1 2013-05-04 00:12:45 <rbd> is there a better pushpool web frontend than mmCfe?? looks like it hasn't been updated in awhile
  2 2013-05-04 00:13:10 <rbd> I like mmcfe, but was just looking for a newer version...what I see on github hasn't been updated in 7 months and there are no newer forks
  3 2013-05-04 00:43:44 <alex3> hey people
  4 2013-05-04 00:43:52 <alex3> anyone here build win QT lately
  5 2013-05-04 00:44:03 <alex3> :D
  6 2013-05-04 00:44:03 <alex3> instructions seems to be many and mad
  7 2013-05-04 00:45:18 <duSn> alex3: what os?
  8 2013-05-04 00:48:51 <alex3> win server 2008 32 bit
  9 2013-05-04 00:49:25 <duSn> why not save yourself headache and just installed already compiled
 10 2013-05-04 00:50:06 <ezdiy> alex3: i did
 11 2013-05-04 00:50:44 <alex3> duSn: already compiled  cause I want to learn how to compile
 12 2013-05-04 00:50:47 <alex3> its handy
 13 2013-05-04 00:50:57 <alex3> else u can install wallet that take u coins, etc
 14 2013-05-04 00:50:58 <alex3> :P
 15 2013-05-04 00:51:09 <alex3> plus I am curious how it works
 16 2013-05-04 00:51:16 <ezdiy> i dont follow
 17 2013-05-04 00:51:25 <ezdiy> if you managed to compile it why are you asking? :)
 18 2013-05-04 00:51:55 <alex3> I mean I prefer to learn how do it
 19 2013-05-04 00:52:23 <ezdiy> well
 20 2013-05-04 00:52:24 <alex3> it seems simple, I installed open ssl boost QT visual studio even
 21 2013-05-04 00:52:25 <ezdiy> its kinda like
 22 2013-05-04 00:52:36 <ezdiy> nmake /fMakefile.vc
 23 2013-05-04 00:52:41 <ezdiy> *poof*
 24 2013-05-04 00:52:42 <ezdiy> magic
 25 2013-05-04 00:53:38 <ezdiy> alex3: getting familiar with vs is tricky sometimes though
 26 2013-05-04 00:53:49 <ezdiy> especially if you want to cross compile on msvc2008
 27 2013-05-04 00:54:00 <ezdiy> the usual ms service pack madness
 28 2013-05-04 00:54:09 <alex3> yes I might bribe my friend with small fpga to help me understand :D
 29 2013-05-04 00:54:10 <alex3> hehe
 30 2013-05-04 00:54:29 <alex3> yes linux is easier!
 31 2013-05-04 00:54:56 <ezdiy> well this has nothing to do with bitcoin actually
 32 2013-05-04 00:55:12 <ezdiy> its just microsoft failing at being proper dev platform
 33 2013-05-04 00:55:14 <ezdiy> nothing new
 34 2013-05-04 00:56:03 <alex3> :D
 35 2013-05-04 00:56:03 <alex3> oo google said I will help you alex
 36 2013-05-04 00:56:04 <alex3> wow
 37 2013-05-04 00:56:10 <ezdiy> yeah
 38 2013-05-04 00:56:14 <ezdiy> it helped everyone :)
 39 2013-05-04 00:56:28 <ezdiy> and if everything fails
 40 2013-05-04 00:56:29 <alex3> damn!
 41 2013-05-04 00:56:33 <ezdiy> theres the mingw makefile too
 42 2013-05-04 00:56:38 <ezdiy> which is almost like linux
 43 2013-05-04 00:56:46 <alex3> or Cygwin
 44 2013-05-04 00:56:52 <ezdiy> no curse words lol
 45 2013-05-04 00:56:53 <Vinnie_win> BlueMatt: The automated pull tester is badass
 46 2013-05-04 00:56:58 <alex3> what curse?
 47 2013-05-04 00:57:04 <ezdiy> cygwin is cursed
 48 2013-05-04 00:57:06 <alex3> google suggests it!
 49 2013-05-04 00:57:12 <ezdiy> lol, for bitcoin?
 50 2013-05-04 00:57:17 <alex3> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2540317/compiling-linux-sources-in-windows-enviroment
 51 2013-05-04 00:57:52 <ezdiy> yea
 52 2013-05-04 00:57:58 <ezdiy> thats kinda too general
 53 2013-05-04 00:58:05 <ezdiy> the question is misnomer though
 54 2013-05-04 00:58:17 <ezdiy> it should read 'compiling linux-only sourcecode on windows'
 55 2013-05-04 00:58:19 <duSn> ezdiy: a great majority of the bitcoin wallets are on windows machines? right
 56 2013-05-04 00:58:40 <ezdiy> duSn: most likely yeah
 57 2013-05-04 00:59:07 <alex3> yep
 58 2013-05-04 00:59:32 <alex3> for exampe I installed someone ready made small change test coin wallet and it was not even working
 59 2013-05-04 00:59:33 <alex3> :D
 60 2013-05-04 00:59:51 <ezdiy> ah
 61 2013-05-04 00:59:53 <ezdiy> here we go
 62 2013-05-04 01:00:08 <ezdiy> i should totally release that metacoin script
 63 2013-05-04 01:00:18 <ezdiy> (it patches git tree to create your very own scamcoin)
 64 2013-05-04 01:00:20 <alex3> what can it do?
