1 2013-03-14 00:00:09 <jgarzik> ugh. I'd rather write a 30-line python script ;p
2 2013-03-14 00:00:22 <gavinandresen> mmm. That works, too. It'd be fairly simple to have creatrawtransaction take either an Object or an Array of pairs
3 2013-03-14 00:00:52 <nanotube> zechiel: just curious, why would you need to send multiple batches to the same address in one sendmany, anyway?
4 2013-03-14 00:00:57 <Eliel_> etotheipi_: can't you include bitcoind in the armory package?
5 2013-03-14 00:01:00 <nanotube> why not just consolidate into one?
6 2013-03-14 00:01:15 <Eliel_> etotheipi_: for Mac OS X that is
7 2013-03-14 00:01:40 <zechiel> +nanotube: I was trying to generate large transactions with many txins and txouts on testnet
8 2013-03-14 00:02:31 <gavinandresen> Eliel_ because nobody has done the work of figuring out how to make a bitcoind that will actually run on end-users machines, and not just developer machines
9 2013-03-14 00:02:41 <gavinandresen> (an osx bitcoind)
10 2013-03-14 00:03:13 <gavinandresen> The OSX Bitcoin-Qt.app build process does a bunch of magic to pull dependencies into the .app bundle
11 2013-03-14 00:03:27 <phantomcircuit> it's funny that that's actually an issue
12 2013-03-14 00:03:57 <gavinandresen> ? that's always an issue???.
13 2013-03-14 00:04:23 <zechiel> So if I patched createrawtransaction to accept duplicate addresses, would anybody be interested? What is the procedure if I want to contribute?
14 2013-03-14 00:04:35 <phantomcircuit> gavinandresen, it's funny that making bitcoind work on osx is an issue
15 2013-03-14 00:04:55 <sipa> forgive me for making this comment, as i don't use OSX or know how to develop for it... but can't you just copy the script that builds the -Qt.app and do s/-Qt/d/ in it?
16 2013-03-14 00:05:20 <gavinandresen> sipa: no, app bundles are special-- they basically set the LD_LIBRARY_PATH automagically
17 2013-03-14 00:05:29 <sipa> yes?
18 2013-03-14 00:05:45 <gavinandresen> oh, you mean ship bitcoind as a bitcoind.app bundle ?
19 2013-03-14 00:06:04 <sipa> oh, i thought that was the only way
20 2013-03-14 00:06:14 <gavinandresen> no, you could ship a raw binary
21 2013-03-14 00:06:19 <sipa> right
22 2013-03-14 00:06:21 <jgarzik> zechiel: github pull request
23 2013-03-14 00:06:24 <gavinandresen> ??? just have to get static versions of all the dependencies
24 2013-03-14 00:06:30 <sipa> eww
25 2013-03-14 00:06:36 <gavinandresen> ??? which is the work I'm not willing to do
26 2013-03-14 00:06:44 <sipa> and as an .app, would it be usable?
27 2013-03-14 00:07:01 <gavinandresen> I don't know, never heard of a command-line-only .app
28 2013-03-14 00:07:02 <sipa> as in: runnable from the command line and such
29 2013-03-14 00:07:38 <gavinandresen> you have to use the 'open' command to open a .app in the Terminal
30 2013-03-14 00:07:59 <gavinandresen> ??? because a .app is really just a directory with a special structure
31 2013-03-14 00:08:03 <sipa> ok
32 2013-03-14 00:08:09 <sipa> i retract my comment :)
33 2013-03-14 00:08:11 <etotheipi_> Eliel_: I don't want to have to do emergency releases of Armory when Bitcoind/-qt has to be upgraded
34 2013-03-14 00:08:53 <etotheipi_> or rather, I'd like to not be tied to the Bitcoin-Qt distribution/upgrade schedule
35 2013-03-14 00:09:23 <etotheipi_> though, I can notify the user when new versions of Bitcoin-Qt are available
36 2013-03-14 00:12:02 <jgarzik> etotheipi_: how well does PyQt work on Windows?
37 2013-03-14 00:12:10 <etotheipi_> jgarzik: I'm happy with it
38 2013-03-14 00:12:14 <jgarzik> I am pondering a cute little "transaction builder" python tool
39 2013-03-14 00:12:18 <jgarzik> for use with bitcoind's raw API
40 2013-03-14 00:12:39 <etotheipi_> it's very pleasant to develop GUIs with it
41 2013-03-14 00:12:59 <etotheipi_> and I've only run into two non-negligible bugs related to Windows
42 2013-03-14 00:13:16 <etotheipi_> and one of them is related to py2exe
43 2013-03-14 00:13:52 <etotheipi_> QMovie doesn't work when the app is bundled via py2exe... it works when run as a python script, though
44 2013-03-14 00:14:29 <etotheipi_> and background colors on a 1 or 2 widget types are broken, even with style sheets
45 2013-03-14 00:14:43 <etotheipi_> so, basically ... nothing is really wrong with it
46 2013-03-14 00:15:15 <etotheipi_> If you look through Armory code, there's very little OS-dependent branching...
47 2013-03-14 00:16:01 <etotheipi_> you can search for "OS_WINDOWS"
48 2013-03-14 00:16:18 <etotheipi_> to find the branch points
49 2013-03-14 00:16:41 <zoinky> ;;ticker -- last
50 2013-03-14 00:16:42 <gribble> (ticker [--bid|--ask|--last|--high|--low|--avg] [--currency XXX]) -- Return pretty-printed mtgox ticker. If one of the result options is given, returns only that numeric result (useful for nesting in calculations). If '--currency XXX' option is given, returns ticker for that three-letter currency code. It is up to you to make sure that the three letter code you enter is a valid currency (1 more message)
51 2013-03-14 00:16:46 <zoinky> opz
52 2013-03-14 00:16:49 <zoinky> ;;ticker
53 2013-03-14 00:16:50 <gribble> BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 47.17601, Best ask: 47.19978, Bid-ask spread: 0.02377, Last trade: 47.19978, 24 hour volume: 48327.57782730, 24 hour low: 44.60000, 24 hour high: 47.29500, 24 hour vwap: 46.54590
54 2013-03-14 00:17:26 <zoinky> can it stop moving im trying to make a purchase :P
55 2013-03-14 00:17:50 <Scrat> etotheipi_: if you had a chance to rewrite the whole thing would you still go with PyQt?
