01-15 17:30:13 <Joric> either
 91 2013-01-15 17:31:03 <sipa> just check the 0.7.2 source... i see no way how it could not see it
 92 2013-01-15 17:31:13 <Joric> allright
 93 2013-01-15 17:31:33 <sipa> well apparently not
 94 2013-01-15 17:33:42 <Joric> filesystem::path pathBootstrap = GetDataDir() / "bootstrap.dat"; the hell is that, c++11 ?
 95 2013-01-15 17:34:12 <Joric> what / does it concatenates strings or what
 96 2013-01-15 17:34:22 <sipa> it's boost
 97 2013-01-15 17:34:31 <Joric> ah, boost
 98 2013-01-15 17:34:58 <sipa> GetDataDir() returns a boost::filesystem::path, and operator/ is overloaded to do pathname composition
 99 2013-01-15 17:35:02 <kjj> c++ allows operator overloading.  in this case operator/(path,string) returns another path
100 2013-01-15 17:35:26 <Joric> no shit
101 2013-01-15 17:35:44 <Joric> i really don't get why it skips bootstrap.dat in my case
102 2013-01-15 17:36:04 <kjj> permissions?
103 2013-01-15 17:36:33 <sipa> even if the file just exist, it should say "importing"
104 2013-01-15 17:37:13 <Joric> same with 777
105 2013-01-15 17:37:15 <sipa> try adding a printf("Bootstrap path: %s\\n", pathBootstrap.string().c_str()); there?
106 2013-01-15 17:38:19 <Joric> not sure it will build boost on this machine in the nearest 4 hours
107 2013-01-15 17:38:46 <sipa> no need to build boost... unless you're on gentoo
108 2013-01-15 17:41:09 <Cusipzzz> on bitcoind does -nolisten still work? or is it -listen 0 now?
109 2013-01-15 17:41:19 <Cusipzzz> 7.x
110 2013-01-15 17:41:28 <sipa> Cusipzzz: -nolisten or -listen=0 should both work
111 2013-01-15 17:41:34 <sipa> unsure about -listen 0
112 2013-01-15 17:41:41 <Cusipzzz> sipa: thanks
113 2013-01-15 17:45:59 <CluckCreek> What does getblockcount return when there are two chains of equal length (ie, one or more blocks is about to be orphaned)?
114 2013-01-15 17:49:03 <sipa> it returns the number of blocks in the currently active chain
115 2013-01-15 17:50:06 <sipa> Joric: try importing it manually with -loadblock=/path/to/bootstrap.dat ?
116 2013-01-15 17:51:14 <CluckCreek> sipa: But does the "active chain" end at the split, or does it pick one chain until one of them is longer. What I'm wondering is wherther if I call getblockhash on the number returned by getblockcount, can I be sure that the hash returned is for the only block currently known to be at that height?
117 2013-01-15 17:52:35 <sipa> there can be multiple blocks with the same height, but only one can be active at a given time
118 2013-01-15 17:53:19 <sipa> height is the length of the chain, i.e. the distance from genesis
119 2013-01-15 17:53:27 <Joric> sipa, does -loadblock do exactly the same?
120 2013-01-15 17:53:43 <sipa> Joric: 3~~~3~~~3
121 2013-01-15 17:54:12 <sipa> Joric: ehh... yes
122 2013-01-15 17:54:23 <sipa> wth was that
123 2013-01-15 17:57:30 <CluckCreek> I understand that, I'm just trying to figure out if bitcoind picks one chain to be active when there are two chains of equal length, or if it behaves as if there is no block at the last height until the conflict is resolved. Or if bitcoind behaves in some other way.
124 2013-01-15 17:58:25 <kjj> the first one it sees is the active one, until the ambiguity is resolved by one or the other growing
125 2013-01-15 17:58:38 <CluckCreek> okay, thanks
126 2013-01-15 18:04:53 <Joric> sipa, fopen fails - Error opening file: Value too large for defined data type.
127 2013-01-15 18:05:08 <Joric> seems like 32-bit os limit
128 2013-01-15 18:05:49 <Joric> you dragged me into investigating it all by myself, you fox
129 2013-01-15 18:07:16 <Joric> FILE *file = fopen(pathBootstrap.string().c_str(), "rb"); <- Value too large for defined data type.
130 2013-01-15 18:08:09 <Joric> wait it maybe a printf error above let me see
131 2013-01-15 18:09:51 <Joric> nope seems like a legit fopen error
132 2013-01-15 18:10:22 <Joric> gotta try #define _FILE_OFFSET_BITS 64
133 2013-01-15 18:12:11 <Joric> works fine now
134 2013-01-15 18:13:01 <Joric> seems 0.7.2 wasn't patched for that
135 2013-01-15 18:14:14 <Joric> you maybe should've built it with -D_FILE_OFFSET_BITS=64
136 2013-01-15 18:21:37 <Joric> looks you patched that 3 months ago and it still didn't get to 0.7.2
137 2013-01-15 18:24:42 <Joric> the bad thing it fails silently theres even no warnings that file can't be opened
138 2013-01-15 18:25:01 <Joric> i just spent a hour finding that out
139 2013-01-15 18:28:43 <Luke-Jr> Joric: what master commit id?