 65 2013-05-04 01:00:29 <ezdiy> scamcoins
 66 2013-05-04 01:00:37 <ezdiy> the entry barrier is still too high
 67 2013-05-04 01:00:48 <alex3> wow awesome however I think it wont work
 68 2013-05-04 01:00:54 <ezdiy> i think 1000s of scamcoins, each running at diff 1 is what we need
 69 2013-05-04 01:01:01 <alex3> :D
 70 2013-05-04 01:01:01 <alex3> some people can barely open linux
 71 2013-05-04 01:01:09 <ezdiy> alex3: its pygtk actually
 72 2013-05-04 01:01:12 <ezdiy> and runs on windows
 73 2013-05-04 01:01:17 <ezdiy> in fact it runs only on windows
 74 2013-05-04 01:01:30 <alex3> well go ahead lets see
 75 2013-05-04 01:01:31 <alex3> what u made
 76 2013-05-04 01:01:40 <ezdiy> well, its kinda nuclear kind of thing
 77 2013-05-04 01:01:42 <alex3> lol
 78 2013-05-04 01:01:52 <alex3> it might nuke btc then
 79 2013-05-04 01:02:05 <ezdiy> well, more likely all the new altchains
 80 2013-05-04 01:02:12 <ezdiy> and one forum section
 81 2013-05-04 01:02:16 <alex3> lol
 82 2013-05-04 01:02:30 <alex3> ezdiy: swap all u btc for 1 bitbar
 83 2013-05-04 01:02:31 <alex3> :P
 84 2013-05-04 01:02:43 <alex3> it even got cheap shiny graphics
 85 2013-05-04 01:02:43 <ezdiy> none the less
 86 2013-05-04 01:02:51 <ezdiy> as long there are people buying it for 30 btc
 87 2013-05-04 01:02:55 <ezdiy> i have no intentions of releasing it
 88 2013-05-04 01:03:01 <ezdiy> for free :)
 89 2013-05-04 01:03:05 <alex3> :D
 90 2013-05-04 01:03:05 <alex3> well its 0.9 btc atm
 91 2013-05-04 01:03:15 <alex3> 1 bit bar is about 0.9 btc
 92 2013-05-04 01:03:49 <alex3> ezdiy: u script hardly works I say 30 btc or what
 93 2013-05-04 01:03:52 <alex3> :P
 94 2013-05-04 01:03:55 <ezdiy> hehe
 95 2013-05-04 01:04:20 <alex3> i on other hand can code coin for u however without GUI atm
 96 2013-05-04 01:04:21 <alex3> :P
 97 2013-05-04 01:04:30 <ezdiy> lol
 98 2013-05-04 01:04:32 <ezdiy> thats useless
 99 2013-05-04 01:04:47 <alex3> well  i got idea it can be freicoin based gui
100 2013-05-04 01:05:01 <alex3> it says press button wait and 80% goes to me
101 2013-05-04 01:05:03 <vrs> ezdiy: I thought of taking it a bit further, creating a bunch of those coins with parameters tweaked and automatically create a bunch of threads in the altcoin forum
102 2013-05-04 01:05:06 <alex3> in name of xx theorty
103 2013-05-04 01:05:16 <vrs> and then treat the whole thing as an evolutionary algorithm
104 2013-05-04 01:05:34 <alex3> vrs soon a group of people start to check new coins code
105 2013-05-04 01:05:40 <alex3> like ok team
106 2013-05-04 01:05:41 <alex3> :P
107 2013-05-04 01:05:50 <alex3> yay to alts revolution
108 2013-05-04 01:06:52 <vrs> I mean the whole "automatically write sales pitches" part still needs a bit of work...
109 2013-05-04 01:07:02 <ezdiy> vrs: yeah
110 2013-05-04 01:07:11 <ezdiy> gmaxwell suggested i should integrate smf hosting too
111 2013-05-04 01:07:16 <ezdiy> you get the full package
112 2013-05-04 01:07:28 <ezdiy> smf site, sales pitch to scamcoin section on btalk etc
113 2013-05-04 01:07:32 <Luke-Jr> this is #bitcoin-dev, you want #scamcoins-dev
114 2013-05-04 01:07:34 <alex3> whoever mines new coin http://media.okidoker.com/data01/c/2/5/5/167615/1011588/4814701_2.jpg?updated=1365862628
115 2013-05-04 01:07:58 <alex3> Luke-Jr:  come to defocus :D
116 2013-05-04 01:07:59 <alex3> hehe
117 2013-05-04 01:08:42 <ezdiy> Luke-Jr: i think contrib/scamcoin.py is actually bound to be pushed upstream
118 2013-05-04 01:08:49 <ezdiy> i mean, its so often requested feature
119 2013-05-04 01:09:02 <gmaxwell> ezdiy: I NAK you so hard your patch catches fire.
120 2013-05-04 01:09:02 <Luke-Jr> ezdiy: mere requests are irrelevant
121 2013-05-04 01:09:08 <Luke-Jr> gmaxwell: lol
122 2013-05-04 01:09:12 <alex3> hahaha
123 2013-05-04 01:09:34 <ezdiy> gmaxwell: i understand. it lacks the smf hosting part :/
124 2013-05-04 01:09:37 <gmaxwell> haha
125 2013-05-04 01:10:00 <vrs> ezdiy: does it have cloudflare integration? it needs cloudflare integration!
126 2013-05-04 01:10:10 <alex3> I am making auto GUI qt maker
127 2013-05-04 01:10:11 <alex3> :)
128 2013-05-04 01:10:14 <alex3> 60% done
129 2013-05-04 01:10:17 <Luke-Jr> it also needs to automate generating the foil variant ;)
130 2013-05-04 01:10:25 <gmaxwell> Yea, what bitcoin site is complete without funneling all traffic through cloudflare. :P
131 2013-05-04 01:10:29 <ezdiy> alex3: dont leak it in public dummy
132 2013-05-04 01:10:34 <ezdiy> alex3: you'd ruin my bussiness
133 2013-05-04 01:10:40 <alex3> ezdiy: u got none :)
134 2013-05-04 01:11:01 <alex3> plus I plan to use it for test and some other self purposes
135 2013-05-04 01:11:17 <ezdiy> well, i'm ok with -testnet for testing
136 2013-05-04 01:11:35 <alex3> while in defocus I though where is site for  people digital rep?
137 2013-05-04 01:11:56 <alex3> say you make ID keys and then people can rate you in variety of categories
138 2013-05-04 01:12:07 <alex3> people love rating it can overtake FB
139 2013-05-04 01:12:40 <alex3> categories can be to start with 1-coding skills 2-social skills 3-looks 4-IQ
140 2013-05-04 01:12:40 <ezdiy> sorry, in english please
141 2013-05-04 01:12:41 <alex3> and so on
142 2013-05-04 01:12:58 <alex3> ezdiy: online people rarely trust
143 2013-05-04 01:13:10 <alex3> now imagine global trust system
144 2013-05-04 01:13:11 <ezdiy> alex3: 1 - github, 2 - irc, 3 - facebook, 4 - poker sites
145 2013-05-04 01:13:19 <ezdiy> so you need to combine it all
146 2013-05-04 01:13:20 <alex3> people using digital ids
147 2013-05-04 01:13:48 <ezdiy> i, for one, would be to join github-irc-facebook-poker-all-in-one social site
148 2013-05-04 01:13:52 <ezdiy> with digital ids
149 2013-05-04 01:14:18 <alex3> well I can make new github with troll box, where each nick got profile and some comments page and also troll box people can auto join poker boxes below
150 2013-05-04 01:14:19 <alex3> thats it
151 2013-05-04 01:14:34 <ezdiy> well there are trollboxes
152 2013-05-04 01:14:43 <ezdiy> with each pull and commit
153 2013-05-04 01:14:44 <ezdiy> and issue
154 2013-05-04 01:14:52 <alex3> they are slow
155 2013-05-04 01:15:01 <alex3> it gotta be instant giant chat box
156 2013-05-04 01:15:04 <alex3> for all gits
157 2013-05-04 01:15:08 <ezdiy> wow
158 2013-05-04 01:15:11 <ezdiy> that sounds efficient
159 2013-05-04 01:15:14 <alex3> and tons of trolls shouting their complains
160 2013-05-04 01:15:19 <alex3> at huge rate
161 2013-05-04 01:15:32 <alex3> yes needs cloudfare to handle traffic
162 2013-05-04 01:16:01 <ezdiy> however it must leak ip via emails
163 2013-05-04 01:16:08 <alex3> plus in new git if dont answer min 10 complains per hour u git well something happens to it
164 2013-05-04 01:16:15 <ezdiy> so people will know where to set their /etc/hosts when cloudflare decides to kick the site out
165 2013-05-04 01:16:18 <alex3> like some files get locked
166 2013-05-04 01:16:18 <ezdiy> for too much ddos
167 2013-05-04 01:16:25 <alex3> or trolls get to edit git lol
168 2013-05-04 01:16:39 <alex3> :P
169 2013-05-04 01:16:39 <alex3> to hold trolls away must talk to them in box and get +1
170 2013-05-04 01:16:59 <alex3> ok thats too harsh lol
171 2013-05-04 01:17:16 <ezdiy> alex3: github has no concept of likes
172 2013-05-04 01:17:19 <ezdiy> they call it 'stars'
173 2013-05-04 01:17:24 <ezdiy> followers
174 2013-05-04 01:17:26 <ezdiy> and forks
175 2013-05-04 01:17:33 <ezdiy> forks being the most important
176 2013-05-04 01:20:00 <alex3> so forks are cool right?