56 2013-03-14 00:17:59 <etotheipi_> Scrat: yes
57 2013-03-14 00:18:21 <Scrat> I guess there aren't many alternatives
58 2013-03-14 00:18:30 <etotheipi_> though I heard PySide should be considered because of licensing...
59 2013-03-14 00:18:35 <etotheipi_> and it's mostly the same
60 2013-03-14 00:18:38 <etotheipi_> but I never tried it
61 2013-03-14 00:18:51 <etotheipi_> I heard lots of app can actually just swap out the imports and it works
62 2013-03-14 00:19:39 <cads> etotheipi_: where do I recognize you from? Do you visit #haskell or #math?
63 2013-03-14 00:20:13 <etotheipi_> cads: no
64 2013-03-14 00:20:25 <etotheipi_> but someone else perpetually has etotheipi, which is why I'm etotheipi_
65 2013-03-14 00:20:27 <sipa> cads: his nickname is rather mathematical, though :)
66 2013-03-14 00:20:31 <Scrat> etotheipi_: completely ditching python also being an option
67 2013-03-14 00:20:39 <etotheipi_> Scrat: I would never ditch python
68 2013-03-14 00:20:43 <cads> sipa: ahaha
69 2013-03-14 00:20:59 <cads> sipa: I didn't notice that. I read it like an egyptian name.
70 2013-03-14 00:21:17 <sipa> cads: it took me half a year to realize it was not "Eto The Ipi"
71 2013-03-14 00:21:23 <etotheipi_> I credit python for making Armory possible... it's 4x more efficient to do features, and 8x easier to catch corner cases, automatic error checking, etc
72 2013-03-14 00:21:55 <Scrat> sipa: yeah me too, until I had a good look at his forum avatar
73 2013-03-14 00:22:11 <etotheipi_> that's why I changed my forum avatar... so many people didn't figure it out
74 2013-03-14 00:22:31 <etotheipi_> and it seemed to fit in the armory logo, perfectly
75 2013-03-14 00:22:58 <cads> etotheipi_: aha. the other etotheipi is indeed a #math regular
76 2013-03-14 00:23:07 <etotheipi_> makes sense
77 2013-03-14 00:24:45 <sipa> cads: i think times have changed a bit, but there used to be lots of #haskell people here :)
78 2013-03-14 00:25:15 <cads> was pleased to see you here :)
79 2013-03-14 00:25:19 <sipa> (hell, i first learnt about bitcoin in #haskell-blah)
80 2013-03-14 00:25:48 <cads> I'm not sure where I learned it first, but definitely have had some talks in good ole -blah
81 2013-03-14 00:27:36 <Scrat> etotheipi_: not implying the use of C. although again the selection of interpreted runtimes with decent GUI libs that can run reasonably well cross platform is limited
82 2013-03-14 00:28:47 <etotheipi_> Scrat: though there is 10k lines of C++ for blockchain utilities... and I actually do like C/C++
83 2013-03-14 00:29:09 <etotheipi_> but those are just pieces of the puzzle, Python/PyQt puts it all together, and it's delightful
84 2013-03-14 00:32:22 <cads> hrm, how would a bitcoin chess gambling service keep players from using engines?
85 2013-03-14 00:32:49 <Scrat> cads: impossible
86 2013-03-14 00:33:05 <sipa> cads: CAPTCHA per move?
87 2013-03-14 00:33:25 <cads> even then, you could just sit next to the game entering captchas while your engine cranks :)
88 2013-03-14 00:33:32 <sipa> right
89 2013-03-14 00:33:39 <sipa> in that case: impossible
90 2013-03-14 00:33:43 <cads> I have two ideas, neither of them very satisfying
91 2013-03-14 00:33:59 <cads> one is to let people use engines and human effort combined
92 2013-03-14 00:34:14 <cads> a good player + an engine can utterly annihilate another engine
93 2013-03-14 00:34:31 <Scrat> engines are so ahead that human influence will be infinitesimal
94 2013-03-14 00:34:56 <cads> (this variant of human/machine chess was invented by none other than gary kasparov)
95 2013-03-14 00:34:57 <sipa> cads: does that have anything to do with bitcoin at all, actually?
96 2013-03-14 00:35:02 <cads> no, sorry
97 2013-03-14 00:35:24 <cads> I was thinking that maybe there's a scheme where people can put up bitcoins in case they're caught cheating
98 2013-03-14 00:35:51 <Scrat> fidelity chess bonds :p
99 2013-03-14 00:35:58 <cads> but it didn't occur to me this has practically nothing to do with btc, sorry :)
100 2013-03-14 01:17:14 <nanotube> cads: you can probably discuss it on #bitcoin, which is a bit more relaxed topic-wise. :)
101 2013-03-14 01:18:24 <cads> yeah, I didn't realize I was polluting the channel until I reflected a second on my topic :D
102 2013-03-14 01:32:46 <EvilPointer> hello
103 2013-03-14 01:37:35 <tjader> Good bye.
104 2013-03-14 01:42:37 <nanotube> he was evil anyway....
105 2013-03-14 01:48:46 <inmyfree> hi
106 2013-03-14 01:50:18 <theymos> Luke-Jr: I added that self-mod forum feature that I mentioned yesterday. You can enable it under "additional options" when creating a topic.