140 2013-01-15 18:29:12 <jgarzik_> sipa: FWIW, 0.7.0 does not automatically import bootstrap.dat.  That starts with 0.7.1.
141 2013-01-15 18:29:21 <Joric> apparently that https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/1951
142 2013-01-15 18:29:47 <Joric> or that https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/1962
143 2013-01-15 18:29:56 <sipa> jgarzik: sure
144 2013-01-15 18:30:30 <Joric> check fopen next time! )
145 2013-01-15 18:30:50 <Luke-Jr> Joric: I see no sign of it in master, so it won't be in any stable backports
146 2013-01-15 18:31:02 <sipa> Joric: it was known to me that it couldn't *seek* beyond 2GB
147 2013-01-15 18:31:19 <sipa> Joric: but that it completely fails to open is a surprisr
148 2013-01-15 18:31:33 <Joric> well it doesn't open it as well file handler was 0
149 2013-01-15 18:31:53 <Luke-Jr> Joric: I don't see how #1962 is related, and it doesn't look like a bugfix at all?
150 2013-01-15 18:33:23 <sipa> 1962 is a fix for 1952
151 2013-01-15 18:33:32 <sipa> but that is not Joric's problem
152 2013-01-15 18:33:33 <Joric> not sure about seeking, i'm just telling fopen fails without -D_FILE_OFFSET_BITS=64
153 2013-01-15 18:36:14 <sipa> eh, a fix for 1951
154 2013-01-15 18:36:19 <Joric> it needs a warning and maybe #define _FILE_OFFSET_BITS 64 somewhere in the header
155 2013-01-15 18:36:55 <Joric> or maybe not, who uses 32-bit systems nowadays
156 2013-01-15 18:37:19 <sipa> Joric: windows users, mostl
157 2013-01-15 18:37:31 <sipa> but those don't seem to have that problem
158 2013-01-15 18:37:47 <Joric> yeah i don't remember that on vc either
159 2013-01-15 18:38:51 <Luke-Jr> I use 32-bit.
160 2013-01-15 18:39:27 <Joric> well, try loading a large bootstrap.dat
161 2013-01-15 18:39:33 <sipa> but... that is ridiculous
162 2013-01-15 18:40:01 <sipa> surely 32-bit linuxes can work with >2GiB files
163 2013-01-15 18:40:20 <Joric> http://compgroups.net/comp.unix.programmer/fopen-file-size-limitation/142420
164 2013-01-15 18:40:25 <Luke-Jr> I have much>2GB files for my VMs
165 2013-01-15 18:41:10 <Luke-Jr> bbiab
166 2013-01-15 18:43:20 <sipa> interesting
167 2013-01-15 18:43:53 <Joric> i run ubuntu 10.04 i386
168 2013-01-15 18:44:30 <sipa> where did you put that define to make it work?
169 2013-01-15 18:44:44 <Joric> just on the top of init.cpp
170 2013-01-15 18:57:18 <Joric> http://kotaku.com/5975610/the-exceptional-beauty-of-doom-3s-source-code?post=56177550 funny i always thought karmack is a lousy coder seems those hipsters just love him
171 2013-01-15 18:57:56 <Joric> via http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5055808
172 2013-01-15 19:00:34 <Joric> 'The Exceptional Beauty' lol
173 2013-01-15 19:09:28 <gmaxwell> https://en.bitcoin.it/w/index.php?title=Economic_majority&diff=34859&oldid=27978
174 2013-01-15 19:09:31 <gmaxwell> 
ACTION facepalm

175 2013-01-15 19:10:17 <Luke-Jr> :p
176 2013-01-15 19:10:34 <jgarzik> 
ACTION once again wishes for a wiki-like document hosting service where people approve edits (and editors)

177 2013-01-15 19:10:36 <Joric> all power to miners!
178 2013-01-15 19:10:52 <jgarzik> anyone-can-edit is pre-lulz
179 2013-01-15 19:10:58 <gmaxwell> Joric: it's especially funny because that page was purely about explaining how that wasn't the case!
180 2013-01-15 19:11:23 <gmaxwell> jgarzik: it works well for a lot of stuff.. though best when people are actively paying attention to fix stuff. Thanks, Luke-Jr.
181 2013-01-15 19:12:24 <Luke-Jr> gmaxwell: it does suggest that page needs some clarification, though - this smtp guy doesn't feel like a troll
182 2013-01-15 19:12:32 <Luke-Jr> so I'd guess he was genuinely confused by the page
183 2013-01-15 19:13:15 <jgarzik> smtp seems a bit hyperbolic on the forums (like me!) but does not seem like a genuine troll.  Maybe I'm wrong.
184 2013-01-15 19:13:24 <jgarzik> He seems to be trying to understand the details.