177 2013-05-04 01:22:21 <alex3> but really apart gribble and scammer threads any ways to manage rep
178 2013-05-04 01:22:35 <alex3> those scammer threads lack substance
179 2013-05-04 01:23:34 <ezdiy> alex3: rep is overrated
180 2013-05-04 01:23:50 <ezdiy> i simply trust friends, regardless whether oti or irl
181 2013-05-04 01:24:26 <ezdiy> oti scammers fail at getting any favourable rapport since their operate shallow, with fast victim turnover
182 2013-05-04 01:24:39 <alex3> (6:22:49 AM) MrsGabs: Lady_Aleena: how would electronic documents smell of smoke?
183 2013-05-04 01:24:39 <alex3> (6:22:58 AM) Boohbah: ELECTRONS!
184 2013-05-04 01:24:39 <alex3> :P
185 2013-05-04 01:24:45 <alex3> from defocus
186 2013-05-04 01:25:07 <alex3> ezdiy: u can game gribble easily
187 2013-05-04 01:25:27 <alex3> make many accounts get each rate 2 or 3 then rate 10 accounts
188 2013-05-04 01:25:37 <ezdiy> never really bothered to do it
189 2013-05-04 01:25:38 <alex3> its just takes time yet doable
190 2013-05-04 01:25:58 <alex3> 
ACTION legit_buyer

191 2013-05-04 01:26:00 <alex3> haha
192 2013-05-04 01:26:05 <alex3> I do like this
193 2013-05-04 01:26:06 <ezdiy> sensible otc traders have decent socks raddar though
194 2013-05-04 01:26:15 <ezdiy> judging from the everyday drama at #bitcoin-otc
195 2013-05-04 01:26:17 <alex3> people who dont use irc say wow cool P
196 2013-05-04 01:30:01 <ezdiy> kids these days.
197 2013-05-04 02:01:09 <ProfMac_> what is going on with bitcointalk.org?
198 2013-05-04 02:01:29 <ssjsij> mkk
199 2013-05-04 02:02:36 <ssjsij> a
200 2013-05-04 02:05:26 <ashman3> ee
201 2013-05-04 02:07:33 <ashman3> heh
202 2013-05-04 02:07:36 <ashman3> Yes
203 2013-05-04 02:07:37 <ashman3> it's
204 2013-05-04 02:07:45 <ashman3> and
205 2013-05-04 02:07:55 <ashman3> I
206 2013-05-04 02:08:05 <ashman3> never
207 2013-05-04 02:08:13 <ashman3> they
208 2013-05-04 02:08:22 <ashman3> *withdrawn
209 2013-05-04 02:08:45 <IanCormac> What the hell
210 2013-05-04 02:08:51 <ashman3> im
211 2013-05-04 02:09:07 <IanCormac> Why was he repeating every first word from #bitcoin comments?
212 2013-05-04 02:09:59 <ashman3> btc-e
213 2013-05-04 02:10:02 <ashman3> I've
214 2013-05-04 02:10:03 <ashman3> yeah
215 2013-05-04 02:10:05 <ashman3> IanCormac:
216 2013-05-04 02:10:07 <ashman3> i
217 2013-05-04 02:10:36 <IanCormac> lol
218 2013-05-04 02:13:04 <ashman3> Adran:
219 2013-05-04 02:13:05 <ashman3> heneusl_pay:
220 2013-05-04 02:14:21 <ashman3> kdkqwd:
221 2013-05-04 02:16:17 <ashman3> WHo do you think is the owner hen?
222 2013-05-04 02:16:23 <ashman3> but im a op already in a channel
223 2013-05-04 02:16:33 <ashman3> but just need to get one
224 2013-05-04 02:16:49 <ashman3> SeanTheTech: Sure. But if you want to help out in channels here, you generally need to start helping out, no expectation of ops.
225 2013-05-04 02:17:12 <ashman3> heneusl_pay, it is not publicly owned ... it is publicly traded
226 2013-05-04 02:17:23 <ashman3> I own transmetta also.
227 2013-05-04 02:17:30 <ashman3> )
228 2013-05-04 02:17:35 <Luke-Jr> nanotube: tcatm BlueMatt jgarzik UukGoblin gmaxwell sipa coingenuity SomeoneWeird
229 2013-05-04 02:17:38 <ashman3> Adran: true but if i help out in channel for a year....you are not gonna give me op.....for example
230 2013-05-04 02:17:51 <ashman3> SeanTheTech: depends on specific channel, really.
231 2013-05-04 02:17:53 <ashman3> SeanTheTech: That isn't true at all.
232 2013-05-04 02:18:04 <ashman3> Adran: lol
233 2013-05-04 02:18:11 <ashman3> SeanTheTech: Ubuntu gives ops to people who help out for long periods of time, freenode staff were picked without an expectation of being ops.
234 2013-05-04 02:18:13 <ashman3> etc
235 2013-05-04 02:18:34 <ashman3> Adran: do you have a channel
236 2013-05-04 02:18:46 <ashman3> I have quite a few channels.
237 2013-05-04 02:19:18 <Luke-Jr> nanotube: thx
238 2013-05-04 02:19:26 <nanotube> :)
239 2013-05-04 02:23:48 <ashman3> I had a period of a year absence in there, and another 6 month a bit before
240 2013-05-04 02:24:47 <ashman3> my channel is getting a bit stamping
241 2013-05-04 02:24:51 <jgarzik> ;;kban ashman3
242 2013-05-04 02:25:38 <ssjsij> ';
243 2013-05-04 02:25:45 <IanCormac> Lol
244 2013-05-04 02:25:49 <IanCormac> what is the deal with this guy
245 2013-05-04 02:34:15 <nanotube> mm, ban list seems to be full
246 2013-05-04 02:35:01 <Luke-Jr> if we ban *!*@* then it takes care of them all in 1 item!