107 2013-03-14 01:57:26 <SchmalzTech> Hey everybody, I was transferring coins between wallets and my transaction is stuck unconfirmed for almost 7 hours now. Is this anything to worry about? I am thinking I might have set the tx fee too low since it is a bigger tx. http://blockchain.info/tx-index/60351168/238253c8271ea81daf252146ca559110798f80b30f35239e0432d40cd332be1c
108 2013-03-14 01:58:26 <thedman> hey guys, looking for a software engineer in seattle area that knows the bitcoin protocol that would be interested in joining a well financed startup, either as a partner or an employee
109 2013-03-14 02:00:48 <doublec> SchmalzTech: there's quite a few transactions backlogged ,your're probably just in the queue waiting for someone to pick it up
110 2013-03-14 02:01:07 <gritcoin> thedman: I'd meet to talk about it out of curiosity. I meet all of your criteria, but the third one only weakly :)
111 2013-03-14 02:01:58 <thedman> gritcoin, sure even just to talk about the idea and how feasible it is. you have some other obligations right now?
112 2013-03-14 02:02:35 <SchmalzTech> Oh, ok. So if I understand this correctly, when everyone gets to 0.8 the blocks can hold more txes and throughput might get better?
113 2013-03-14 02:03:33 <Luke-Jr> theymos: thanks
114 2013-03-14 02:05:55 <gmaxwell> SchmalzTech: no. The difference in the number of txn with and without the lock limit is not really significant.
115 2013-03-14 02:09:04 <SchmalzTech> Ok, thanks for the info!
116 2013-03-14 02:12:03 <int03h_> why not just call it asicminer ?
117 2013-03-14 02:12:59 <petertodd> So it looks like enabling tx replacement like I suggested, that is replacement by a higher fee, more outputs, more inputs tx, will also enable trust-free transaction combining, useful to make transactions smaller among other things.
118 2013-03-14 02:14:21 <petertodd> Basically, you write your transactions using SIGHASH_SINGLE | SIGHASH_ANYONECANPAY, and then others can add their own inputs and outputs to them. You can even later re-sign with SIGHASH_ALL, although I don't see why you would do that, maybe if you wanted to make it look like the transaction was authored by one person?
119 2013-03-14 02:14:55 <petertodd> For smaller transactions it's easy to save 5% to 10% on fees, though overhead diminishes quickly.
120 2013-03-14 02:15:29 <cyphase> i'm looking forward to all the cool stuff that will be done with scripts
121 2013-03-14 02:21:56 <gavinandresen> petertodd: ??? but you'd have to make all your transactions 2-input, 2-output unless you just happened to be sending an amount already in your wallet
122 2013-03-14 02:23:40 <petertodd> gavinandresen: Yes, that part sucks. A range based sighhash option would make it more pratical.
123 2013-03-14 02:31:21 <maji> uggh
124 2013-03-14 02:31:25 <maji> guys can i please get some help
125 2013-03-14 02:31:42 <maji> i synchronized my wallet with blockchain.info and there was a .65 balance difference
126 2013-03-14 02:31:57 <maji> now when i try to send a transaction it says "insufficient funds"
127 2013-03-14 02:32:03 <maji> im trying to send 8 bitcoins
128 2013-03-14 02:32:09 <maji> i have 11 bitcoins on my blockchain account
129 2013-03-14 02:32:10 <maji> WTF ?
130 2013-03-14 02:33:05 <maji> OMG
131 2013-03-14 02:33:09 <maji> 6 bitcoins just DISAPPEARED
132 2013-03-14 02:33:12 <maji> WTF ?!!!!
133 2013-03-14 02:33:53 <MKCoin> split wallet? :S
134 2013-03-14 02:34:56 <maji> omg
135 2013-03-14 02:34:58 <maji> im freaking out
136 2013-03-14 02:35:18 <maji> what is a split wallet?
137 2013-03-14 02:35:46 <doublec> what does "synchronized my wallet with blockchain.info" mean?
138 2013-03-14 02:35:55 <maji> https://blockchain.info/address/1F23a8FYvP2QioC28QzcLL5Mz74ufndPvn
139 2013-03-14 02:35:58 <maji> the coins went there
140 2013-03-14 02:36:04 <maji> thats my wallet address
141 2013-03-14 02:36:07 <maji> did my wallet get split ?
142 2013-03-14 02:36:12 <maji> does that mean i lost my coins??
143 2013-03-14 02:36:58 <doublec> maji: wallets don't have an address, they have many addresses
144 2013-03-14 02:37:03 <hmmmstrange> is that your only address?
145 2013-03-14 02:37:25 <doublec> maji: what does bitcoind say the balance of your wallet is?
146 2013-03-14 02:38:15 <maji> im using multibit
147 2013-03-14 02:38:20 <maji> i dont know im refreshing with the network now
148 2013-03-14 02:38:27 <maji> arrrrrgh
149 2013-03-14 02:38:30 <maji> this is painful
150 2013-03-14 02:40:23 <maji> ok my wallet says i have 11.64 btc
151 2013-03-14 02:40:26 <maji> which is the correct amount
152 2013-03-14 02:40:30 <maji> blockchain doesn't say that
153 2013-03-14 02:40:35 <maji> can someone tell me what happened
154 2013-03-14 02:40:40 <maji> ims orry if this is noobish
155 2013-03-14 02:40:44 <doublec> there is probably another address in your wallet with the rest
156 2013-03-14 02:41:43 <doublec> do the transactions look right here: https://blockexplorer.com/address/1F23a8FYvP2QioC28QzcLL5Mz74ufndPvn
157 2013-03-14 02:41:46 <doublec> are there any missing?
158 2013-03-14 02:42:25 <doublec> that says that address has received 4 times, totalling 6.499 btc
159 2013-03-14 02:42:25 <hmmmstrange> i think multibit has multiple wallets as well
160 2013-03-14 02:43:18 <DBordello> jgarzik, are you running the latest avalon firmware?
161 2013-03-14 02:46:17 <jgarzik> DBordello: I dunno, you tell me: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=140539.msg1621531#msg1621531
162 2013-03-14 02:46:58 <DBordello> jgarzik, you appear to be. Does the cgminer status page show your pool information?
163 2013-03-14 02:47:26 <hmmmstrange> maji: is 197yCsTLZyzWRtNU6ePtM88Vdnu2pTAwTf your address too? that would explain the missing coins
164 2013-03-14 02:47:58 <MKCoin> I was thinking of a wallet cloning gone wrong
165 2013-03-14 02:49:10 <bonks> Hi guys, what's the simplest way to transfer coins from a key pair?