185 2013-01-15 19:13:59 <Luke-Jr> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Pyramining <-- this page looks like a scam, but I'm at a loss for how to rewrite it without just putting "Pyramining is a pyramid scheme"
186 2013-01-15 19:14:26 <gmaxwell> jgarzik: I dunno about troll, but he's obviously being intentionally nasty about his ignorance.
187 2013-01-15 19:14:56 <gmaxwell> Luke-Jr: I dunno. It was clear enough for him to make it say the opposite of what it was saying. :P
188 2013-01-15 19:16:14 <Luke-Jr> gmaxwell: from having watched his other edits, it looked to me like he was trying to clarify what he (mis)understood from reading it
189 2013-01-15 19:16:33 <gmaxwell> Luke-Jr: it's a mining company funded by investors with a pyramid-structured incentive scheme to encourage referrals.
190 2013-01-15 19:16:57 <gmaxwell> Luke-Jr: right, but normal misunderstanding or unsolvable thickheadedness?
191 2013-01-15 19:17:14 <sipa> Luke-Jr: i think that's true - his forum posts aren't very good english either, so i think he's misunderstanding things and filling the gaps with guesses
192 2013-01-15 19:17:40 <Luke-Jr> gmaxwell: time will tell I suppose
193 2013-01-15 19:17:49 <sipa> (and probably overly confident about those guesses)
194 2013-01-15 19:20:06 <gmaxwell> I probably wrote him off when he said "Sorry, I like to disagree" but perhaps I was overly hasty and that was a language gap and not someone actually saying they were trying to argue.
195 2013-01-15 19:20:40 <sipa> hah, i interpreted as "i beg to differ", actually
196 2013-01-15 19:20:44 <sipa> +that
197 2013-01-15 19:20:57 <gmaxwell> (perhaps I should have known I was making a mistake when I found myself agreeing with 2112 :P)
198 2013-01-15 19:20:59 <sipa> what age is 7th grade in the US?
199 2013-01-15 19:21:27 <gmaxwell> 12 years old. Oh is he 12? pretty impressive if so.
200 2013-01-15 19:21:53 <sipa> indeed :)
201 2013-01-15 19:22:18 <sipa> (not talking about smtp, if that wasn't clear)
202 2013-01-15 19:22:38 <gmaxwell> oh you're talking about the essay?
203 2013-01-15 19:22:42 <gmaxwell> Yea, I enjoyed that.
204 2013-01-15 19:23:43 <Luke-Jr> sipa: re d33a9218 - does CCoinsViewCache store changes in memory?
205 2013-01-15 19:24:15 <sipa> yes
206 2013-01-15 19:24:48 <Luke-Jr> sipa: might it be a good idea to call view.Flush inside the connect-loop, for every block as soon as total work is > what it was before?
207 2013-01-15 19:25:00 <Luke-Jr> IIRC the BDB code did this, to avoid resource limits
208 2013-01-15 19:25:24 <Luke-Jr> particularly when the reorg triggers a block being accepted that wasn't under old code (due to a bug)
209 2013-01-15 19:26:09 <sipa> Luke-Jr: not necessary, ConnectBestBlock already calls SetBestBlock in that way
210 2013-01-15 19:26:40 <Luke-Jr> ah
211 2013-01-15 19:29:11 <sipa> ... but ConnectBestBlock doesn't flush the cache
212 2013-01-15 19:29:47 <sipa> wait, SetBestChain does - never mind :)
213 2013-01-15 19:40:11 <Luke-Jr> sipa: that bug only affected LevelDB, right?
214 2013-01-15 19:42:18 <sipa> Luke-Jr: yes, the bug was introduced in ultraprune
215 2013-01-15 19:43:35 <Luke-Jr> ty
216 2013-01-15 22:42:50 <BlueMatt> anyone else been seeing lots of unicorns on github lately?
217 2013-01-15 22:43:02 <sipa> what are you smoking?
218 2013-01-15 22:43:33 <BlueMatt> thats the fail-whale equivalent that indicates "Page took too long to load"
219 2013-01-15 22:44:26 <sipa> i know :p
220 2013-01-15 22:54:54 <swappermall> I installed armory on my Ubuntu Precise virtual machine, but it hangs after trying to digest blk0001.dat ... any thoughts on this?
221 2013-01-15 23:36:10 <sipa> etotheipi_: ^
222 2013-01-15 23:49:57 <etotheipi_> hi swappermall
223 2013-01-15 23:50:33 <etotheipi_> swappermall: #bitcoin-armory
224 2013-01-15 23:51:01 <swappermall> hey etotheipi
225 2013-01-15 23:51:17 <swappermall> I'll check out bitcoin-armory
226 2013-01-15 23:51:26 <swappermall> thanx muchly!
227 2013-01-15 23:51:41 <swappermall> right now I'm having dinner
228 2013-01-15 23:52:01 <swappermall> I don't know your time zone, but will you be around later?
229 2013-01-15 23:52:09 <etotheipi_> yeah, I'll be around for a bit
230 2013-01-15 23:53:39 <swappermall> great
231 2013-01-15 23:53:59 <swappermall> I need to talk some shop later