247 2013-05-04 02:39:34 <nanotube> that should hold us for a while. >_>
248 2013-05-04 02:44:08 <phantomcircuit> nanotube, lol
249 2013-05-04 02:48:08 <helo> not-bitcoin idea - optional structure that indicates a vouch by the miner that a series of blocks affect the txout set the same as a supplied single transaction or sequence of transactions. coinbase transaction is valid only if nobody can publish proof that the supplied transaction does not correctly represent the blocks indicated. if proof is published before the coinbase transaction is spendable, then they can substitute a coinbase transaction of their
250 2013-05-04 03:24:24 <SeanTheTech> goodnight:)
251 2013-05-04 05:43:54 <dansmith_btc> Hi, after running -txindex=1 -reindex, does every future invocation of bitcoind has to have -txindex=1 explicitely ?
252 2013-05-04 05:46:13 <Scrat> dansmith_btc: yes
253 2013-05-04 05:47:20 <dansmith_btc> Scrat, what if I forget to add -txindex=1 on a future invocation, will I have to -txindex=1 -reindex again?
254 2013-05-04 05:48:06 <wumpus> https://github.com/bitcoin  LOL github identifies the main programming language of bitcoin as "TypeScript"
255 2013-05-04 05:49:35 <Goonie_> can anyone tell me why this transaction has been confirmed? https://blockchain.info/tx/bdac9a5c2ea20d753198d5e27be90d095d70a1e75d6aa8a2a84fa0dad9870694
256 2013-05-04 05:49:38 <Goonie_> in theory, it shouldn't because fee is too low (should be 12 * 0.0005 = 0.006 BTC)
257 2013-05-04 05:49:47 <Scrat> dansmith_btc: pretty sure that if you forget to add it you'll get a hole of transactions that can't be looked up, so you have to reindex
258 2013-05-04 05:50:30 <Scrat> Goonie_: yep too big
259 2013-05-04 05:51:05 <Goonie_> Scrat: it *has* been confirmed. I'd like to know why.
260 2013-05-04 05:51:35 <wumpus> well there are miners that consider every transaction, fee or not
261 2013-05-04 05:52:02 <Scrat> oh, I just woke up sorry
262 2013-05-04 05:52:18 <Goonie_> ok, and how did the tx get to the miners? I thought such tx are not even relayed.
263 2013-05-04 05:52:50 <dansmith_btc> Scrat, do you think I should make a feature request- if there was -txindex=1 once, it should be implied for the future invocations unless overriden with -txindex=0
264 2013-05-04 05:52:56 <wumpus> could have been sent directly to a miner; but I don't know the relaying rules in detail
265 2013-05-04 05:53:26 <Goonie_> ok thanks
266 2013-05-04 05:55:19 <Scrat> dansmith_btc: then there'd only be a -reindex and a -deleteindex or something
267 2013-05-04 06:49:46 <grau> !ticker
268 2013-05-04 06:49:47 <gribble> BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 102.88727, Best ask: 103.00000, Bid-ask spread: 0.11273, Last trade: 103.00003, 24 hour volume: 181551.84427870, 24 hour low: 79.00000, 24 hour high: 103.88880, 24 hour vwap: 90.67003
269 2013-05-04 08:00:57 <Aurigae1> hi there, i got a lil problem wit ha eloipool installation, something changed since my last install 5 months ago, pastebin is install log & error message http://pastebin.com/pwU4bzFn "ImportError: No module named bitcoinrpc.authproxy"
270 2013-05-04 09:36:03 <frib> how can I make bitcoin-qt deliver coins to a specific public address if I find a block?
271 2013-05-04 09:37:04 <BlueMatt> you cant (with bitcoin-qt/d)
272 2013-05-04 09:37:25 <BlueMatt> well, not easily, though I believe there is the fancy block gen api thinggy
273 2013-05-04 09:38:11 <BlueMatt> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/BIP_0022 and further ones
274 2013-05-04 09:38:26 <BlueMatt> and BIP 23
275 2013-05-04 09:38:49 <frib> how can I do it without bitcoin-qt/d then?
276 2013-05-04 09:39:18 <BlueMatt> no other clients can/should mine, so...you cant
277 2013-05-04 09:39:32 <BlueMatt> its either use bip 22/23 or modify bitcoind
278 2013-05-04 09:40:10 <BlueMatt> no, wait, you should be able to use a private p2pool to do solo mining to whatever address you do
279 2013-05-04 09:40:21 <BlueMatt> so use p2pool as a mining proxy
280 2013-05-04 09:45:10 <frib> so i would have to connect my miner to p2pool instead of to bitcoin-qt server?
281 2013-05-04 09:45:41 <frib> nvm
282 2013-05-04 10:04:20 <default_> Hello, reindexing with -txindex=1 of the last 3000 blocks takes about 5 secs per block on my modern laptop.I need to wait another 5 hours. If I interrupt the reindexing now, will it resume where it left off?
283 2013-05-04 10:04:49 <The_Fly> it should, but dont listen to me
284 2013-05-04 10:04:57 <The_Fly> wait for someone else to confirm either way
285 2013-05-04 10:12:35 <skinnkavaj> when i send from 1 adress, why can i see 2 public keys?
286 2013-05-04 10:12:38 <skinnkavaj> like this
287 2013-05-04 10:12:39 <skinnkavaj> https://blockchain.info/sv/tx/a3ea6440f5f2342bd0716a58dc1d96495cdda93bab34e2172c377eceb1a75a66
288 2013-05-04 10:13:00 <skinnkavaj> 13ES is my public key
289 2013-05-04 10:15:21 <The_Fly> was the other transaction not your change
290 2013-05-04 10:15:44 <The_Fly> (or the other person's change?)
291 2013-05-04 10:16:01 <Scrat> 19Qe is your change
292 2013-05-04 10:16:10 <Scrat> also I hate you for changing my b.i to swedish
293 2013-05-04 10:16:34 <kauzu> https://blockchain.info/tx/24d322d2f32352cf1ab747d8877c7799e1080e31a36105eb4b9ea79287a4643f will the network accept this transaction?
294 2013-05-04 10:17:09 <Scrat> kauzu: yes, it will take a few hours to confirm
295 2013-05-04 10:17:48 <kauzu> scrat: even with such a small fee?
296 2013-05-04 10:19:27 <Scrat> yep
297 2013-05-04 10:21:30 <kauzu> on which position in the bitcoined source is decidet if a transaction will be accepted?