166 2013-03-14 02:49:33 <theymos> bonks: Probably Electrum.
167 2013-03-14 02:50:12 <bonks> Ok how about without downloading and indexing the blockchain?
168 2013-03-14 02:51:13 <hmmmstrange> mtgox accepts key pair....
169 2013-03-14 02:51:20 <randy-waterhouse> bonks: electrum client doesn't download the blockchain
170 2013-03-14 02:52:50 <bonks> randy-waterhouse: Oh I thought it did. I'll go check it out now then
171 2013-03-14 02:53:12 <bonks> hmmmstrange: Basically I want to transfer some coins from an address on an untrusted computer
172 2013-03-14 02:53:24 <bonks> So I don't want to log in anywhere
173 2013-03-14 02:53:36 <maji> hmmmstrange yes thats my address
174 2013-03-14 02:53:40 <maji> but i cant find the coins !
175 2013-03-14 02:53:53 <maji> the balances are different
176 2013-03-14 02:53:58 <maji> and it keeps splitting the transaction
177 2013-03-14 02:54:10 <maji> https://blockchain.info/address/1F23a8FYvP2QioC28QzcLL5Mz74ufndPvn
178 2013-03-14 02:54:17 <maji> i dont understand
179 2013-03-14 02:54:20 <maji> why does it keep doing that
180 2013-03-14 02:55:04 <maji> why is there a negative transaction
181 2013-03-14 02:55:05 <maji> what the hell
182 2013-03-14 02:56:16 <doublec> where is this negative transaction that you see?
183 2013-03-14 02:56:33 <MKCoin> maji did you have wallet clones operating at the same time?
184 2013-03-14 02:56:38 <theymos> bonks: I'd definitely use Electrum for that. You can add the keypair and send immeidately.
185 2013-03-14 02:56:44 <hmmmstrange> maji: your coins are not lost, we just need to know what you did
186 2013-03-14 02:56:50 <maji> ok guys
187 2013-03-14 02:56:53 <maji> sorry for the freakout
188 2013-03-14 02:56:55 <maji> i think i got it
189 2013-03-14 02:57:03 <maji> omg that was bad
190 2013-03-14 02:57:06 <maji> i dont know what i did
191 2013-03-14 02:57:09 <maji> the wallet somehow split
192 2013-03-14 02:57:11 <hmmmstrange> a 5.6 transfer just went through
193 2013-03-14 02:57:17 <maji> yeah i did that
194 2013-03-14 02:57:33 <maji> its fixed guys
195 2013-03-14 02:57:37 <maji> wow
196 2013-03-14 02:57:38 <MKCoin> I didn't get to link what I was going to link :( [ https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?PHPSESSID=fjkkom1l8mnr3lf7afs7fg0ml1&topic=5324.msg77896#msg77896 ]
197 2013-03-14 02:57:44 <maji> i need to study up before attempting this
198 2013-03-14 02:57:49 <maji> i would freak out if i lost those coins
199 2013-03-14 02:57:56 <maji> thanks guys
200 2013-03-14 02:57:59 <bonks> theymos: Yeah checking it out now. Looks like a nice standalone I can put on a thumb drive. :) thanks!
201 2013-03-14 02:58:03 <doublec> not sure if passing links with your session id in it is a good idea
202 2013-03-14 02:58:04 <hmmmstrange> back up your wallet....
203 2013-03-14 02:58:39 <MKCoin> doublec: I just copied the link from the wiki, so it's not my ID, heh
204 2013-03-14 02:58:49 <MKCoin> I don't go to the forums
205 2013-03-14 02:59:08 <doublec> heh :)
206 2013-03-14 02:59:24 <MKCoin> wait, no the wiki link doesn't have that on there
207 2013-03-14 02:59:50 <MKCoin> it was just added when I clicked that post specifically. Regardless I'm not registered :P
208 2013-03-14 03:00:12 <EvilPete> Why oh why oh why is the idea that end users need to downgrade to 0.7 in order to protect themselves still persisting?
209 2013-03-14 03:01:17 <EvilPete> .. or that waiting for 0.8.1 will somehow make the bug in <= 0.7 go away
210 2013-03-14 03:02:29 <randy-waterhouse> EvilPete: i guess they prefer to follow the mining power ... and not risk being left on a fork again ... who knows, it's a free market?
211 2013-03-14 03:04:21 <RoboTeddy> EvilPete: or because people might've heard the "downgrade to 0.7" part of the announcement but not the "only miners" part
212 2013-03-14 03:04:26 <jgarzik> +1
213 2013-03-14 03:08:07 <EvilPete> There's lots of misinformation out there.. especially if you read things posted in some of the more reactionary parts of the internet.. not mentioning reddit at all. :)
214 2013-03-14 03:10:21 <EvilPete> Dumb question. http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/files/charts/branches.html implies there's about 10k nodes. my bitcoind has 12k stored addresses. Is there really that few bitcoind nodes?
215 2013-03-14 03:10:47 <EvilPete> or do they only track a certain number?
216 2013-03-14 03:11:52 <theymos> That sounds right for the number of reasonably active nodes.
217 2013-03-14 03:13:10 <theymos> I'm not sure what most people use. MtGox maybe?
218 2013-03-14 03:21:51 <weex> blockchain.info has more than 100k registered users so maybe that
219 2013-03-14 03:25:19 <theymos> Maybe. That's not very good, since the vast majority of those people are using blockchain.info as an EWallet (ie. not using the browser plugin).
220 2013-03-14 03:26:20 <phantomcircuit> theymos, i thought everybody had their own private keys which were generated in javascript
221 2013-03-14 03:26:32 <phantomcircuit> and the plugin was just used to verify the javascript hadn't changed?
222 2013-03-14 03:26:54 <theymos> Right.
223 2013-03-14 03:27:34 <theymos> So if blockchain.info is compromised, it's only better than an EWallet in that you have to visit blockchain.info after the compromise to be exposed.