298 2013-05-04 10:22:39 <Scrat> read this https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees
299 2013-05-04 10:23:07 <Scrat> zero (or low) fees are all about miner rules and supply & demand
300 2013-05-04 10:24:44 <gonffen> here is a moderately dumb question
301 2013-05-04 10:25:40 <gonffen> what are the odds a transaction will be relayed if the fee is below 0.0005btc/kb given an output less than 0.01
302 2013-05-04 10:27:18 <Sealy> hi daybyter
303 2013-05-04 10:27:47 <daybyter> Hi Sealy!
304 2013-05-04 10:28:03 <Sealy> how are you?
305 2013-05-04 10:28:21 <daybyter> Great! How are you?
306 2013-05-04 10:28:36 <tormenta> hi, could any of devs check this issue > https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=194801.msg2024732#msg2024732 thanks!
307 2013-05-04 10:29:13 <Sealy> yeah good
308 2013-05-04 10:29:15 <Sealy> very busy
309 2013-05-04 10:29:27 <kauzu> scrat: priority = sum(input_value_in_base_units * input_age)/size_in_bytes // is input_value_in_base_units 1 satoshi? .... is input_age the time since last transaction of input? if yes in milli seconds or what?
310 2013-05-04 10:29:29 <tormenta> compueter restarted, all bitcoin install files removed than unpacked again, still same issue
311 2013-05-04 10:29:49 <daybyter> Learned yesterday about stop-loss orders...
312 2013-05-04 10:29:56 <Scrat> kauzu: blocks
313 2013-05-04 10:30:02 <daybyter> now I'm not sure, if I should implement it in the lib.
314 2013-05-04 10:30:18 <daybyter> might result in a lot of work, if I do it right...
315 2013-05-04 10:32:39 <Sealy> yep daybyter, my site has them
316 2013-05-04 10:32:45 <Sealy> well automatic stop losses
317 2013-05-04 10:32:57 <Sealy> theyre very expensive for me if the market gaps
318 2013-05-04 10:33:00 <Sealy> but i cover user losses
319 2013-05-04 10:33:29 <daybyter> I just thought about adding a condition field to the Order class.
320 2013-05-04 10:33:52 <daybyter> using the formal trading language, that I proposed in the forum.
321 2013-05-04 10:34:10 <daybyter> and let the OrderBook evaluate this condition, before the order is executed.
322 2013-05-04 10:39:26 <Sealy> the problem with stop losses is that theydont work properly if the stop order is partially filled
323 2013-05-04 10:40:41 <daybyter> I could let the user deal with that poblem...
324 2013-05-04 10:40:51 <daybyter> just evaluate the expression...
325 2013-05-04 10:41:08 <daybyter> ...but that's problem enough...writing such an interpreter... :-(
326 2013-05-04 10:41:34 <kauzu> scrat: will every transaction that is smaller than 10k byte AND priority over 57.6M AND 0.01 BTC or larger be accepted by the network?
327 2013-05-04 10:41:57 <kauzu> even if fee is zero
328 2013-05-04 10:45:39 <daybyter> Hi Jasmin68k!
329 2013-05-04 10:46:01 <daybyter> Want to develop bitcoin software now?
330 2013-05-04 10:46:36 <Sealy> you are doing a huge amoount of work daybyter
331 2013-05-04 10:46:41 <daybyter> ???
332 2013-05-04 10:46:45 <Sealy> you should hire a few helpers on the forum
333 2013-05-04 10:46:46 <Jasmin68k> Hi daybyter :) Not at the momemt, but you never know...lurking won't hurt.
334 2013-05-04 10:46:49 <Sealy> to help you code
335 2013-05-04 10:46:51 <daybyter> not enough...
336 2013-05-04 10:47:12 <daybyter> I thought by releasing the code, some devs would help with the lib.
337 2013-05-04 10:47:32 <daybyter> So I could focus on the rest. But no luck so far... :-(
338 2013-05-04 10:47:58 <daybyter> So I stopped releasing more code for now, and will just maintain the already released code for now.
339 2013-05-04 10:48:07 <daybyter> Rest remains closed source...
340 2013-05-04 10:51:47 <kauzu> will every transaction that is smaller than 10k byte AND priority over 57.6M AND 0.01 BTC or larger be accepted by the network even if fee=0 ?
341 2013-05-04 10:53:05 <gonffen> it should be at least relayed given the current rules
342 2013-05-04 10:53:19 <gonffen> being included in a block becomes a supply/demand thing though I think
343 2013-05-04 10:59:13 <kauzu> gnoffen: has anyone ever made stats or so about the conditions for a transaction to be includet into a block? i think every pool has another behavior
344 2013-05-04 11:00:44 <daybyter> Jasmin68k: KillerChicken asks, why you are not in the f64 chat...
345 2013-05-04 11:02:43 <kauzu> do nodes check for double spends befor relaying?
346 2013-05-04 11:02:52 <Jasmin68k> daybyter: Why would I be there?
347 2013-05-04 11:03:25 <kauzu> if yes do they only check the blockchain or also the current rawmempool
348 2013-05-04 11:03:30 <eqoloco> Hello. When will the transaction appear after it has been sent?
349 2013-05-04 11:04:37 <kauzu> eqoloco: it will appear at the as soon it is relayed to the receiver... but it can take a time until it is valid
350 2013-05-04 11:07:11 <eqoloco> kauzu: how do I know when its valid?
351 2013-05-04 11:11:26 <kauzu> eqoloco: it has to be includet to a block
352 2013-05-04 11:12:49 <sipa> Scrat: you don't have to specify -txindex every time, it automatically uses the value of the database when it was created; but you're allowed to specify it again afterwards, and it will complain if it doesn't match the database then)
353 2013-05-04 11:16:29 <gonffen> kauzu: I have seen a cdf plot or something similar for probability of inclusion in a block but they may make assumptions about the rules. It's also probably an average since it would depend on transaction volume and the like. I don't know much about that aspect of things.
354 2013-05-04 11:21:10 <sipa> Goonie_: seen https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/2592 ?
355 2013-05-04 11:31:29 <sipa> kauzu: yes, nodes check for double-spends before relaying
356 2013-05-04 11:31:46 <sipa> kauzu: they don't relay anything that conflicts with the blockchain or their memory pool
357 2013-05-04 11:32:09 <default__> sipa, wrt -txindex - so, no need to specify it again, it is implied?
358 2013-05-04 11:33:47 <sipa> default__: indeed, it's just a setting that can only be set/changed when starting a database or reindexing
359 2013-05-04 11:34:04 <sipa> but you can put for example txindex=1 in your config file to be sure you always have the index
360 2013-05-04 11:34:16 <default__> ok, cheers
361 2013-05-04 11:38:39 <kauzu> is the transaction fee = vin - vout?
362 2013-05-04 11:38:56 <ezdiy> basically
363 2013-05-04 11:41:01 <Goonie_> sipa: nice
364 2013-05-04 11:41:16 <Goonie_> sipa: you did not implement the encryption part, did you?
365 2013-05-04 11:41:24 <sipa> indeed not
366 2013-05-04 11:41:29 <sipa> or not yet :)
367 2013-05-04 11:42:33 <Goonie_> sipa: so for the direction Bitcoin Wallet -> bitcoin-qt you need the intermedia openssl step. The other direction works, but has the risk of leaked keys
368 2013-05-04 11:42:51 <Goonie_> s/intermedia/intermediate/
369 2013-05-04 11:48:08 <sipa> Goonie_: agree
370 2013-05-04 11:48:40 <Goonie_> Bitcoin Wallet had quite some download surge from China this night
371 2013-05-04 11:49:48 <Belxjander> Goonie_: the Android App?
372 2013-05-04 11:49:59 <Goonie_> Belxjander: yes
373 2013-05-04 11:51:29 <Belxjander> Goonie_: I use that on my phone... but I also have Blockchain/Mtgox/Bitstamp/btce/bitcoincentral/CoinBase and a few other wallets that are empty around the place as well
374 2013-05-04 12:01:31 <kauzu> how long does it take until the network forgets an unconfirmd transaction?
375 2013-05-04 12:02:55 <jaakkos> kauzu: when miners and clients are restarted.
376 2013-05-04 12:05:48 <kauzu> jaakkos: but what if a node recives the transaction again after restart from  another node that keeps relaying?
377 2013-05-04 12:06:13 <jaakkos> kauzu: it does not
378 2013-05-04 12:06:31 <jaakkos> kauzu: mempool transactions are not re-broadcast, except by senders and recipients of the transaction
379 2013-05-04 12:07:23 <kauzu> lets say there is a bad node that spaams out every transaction that is valid but will not be includet into a block because of too low fee or so to keep the coins unspendable
380 2013-05-04 12:07:30 <jaakkos> kauzu: then again, this behavior enabled the fork of March 11
381 2013-05-04 12:07:45 <jaakkos> i mean, the double spend during that fork
382 2013-05-04 12:08:18 <kauzu> fork of March 11 ?
383 2013-05-04 12:09:30 <sipa> http://bitcoin.org/chainfork.html
384 2013-05-04 12:19:16 <jaakkos> kauzu: i think your concern is valid, though, even without such attack, i would expect one has to wait for quite a long time to have enough mempools flushed to be able to spend again. perhaps the solution, if there is one coming, could take care of the attack as well.
385 2013-05-04 12:21:08 <jaakkos> kauzu: there's been some discussion about expiration timers. if a timestamp would be embedded in the transaction and so included in txhash, it could be used to mitigate both problems. though at least one question is, what should the expiry time be.
386 2013-05-04 12:24:47 <kauzu> jaakkos:  instead of a timer you could say keep the tx in memory until there is a "double spend" with the same input transaction. then drop the one with lower txfee and propagate the one with higher txfee
387 2013-05-04 12:25:23 <jaakkos> kauzu: but that would make 0-confirmation double spend attacks much more feasible ;)
388 2013-05-04 12:25:51 <jaakkos> basically an attacker would have nearly 100% success rate :D
389 2013-05-04 12:26:28 <kauzu> jaakkos: what is a 0-confirmation double spend attack? i think if there are 2 double spends with 0 confirmations only one can be included
390 2013-05-04 12:26:51 <jaakkos> kauzu: an attacker attempts to propagate 2 transactions that spend the same input(s) to different output addresses
391 2013-05-04 12:27:13 <jaakkos> kauzu: one of the transactions buys the attacker a service that he receives immediately, without the seller waiting for a confirmation
392 2013-05-04 12:27:22 <jaakkos> kauzu: and the other transaction, sends the money back to the attacker
393 2013-05-04 12:27:43 <jaakkos> then the attacker hopes that the seller sees the first one, but they who mine the next block, sees the other.
394 2013-05-04 12:28:03 <kauzu> [16:23] <kauzu> jaakkos:  instead of a timer you could say keep the tx in memory until there is a "double spend" with the same input transaction. then drop the one with lower txfee and propagate the one with higher txfee // then check for higher fee AND for same output adresses
395 2013-05-04 12:28:25 <jaakkos> ah, yes, that would be interesting
396 2013-05-04 12:29:31 <kauzu> jaakkos: and isnt the seller stupid if he accepts without any confirmation?
397 2013-05-04 12:29:56 <jaakkos> "yes" though there are many sellers who do
398 2013-05-04 12:30:16 <jaakkos> i think bitpay accepts, and of course satoshidice
399 2013-05-04 12:30:25 <gonffen> many would have too... are you really going to wait 10 minutes for a coffee?
400 2013-05-04 12:32:27 <kauzu> but what if you make a tx > 10k bytes and no fee ... there is a high chance that this transactions will never be confirmed .... i think satoshidice checks for that or not?
401 2013-05-04 12:33:24 <jaakkos> kauzu: that's no a problem for satoshidice because the reward they send, spends the tx that you sent - if that tx doesn't happen, the reward will never happen
402 2013-05-04 12:36:33 <kauzu> jaakkos: but could that be a problem for other services?
403 2013-05-04 12:38:28 <jaakkos> i suppose. but i'm not even sure how easy it is to get such transactions to propagate. also, other services could have a deal with mining pool(s) to ensure they mine transactions sent to the service provider.
404 2013-05-04 12:41:34 <kauzu> jaakkos: but if you have your own mining pool you could use this "shop/ seller" behavior of 0confirmation to accept the "reward or whatever" and double spend the "bet or whatever" to your own adress
405 2013-05-04 12:41:47 <kauzu> so i think its never a good idea to accept 0 confirmation
406 2013-05-04 12:44:24 <jaakkos> kauzu: you mean that the attacker has his own mining pool?
407 2013-05-04 12:48:13 <kauzu> yes... ok that is highly improbable but you would only need to solve one block
408 2013-05-04 12:53:17 <jaakkos> yeah, they would eventually succeed if they try enough times. but to put it in perspective, the services offered at 0-confirmation are inexpensive, and such a party would be making quite a bunch of money just by running the pool normally... and if they get caught of such activity, the pool would get bad reputation
409 2013-05-04 12:54:30 <jaakkos> but i think those who offer 0-confirmation services, should take care to monitor the network at multiple nodes to see if a double spend comes in... then the clerk would probably catch the attacker before he leaves (the cafe, eg.). i would expect bitpay to already do so, not sure though
410 2013-05-04 12:57:04 <gonffen> would a transaction > 10kb with no fee even relay throughout the network?
411 2013-05-04 13:09:05 <sipa> gonffen: not be reference clients
412 2013-05-04 13:10:07 <gonffen> sipa: is it reasonable to assume it would not propogate or does the network have enough diversity that it could?
413 2013-05-04 13:10:47 <sipa> good question...