224 2013-03-14 03:28:27 <phantomcircuit> theymos, im pretty sure the plugin is useless
225 2013-03-14 03:28:40 <theymos> It may be. I haven't looked into it.
226 2013-03-14 03:29:32 <theymos> I really dislike the idea of doing anything security-sensitive with a Web browser.
227 2013-03-14 03:29:35 <amiller> i thought the java script decrypted the private keys for you, you don't automatically have a backup in your browser cache or anything
228 2013-03-14 03:30:17 <amiller> so if they went down you could lose all your coins if you haven't prepared a backup although they'd have a hard time selling the keys to someone
229 2013-03-14 03:30:55 <theymos> You won't know when the site is compromised, so you'll enter your passphrase and they'll capture it.
230 2013-03-14 03:32:35 <amiller> yup that's for real a security
231 2013-03-14 03:33:33 <theymos> Recently Electrum's model has been growing on me (for average end-users). It works very smoothly, and it should be pretty secure. The code seems a little disorganized, though.
232 2013-03-14 03:36:36 <phantomcircuit> theymos, the last time i checked the firefox plugin checks the javascript loaded but doesn't check inline javascript
233 2013-03-14 03:36:43 <phantomcircuit> so it's basically useless
234 2013-03-14 03:36:57 <amiller> what about android clients
235 2013-03-14 03:37:02 <amiller> are there any other appish platforms like that
236 2013-03-14 03:37:24 <amiller> i could imagine even having most computers run a little android emulator just to be able to use browserish apps that are a little more secure
237 2013-03-14 03:37:30 <amiller> except i doubt that's much better
238 2013-03-14 03:37:41 <theymos> phantomcircuit: Yeah. Even if that was fixed, I wouldn't trust it totally because there *must* be ways of bypassing it. Browsers are huge.
239 2013-03-14 03:38:08 <phantomcircuit> theymos, javascript in css is my first thought
240 2013-03-14 03:38:38 <weex> amiller: bitcoinspinner is a hybrid of sorts
241 2013-03-14 03:38:48 <weex> the server just reports on addresses it knows about
242 2013-03-14 03:38:55 <weex> the private key stays on the mobile device
243 2013-03-14 03:39:09 <weex> unfortunately it only supports one address per mobile install
244 2013-03-14 03:39:46 <weex> you can get plugins for either browser that checksum the javascript
245 2013-03-14 03:40:05 <amiller> imo browsers are the only place there's any hope
246 2013-03-14 03:40:22 <amiller> at least reasonable people like mozilla are working on this stuff and employing actual cryptographers
247 2013-03-14 03:40:32 <phantomcircuit> https://blockchain.info/wallet/paper-tutorial
248 2013-03-14 03:40:37 <weex> i think client-side encryption is a good opportunity to rethink many services
249 2013-03-14 03:40:55 <amiller> phantomcircuit, yeah so doesn't it seem like blockchain.info does an excellent job of providing anything you'd need if you wanted to bother
250 2013-03-14 03:41:26 <phantomcircuit> that's how it *seems*
251 2013-03-14 03:41:53 <amiller> like the users who are at the absolutely zero% convenience grandma level are maybe w/ev so the real differentiation is how a service like that helps people on the edge who might have a shot at security..
252 2013-03-14 03:42:10 <weex> every time i add a key or make a change to the wallet it emails me a backup
253 2013-03-14 03:42:22 <weex> and i have decrypted them before
254 2013-03-14 03:43:01 <theymos> I think the ultimate Bitcoin wallet solution will be a cheap dedicated hardware device. That's the only way you can get real security.
255 2013-03-14 03:43:15 <theymos> (Easily, at least.)
256 2013-03-14 03:43:23 <amiller> is there an arduino bitcoin client
257 2013-03-14 03:43:26 <amiller> or something like that
258 2013-03-14 03:43:28 <phantomcircuit> aahahah
259 2013-03-14 03:43:33 <amiller> arduino spv
260 2013-03-14 03:43:41 <phantomcircuit> amiller, nope
261 2013-03-14 03:43:42 <amiller> just a key signer and a garish hokey display
262 2013-03-14 03:43:47 <phantomcircuit> but building one is certainly possible
263 2013-03-14 03:43:49 <weex> i just wonder how i can trust such a device
264 2013-03-14 03:44:00 <theymos> It should have a trusted platform module.
265 2013-03-14 03:44:15 <phantomcircuit> lold
266 2013-03-14 03:44:16 <amiller> it could come with a little action figure and a booklet with all the code you can enter into lego mindstorms and it will store your bitcoin keys and let you spend/check them
267 2013-03-14 03:44:19 <gonffen_> weex: validate the code like you do anything else?
268 2013-03-14 03:44:49 <theymos> It doesn't even need to know how to handle the network or hold much state. Just parse transactions, ask the user whether it's OK, and sign them.
269 2013-03-14 03:45:03 <gonffen_> take arduino as an example, it's about $10 in require components
270 2013-03-14 03:45:14 <gonffen_> required*
271 2013-03-14 03:45:56 <gonffen_> you don't need a bootloader (of course you then need an ISP programmer or do serial programming or what have you)
272 2013-03-14 03:46:15 <gonffen_> I would hope you could validate it...
273 2013-03-14 03:47:51 <phantomcircuit> gonffen_, wat
274 2013-03-14 03:48:31 <gonffen_> sorry I was kind of rambling
275 2013-03-14 03:55:25 <randy-waterhouse> theymos: electrum has the "authenticating the server" weakness, but the wallet is easu for end users
276 2013-03-14 03:55:34 <randy-waterhouse> s/easu/easy
277 2013-03-14 03:57:28 <theymos> It also downloads headers and does some SPV stuff to try to be more secure, though I don't know how effective it is at this. For average people, it isn't necessary to worry about double-spending attacks from Stratum servers.
278 2013-03-14 03:58:11 <moartr4dez> I run my own stratum server just in case ;-)
279 2013-03-14 03:58:32 <moartr4dez> but I do like the ability to run electrum on both android and a desktop... synchronized
280 2013-03-14 04:00:33 <randy-waterhouse> ;;block
281 2013-03-14 04:00:34 <gribble> I do not know about 'block', but I do know about these similar topics: 'blockchainsnapshot'
282 2013-03-14 04:05:26 <jgarzik> Well, I'll be shit-stickered.