414 2013-05-04 14:25:02 <eqoloco> I use Bitcoin-qt. My question is, if the program synchronized once at 100%, will it continue to synchronize later several times? Or is it just one time?
415 2013-05-04 14:26:56 <gonffen> it will synchronize whenever it is behind the network in blocks
416 2013-05-04 14:27:28 <sipa> it is always synchronizing
417 2013-05-04 14:28:06 <eqoloco> ok
418 2013-05-04 14:28:06 <eqoloco> Will it be as slow to sync then when it is finished 100%? Or will it be "small" updates?
419 2013-05-04 14:28:32 <sipa> synchronizing means downloading and verifying blocks from the network
420 2013-05-04 14:28:43 <sipa> the initialize synchronization is doing that for all historical blocks
421 2013-05-04 14:28:53 <sipa> after that, it's just catching up when a new block is published
422 2013-05-04 14:29:03 <sipa> which happens once every 10 minutes on average
423 2013-05-04 14:29:13 <eqoloco> but will it be slow as in the start?
424 2013-05-04 14:29:16 <eqoloco> or will it be faster later?
425 2013-05-04 14:31:04 <sipa> the initial synchronization is only once
426 2013-05-04 14:35:19 <llop> first time, bitcoint-qt downloads blocks which arose during the last 3 years or so -- if you don't start it for a month, then it will next time download blocks for 1 month, so it will be much faster
427 2013-05-04 14:35:30 <eqoloco> Should I set (pay) transfer fee if I only receive money with Bitcoin?
428 2013-05-04 14:35:36 <eqoloco> sipa: ok
429 2013-05-04 14:35:49 <eqoloco> llop : ok
430 2013-05-04 14:36:23 <kauzu> eqoloco: fee does not matter if you only receive... but why would someone only receive?
431 2013-05-04 14:36:51 <llop> maybe he's warren buffet and wants to buy the whole supply of bitcoins!
432 2013-05-04 14:37:22 <eqoloco> kauzu: ok. what do you mean by that "but why would someone only receive?"
433 2013-05-04 14:37:27 <eqoloco> how should I answer on that question?
434 2013-05-04 14:37:38 <eqoloco> why I receive money? or what?
435 2013-05-04 14:37:50 <gonffen> aren't you going to spend money as well?
436 2013-05-04 14:37:50 <llop> if you only receive, you cannot spend any bitcoins -- there doesn't seem to be much use in only receiving bitcoins, as at some point you want to spend them again
437 2013-05-04 14:39:50 <eqoloco> llop: Can not save them as long as you want? To then send them when the rate is " as best"?
438 2013-05-04 14:39:57 <eqoloco> gonffen: not yet
439 2013-05-04 14:40:24 <llop> sure you can -- make sure you back up your wallet after receiving them, and encrypt it properly!
440 2013-05-04 14:41:00 <eqoloco> llop: ok. should I back up my wallet every time I recieve new money?
441 2013-05-04 14:41:19 <kauzu> i have a question about https://blockchain.info/tx/24d322d2f32352cf1ab747d8877c7799e1080e31a36105eb4b9ea79287a4643f  ... it is about 30 blocks old but has not been included into one... what is wrong with this tx?
442 2013-05-04 14:41:54 <llop> no, that's not needed -- in reality you only need to back it up once, and most likely even just after starting is enough -- but I'd back it up after I'm done receiving money
443 2013-05-04 14:42:41 <eqoloco> ok. what do you mean by "and most likely even just after starting is enough"?
444 2013-05-04 14:43:50 <llop> eqoloco: well, it depends somewhat on how you generate your adresses to receive your money; and honestly I don't know the details of the client so exactly. In any case, if you back up after you received the money that's sufficent (but I'm quite sure that even if you back up before that it suffices).
445 2013-05-04 14:44:36 <eqoloco> llop: ok. I am using Bitcoin-qt
446 2013-05-04 14:52:36 <eqoloco> <Raccoon> eqoloco: you can backup your wallet as frequently as you wish to.  It just won't be necessary since the wallet.dat file won't change until you start running out of pre-calculated addresses from your address pool.
447 2013-05-04 14:52:36 <eqoloco> <Raccoon> it keeps replenishing them once you get low.  I don't know how low 'low' is.
448 2013-05-04 14:52:40 <eqoloco> how low is it?
449 2013-05-04 14:53:03 <sipa> it always maintains 100 unused keys
450 2013-05-04 14:53:11 <eqoloco> sipa: ok
451 2013-05-04 14:53:18 <Raccoon> sipa: it replenishes 1 new key when 1 is used?
452 2013-05-04 14:53:25 <Raccoon> Not when you're down to 20 unused?
453 2013-05-04 14:53:42 <Raccoon> I don't think that's right.
454 2013-05-04 14:53:47 <sipa> it replenishes immediately
455 2013-05-04 14:53:55 <Raccoon> and that's kind of bad.
456 2013-05-04 14:54:17 <hpprinter100> Hi
457 2013-05-04 14:54:41 <hpprinter100> whats the fastest way to get bitcoind up and running on linux? downloading the blockchain is taking forever
458 2013-05-04 14:55:21 <jaakkos> hpprinter100: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=145386.0
459 2013-05-04 14:55:23 <sipa> connect to a fast node (-connect=IP) and set your dbcache high (-dbcache=1024 to use 1 GiB for example)
460 2013-05-04 14:55:30 <sipa> or use bootstrap.dat
461 2013-05-04 14:56:55 <kauzu> i have a question about https://blockchain.info/tx/24d322d2f32352cf1ab747d8877c7799e1080e31a36105eb4b9ea79287a4643f  ... it is about 30 blocks old but has not been included into one... what is wrong with this tx?
462 2013-05-04 14:58:15 <hpprinter100> jakkos can i PM you?
463 2013-05-04 14:58:28 <lianj> kauzu: the fee is a joke
464 2013-05-04 14:58:48 <sipa> hpprinter100: keep it here, more people can help you
465 2013-05-04 15:00:08 <kauzu> lianj: yes... but i think this tx has the conditions for zero fee or not
466 2013-05-04 15:00:34 <eqoloco> if they only receive money with Bitcoin, it is possible to trace the IP address or any other information, about the person that receiving the money?
467 2013-05-04 15:00:41 <sipa> kauzu: it doesn't
468 2013-05-04 15:00:47 <sipa> kauzu: it has an output < 0.01 BTC
469 2013-05-04 15:03:01 <kauzu> sipa: has every output to be > 0.01 ... the main transaction is 0.02 ... the other is only for input=output
470 2013-05-04 15:03:32 <sipa> kauzu: the bitcoin network doesn't know what output is change or 'real'
471 2013-05-04 15:04:06 <kauzu> sipa: ok so every output has to be > 0.01?