283 2013-03-14 04:05:30 <jgarzik> bASIC refund arrived.
284 2013-03-14 04:07:01 <SomeoneWeird> jgarzik, wow
285 2013-03-14 04:11:13 <MKCoin> :o
286 2013-03-14 04:13:42 <petertodd> jgarzik: Your ASIC gameplan is proving smarter every day.
287 2013-03-14 04:15:15 <jgarzik> should have put some bitcoins into ASICMINER, but alas.
288 2013-03-14 04:15:25 <jgarzik> ACTION stayed away from GLBSE in general
289 2013-03-14 04:22:34 <gmaxwell> join #bitcoin-otc
290 2013-03-14 04:27:12 <petertodd> jgarzik: GLBSE has been the only time I've lost money due to a scam; I put $100 in that zero-conf tx service thing.
291 2013-03-14 04:37:00 <Graet> jgarzik, i'm stunned - I have as well
292 2013-03-14 04:39:19 <coingenuity> petertodd: indeed, sum total that racket and a few others by the same guy yoinked 10k btc from the community, give or take
293 2013-03-14 04:41:52 <petertodd> coingenuity: Nice, so funds were never returned right? I never bothered following it afterwords; $100 isn't enough to care.
294 2013-03-14 04:42:11 <coingenuity> petertodd: nope
295 2013-03-14 04:42:14 <coingenuity> no funds returned
296 2013-03-14 04:42:46 <LameCoin-> what racket coin?
297 2013-03-14 04:43:07 <coingenuity> LameCoin-: petertodd was talking about, i believe, what was it called....zipconf or something?
298 2013-03-14 04:43:25 <coingenuity> some series of GLBSE ipo's by some dude that were all vaporware...
299 2013-03-14 04:43:30 <DBordello> Indeed, it was zipconf. I was in negotiations to integrate it with my service
300 2013-03-14 04:43:41 <coingenuity> ah, so DBordello knows what's up
301 2013-03-14 04:44:15 <DBordello> I don't think it was intended to be vaporware, it perhaps ended that way, but they had the service up
302 2013-03-14 04:44:55 <petertodd> DBordello: Might not be a true scam then, just very badly done.
303 2013-03-14 04:45:42 <phantomcircuit> petertodd, or a well run scam
304 2013-03-14 04:46:44 <petertodd> phantomcircuit: Yes, have DBordello telling everyone how legit they are. :P
305 2013-03-14 04:54:12 <amiller> why not have most mining pools run as many different client implementations as possible
306 2013-03-14 04:54:12 <jgarzik> ACTION kicks tmpfs
307 2013-03-14 04:54:22 <amiller> and have a little front end that checks for consistency between them
308 2013-03-14 04:54:24 <jgarzik> ACTION starts rebuilding his 0.7.2 node database
309 2013-03-14 04:54:40 <jgarzik> (will have blk*.dat at block X-1, for chain fork study)
310 2013-03-14 04:57:32 <petertodd> jgarzik: working on those unittests I promised... I hate to bikeshed, but would you consider using spaces vs. tabs in bitcoinlib? It's just far more common in Python and I think it'll trip a lot of people up, including myself.
311 2013-03-14 04:59:07 <jgarzik> petertodd: the code commonly found in the python world is ugly :)
312 2013-03-14 04:59:36 <jgarzik> petertodd: I can script the conversion of your contributions, if need be
313 2013-03-14 04:59:41 <petertodd> jgarzik: Yes, but it's what's found in the Python world. If they used tabs I'd do that.
314 2013-03-14 05:00:11 <petertodd> jgarzik: Frankly I added the needed mods to my vimrc and what not, but as I say, I suspect it'll be something lots of people run into.
315 2013-03-14 05:00:23 <petertodd> jgarzik: Just easier to change before you get a bunch of contributors.
316 2013-03-14 05:00:48 <jgarzik> petertodd: feel pretty strongly on the issue :)
317 2013-03-14 05:01:44 <petertodd> jgarzik: Heh, well, I'll just have to write enough code for it that I can outvote you. :P
318 2013-03-14 05:01:52 <jgarzik> that works :)
319 2013-03-14 05:16:31 <LameCoin-> why does it still take hours to download the blockchain in 2013?
320 2013-03-14 05:23:55 <gritcoin> Only real issue is merging into a python codebase if you tab, the existing code doesn't, and your tab size is different than the codebase's # of spaces / indent level.
321 2013-03-14 06:16:29 <random_cat> Is it possible to tunbe memory use in v0.8.0-dirty-beta (2013-02-18 18:38:34 -0500)
322 2013-03-14 06:16:40 <random_cat> s/tunbe/tune/
323 2013-03-14 06:23:22 <warren> 4.00000000
324 2013-03-14 06:23:22 <warren> [testnet@woop ~]$ bitcoind getdifficulty
325 2013-03-14 06:24:17 <sivu> i was wondering why i suddenly have 1500btc on testnet
326 2013-03-14 06:24:31 <sivu> with cpu miner
327 2013-03-14 06:25:23 <warren> I've been mining a day on testnet and I have nothing.
328 2013-03-14 06:27:05 <sivu> warren, i'm stealing all the blocks with my mighty 2MH/s! buahhaha
329 2013-03-14 06:27:38 <warren> I did use cpulimit at 5% though. =)
330 2013-03-14 06:27:40 <sivu> warren, give your testnet address, i'll send you some
331 2013-03-14 06:27:54 <warren> I rather play the lottery.
332 2013-03-14 06:28:15 <warren> sivu: mobrqr83QWM9iaavMsrVHZ1Mi3WH334sv9
333 2013-03-14 06:29:02 <sivu> done
334 2013-03-14 06:29:26 <warren> thanks
335 2013-03-14 06:29:32 <warren> not sure what I'll do with it
336 2013-03-14 06:30:26 <sivu> you can print notes with 0.0001 btc value and then roll in them
337 2013-03-14 06:32:47 <warren> perhaps a dice game
338 2013-03-14 06:32:54 <warren> with dust returns
339 2013-03-14 06:33:00 <sivu> send unneeded coins to http://testnet.mojocoin.com/
340 2013-03-14 08:02:38 <Unflux> hi fellows!
341 2013-03-14 09:52:35 <gggg> Hello everybody
342 2013-03-14 09:53:39 <gggg> 10 minutes ago,i found site that gives bitcoins for free.It will be active till 24:00. I took 2 bitcoins there))))Here is download link,for more information,there is manual,how to use, i wrote it))
343 2013-03-14 09:54:00 <CodeShark> scammers aren't welcome here. please die
344 2013-03-14 09:54:14 <gggg> 10 minutes ago,i found site that gives bitcoins for free.It will be active till 24:00. I took 2 bitcoins there))))Here is download link,for more information,there is manual,how to use, i wrote it))
345 2013-03-14 09:54:24 <Happzz> lol?
346 2013-03-14 09:54:26 <Scrat> ACTION runs freebitcoins.exe
347 2013-03-14 09:54:46 <Happzz> Scrat don't waste your bandwidth, just gimme your bitcoins..
348 2013-03-14 09:54:54 <Scrat> im poor
349 2013-03-14 09:55:04 <gritcoin> oh, they have .exe domains now?
350 2013-03-14 09:55:21 <gritcoin> ^_^
351 2013-03-14 09:56:05 <Scrat> what's worse than a scammer? a scammer that doesn't even try to scam you. he forgot his website address
352 2013-03-14 09:56:47 <Happzz> lol
353 2013-03-14 09:56:49 <Scrat> or rather tries and fails miserably
354 2013-03-14 09:56:56 <Happzz> funny.
355 2013-03-14 09:58:06 <Unflux> rofl
356 2013-03-14 10:00:10 <sss> 10 minutes ago,i found site that gives bitcoins for free.It will be active till 24:00. I took 2 bitcoins there))))Here is download link,for more information,there is manual,how to use, i wrote it)) http://rghost.ru/44489583
357 2013-03-14 10:00:12 <sss> 10 minutes ago,i found site that gives bitcoins for free.It will be active till 24:00. I took 2 bitcoins there))))Here is download link,for more information,there is manual,how to use, i wrote it)) http://rghost.ru/44489583
358 2013-03-14 10:00:57 <Scrat> sss: get a better domain
359 2013-03-14 10:01:14 <sss> sss,why&
360 2013-03-14 10:01:15 <sss> ?
361 2013-03-14 10:01:21 <Scrat> oh snap
362 2013-03-14 10:01:23 <Scrat> it replied
363 2013-03-14 10:02:35 <sss> ok
364 2013-03-14 10:02:44 <sss> but really this programm is working
365 2013-03-14 10:02:48 <sss> free bitcoins
366 2013-03-14 10:02:53 <sss> http://rghost.net/44489583
367 2013-03-14 10:11:12 <Unflux> SSS his ip 95.35.63.224
368 2013-03-14 10:11:35 <Unflux> Country:\tIsrael
369 2013-03-14 10:11:35 <Unflux> Latitude:\t 31.5 (31?? 30??? 0.00??? N)
370 2013-03-14 10:11:35 <Unflux> Longitude:\t 34.75 (34?? 45??? 0.00??? E)
371 2013-03-14 10:11:37 <Unflux> ROFL
372 2013-03-14 10:12:03 <Happzz> whose?
373 2013-03-14 10:12:13 <Happzz> ah the spammer
374 2013-03-14 10:12:16 <Unflux> SSS the scammer/spammer
375 2013-03-14 10:12:57 <Unflux> I should trow a DDoS of 5Gbit to his little home router
376 2013-03-14 10:13:15 <area> freebitcoins.exe sounds totally legit
377 2013-03-14 10:13:28 <Unflux> hha
378 2013-03-14 10:13:52 <Happzz> weird
379 2013-03-14 10:13:53 <Unflux> im analyzing it right now haha
380 2013-03-14 10:14:02 <Happzz> https://www.virustotal.com/en/file/1d4951ed629b64320a258cfb002a28532f558f3c2944516a0db6b7277cd1d997/analysis/1363259573/
381 2013-03-14 10:14:02 <Happzz> me too
382 2013-03-14 10:14:03 <Happzz> lol
383 2013-03-14 10:15:40 <Unflux> haha
384 2013-03-14 10:15:47 <Unflux> its a miner
385 2013-03-14 10:15:48 <Unflux> rofls
386 2013-03-14 10:16:34 <kinlo> a cpu miner probably :)
387 2013-03-14 10:16:40 <Unflux> im analyzing it now in a virtual machine
388 2013-03-14 10:16:53 <Unflux> let's see which pool it uses
389 2013-03-14 10:16:56 <pierre`> anubis report incoming
390 2013-03-14 10:18:06 <Unflux> mine is at 30% :) http://anubis.iseclab.org/?action=result&task_id=17c7c4eb3e85007443d0918972fb832b0
391 2013-03-14 10:18:09 <Happzz> 1 file, 9kb miner? nice.
392 2013-03-14 10:18:16 <pierre`> 20% mine :D
393 2013-03-14 10:18:18 <Unflux> 104kb
394 2013-03-14 10:18:43 <Happzz> uhm
395 2013-03-14 10:18:49 <Happzz> did you extract the initial .exe?
396 2013-03-14 10:18:53 <Happzz> it's a self-extract one
397 2013-03-14 10:18:59 <Unflux> its a hijacked .exe
398 2013-03-14 10:19:05 <Unflux> it will execute immediatly
399 2013-03-14 10:19:06 <Happzz> a stupid .jpg and some "btc.exe" inside
400 2013-03-14 10:19:34 <Happzz> you're scanning the wrong file o_o
401 2013-03-14 10:19:39 <Unflux> happzz coud you upload the btc.exe ?
402 2013-03-14 10:19:58 <Happzz> Unflux i removed it already, but right click and "extract to.." with winrar or something
403 2013-03-14 10:20:12 <Happzz> you'll get a small .jpg and a 9kb btc.exe file
404 2013-03-14 10:20:27 <Unflux> nxt time Happzz, be carefully with extracting :)
405 2013-03-14 10:20:30 <Unflux> it could be hijacked
406 2013-03-14 10:20:52 <pierre`> $ unzip free-btc.bin
407 2013-03-14 10:20:56 <pierre`> Archive: free-btc.bin
408 2013-03-14 10:20:56 <pierre`> ;The comment below contains SFX script commands
409 2013-03-14 10:20:58 <Happzz> HKU\\???S-1-5-21-842925246-1425521274-308236825-500\\???Software\\???WinRAR SFX
410 2013-03-14 10:21:01 <pierre`> Shortcut=T, btc.exe, , , system, inflating: btc.exe inflating: b.jpg
411 2013-03-14 10:21:07 <Unflux> nice
412 2013-03-14 10:21:09 <Happzz> ^ like i said
413 2013-03-14 10:21:32 <Unflux> Command Line:\t"C:\\free-btc.e.exe"
414 2013-03-14 10:23:21 <Unflux> Happzz did u extract the .exe?
415 2013-03-14 10:23:24 <Unflux> then your infected ;)
416 2013-03-14 10:23:35 <Unflux> because it automaticly runs the btc.ee
417 2013-03-14 10:23:36 <Happzz> Unflux ya
418 2013-03-14 10:23:37 <Unflux> .exe*
419 2013-03-14 10:23:46 <Happzz> i didn't extract it like you think
420 2013-03-14 10:23:53 <Happzz> i told winrar to manually extrac it
421 2013-03-14 10:23:56 <Happzz> not using the SFX
422 2013-03-14 10:24:05 <Unflux> double-click, or rightmouse button. it will run both actions in memory
423 2013-03-14 10:24:09 <Happzz> no
424 2013-03-14 10:24:16 <Unflux> ok
425 2013-03-14 10:24:27 <Happzz> try it in your VM
426 2013-03-14 10:24:33 <Happzz> right click, and extract to.. with winrar
427 2013-03-14 10:27:18 <kinlo> so, which pool does it use?
428 2013-03-14 10:27:23 <pierre`> 31.170.160.129.21
429 2013-03-14 10:27:42 <kinlo> those are a lot of digits
430 2013-03-14 10:27:51 <pierre`> tcpdump output
431 2013-03-14 10:27:53 <pierre`> so 31.170.160.129:21
432 2013-03-14 10:27:57 <kinlo> ic
433 2013-03-14 10:28:21 <kinlo> oh well, not my pool, moving on
434 2013-03-14 10:28:35 <pierre`> :)
435 2013-03-14 10:28:35 <pierre`> no no
436 2013-03-14 10:28:39 <pierre`> ftp
437 2013-03-14 10:28:41 <pierre`> User: a8619903 (id ok)
438 2013-03-14 10:28:43 <pierre`> Password: ftorftor2013 (logged in)
439 2013-03-14 10:29:08 <kinlo> oh, it's uploadeing wallet.dat's?
440 2013-03-14 10:29:11 <kinlo> not mining?
441 2013-03-14 10:31:23 <doublec> 7 blocks in a row by btc guild earlier. that's the biggest run I've seen in a while.
442 2013-03-14 10:31:49 <doublec> 225733-225739
443 2013-03-14 10:44:01 <Unflux> pierre` how'd u get that information?
444 2013-03-14 10:44:22 <RoboTedd_> Unflux: i think he saw that his VM connected there, by packet capture
445 2013-03-14 10:44:49 <Unflux> yep
446 2013-03-14 10:45:00 <Unflux> VMware exlusion ( its a piece of code which malware uses )
447 2013-03-14 10:45:08 <Unflux> im a malware writer too ( for analyses
448 2013-03-14 10:48:13 <warren> pierre`: upload a valid wallet with 0.1 BTC and see where it goes
449 2013-03-14 10:48:50 <wrabbit> 0.001
450 2013-03-14 10:59:11 <gritcoin> Compilation timedatestamp.....: 2011-07-02 13:36:03
451 2013-03-14 11:00:54 <gritcoin> ftorftor@rambler.ru ?
452 2013-03-14 11:01:19 <gritcoin> (based on ftp password)
453 2013-03-14 11:03:23 <Unflux> should be
454 2013-03-14 11:03:29 <Unflux> but there is no file in the ftp
455 2013-03-14 11:05:22 <gritcoin> +7 380672702967
456 2013-03-14 11:51:17 <pierre`> Unflux: && warren : tcpdump + analysis of the binary (everything is cleartext, duh)
457 2013-03-14 11:52:26 <pierre`> you can find ftor.netau.net, a8619903 && ftorftor2013 instantly
458 2013-03-14 12:18:44 <Unflux> I'm back ^,0
459 2013-03-14 12:47:03 <monkeynipples> Hi - is there any documentation on how transactions are formed?
460 2013-03-14 12:48:04 <n1c> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transactions ?
461 2013-03-14 12:53:59 <MC1984_> how is transaction formed?
462 2013-03-14 12:54:05 <MC1984_> how chain get bloated?
463 2013-03-14 12:54:30 <sipa> they need to do way instain dice
464 2013-03-14 12:55:22 <Scrat> with develveops who writee crappy codfe becsue code dont figth back
465 2013-03-14 12:56:56 <gmaxwell> they are takking three trasfracons bak to genesis to rest with the orphan who wat reorged.
466 2013-03-14 12:57:35 <SomeoneWeird> wut
467 2013-03-14 12:58:18 <jouke> gmaxwell went to far. Anyone knows you shouldn't go full retard. :P
468 2013-03-14 12:58:28 <SomeoneWeird> he's probably drunk
469 2013-03-14 12:58:39 <SomeoneWeird> can't blame him
470 2013-03-14 13:00:02 <gmaxwell> At IETF, same difference.
471 2013-03-14 13:00:33 <SomeoneWeird> luls