472 2013-05-04 15:04:13 <sipa> yes
473 2013-05-04 15:05:22 <hpprinter100> sipa my question http://pastebin.com/pzyaiV6D
474 2013-05-04 15:05:46 <kauzu> sipa: why isn't it enouth if one vout is > 0.01? i dont see any advantage in this behaviour
475 2013-05-04 15:06:15 <sipa> kauzu: it'd be trivial to circumvent it
476 2013-05-04 15:06:46 <Goonie_> related to your discussion: I wonder why this tx has been confirmed https://blockchain.info/tx/bdac9a5c2ea20d753198d5e27be90d095d70a1e75d6aa8a2a84fa0dad9870694
477 2013-05-04 15:06:48 <Goonie_> Its 11.5 kB in size but only got a fee of 0.0005. Should have 0.006 if I have it right.
478 2013-05-04 15:07:25 <Goonie_> I know miners can confirm anything they want but it should not even reach them, because such tx are not relayed, right?
479 2013-05-04 15:07:58 <lianj> Goonie_: you could send it to a miner directly and hope for the best
480 2013-05-04 15:08:22 <sipa> hpprinter100: that looks strange, i wouldn't use those downloads
481 2013-05-04 15:08:38 <sipa> hpprinter100: i'll check whether they are still useful for 0.8.1
482 2013-05-04 15:08:49 <Goonie_> lianj: yeah but afaik this tx was created by Bitcoin Wallet and it does not send directly to miners unless its by coincidence
483 2013-05-04 15:08:56 <sipa> hpprinter100: but i'd advise you to use bootstrap.dat
484 2013-05-04 15:09:20 <eqoloco> it is possible to trace the IP address or any other information, about the person that receiving the money?
485 2013-05-04 15:09:28 <eqoloco> with Bitcoin
486 2013-05-04 15:10:13 <lianj> Goonie_: still took like 8 hours to be confirmed
487 2013-05-04 15:10:33 <kauzu> goonie_: most pools have a minimum block size... if they find a new one very fast they fill up the block with transactions as this
488 2013-05-04 15:11:47 <Raccoon> eqoloco: not naturally.  not without tricking that person into connecting their bitoin client to yours at the time they spend those coins.
489 2013-05-04 15:12:11 <Raccoon> eqoloco: and even then it would be possible to use plausable deniability
490 2013-05-04 15:14:56 <eqoloco> Raccoon: ok. If you send money, then? Can you trace the IP or any other information about the sender?
491 2013-05-04 15:15:16 <Raccoon> eqoloco: no.
492 2013-05-04 15:15:38 <Raccoon> eqoloco: not unless someone can narrow down the fact that your client was the first client to broadcast the transaction to the rest of the network
493 2013-05-04 15:16:07 <Raccoon> eqoloco: eg, by isolating your client from the rest of the network with their own inbetween
494 2013-05-04 15:16:43 <eqoloco> Raccoon: ok. but this should not be possible, right?
495 2013-05-04 15:17:38 <kauzu> eqoloco: i'm not sure... but if you send a transaction to that adress  that will not be included into a block the targed adress will brodcast this transaction... but others will not... so if you are connected you could probably trace him
496 2013-05-04 15:17:53 <Raccoon> that's why bitcoin-qt attempts to diversify the IP blocks it links to
497 2013-05-04 15:18:15 <Raccoon> only allowing limited number of connections from any given ISP or country
498 2013-05-04 15:18:25 <Raccoon> it spreads out
499 2013-05-04 15:18:51 <eqoloco> How many "Confirmations" should there be, before the money is safe?
500 2013-05-04 15:18:53 <Raccoon> naturally, an evil network administrator or ISP can trick you.
501 2013-05-04 15:19:03 <Raccoon> 6 is the standard.
502 2013-05-04 15:19:24 <eqoloco> Raccoon: ok. if you are using VPN all the time you are using Bitcoin-qt, should it be possible then?
503 2013-05-04 15:19:28 <Raccoon> with each confirm, it is exponentially difficult to envoke a collision fork
504 2013-05-04 15:19:47 <sipa> eqoloco: i think these questions belong in #bitcoin
505 2013-05-04 15:20:06 <kauzu> eqoloco: in most cases 1 confirmation is enougth
506 2013-05-04 15:20:08 <Raccoon> eqoloco: if your VPN is evil
507 2013-05-04 15:20:59 <eqoloco> should I carry?
508 2013-05-04 15:21:08 <Raccoon> you should not care.
509 2013-05-04 15:21:30 <eqoloco> what should I do to remain anonymous?
510 2013-05-04 15:21:45 <sydna> bitcoin-qt is designed to work well with Tor
511 2013-05-04 15:21:52 <Raccoon> use an address only once to receive money, especially from different sources.
512 2013-05-04 15:21:59 <eqoloco> sydna: cant find that option in the program
513 2013-05-04 15:22:26 <sipa> eqoloco: start with -proxy=127.0.0.1:9050 if that's where tor is running
514 2013-05-04 15:22:32 <sipa> (which is typical)
515 2013-05-04 15:22:35 <sydna> eqoloco: under network settings there is an area for a SOCKS proxy, you can use that to connect to the for network
516 2013-05-04 15:22:51 <sydna> or, as sipa says
517 2013-05-04 15:23:15 <eqoloco> ok
518 2013-05-04 15:23:45 <eqoloco> Raccoon "especially from different sources." what do you mean by that? should I use diffrent VPN?
519 2013-05-04 15:24:09 <eqoloco> VPN change every week, for example?
520 2013-05-04 15:24:12 <Raccoon> eqoloco: if Bob sends you coins, and Alice sends you coins, give Bob and Alice different bitcoin addresses.
521 2013-05-04 15:24:18 <eqoloco> okay
522 2013-05-04 15:24:44 <Raccoon> If Mark wants you to send him coins, ask him for a different address to send to each time.
523 2013-05-04 15:27:07 <eqoloco> Raccoon: ok
524 2013-05-04 15:27:45 <hpprinter100> sipa the bitcoin data directory
525 2013-05-04 15:27:48 <hpprinter100> which one is that?
526 2013-05-04 15:28:02 <Raccoon> If you really need to segregate coins between two people, you can sell all the coins you receive to someone random.  Then buy more coins from someone random, before sending them to person you want to keep separate
527 2013-05-04 15:29:02 <eqoloco> can anybody tell me, how much 0.23 bitcoin is worth right now?
528 2013-05-04 15:29:13 <Raccoon> ask in #bitcoin or #bitcoin-pricewatch
529 2013-05-04 15:29:46 <sipa> hpprinter100: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Data_directory
530 2013-05-04 15:29:47 <sydna> you can also use services like betting websites and web wallets to gain anonymity
531 2013-05-04 15:30:17 <sydna> if they have a central wallet, a deposit and withdraw will usually confuse the trail through the blockchain
532 2013-05-04 15:30:32 <eqoloco> Raccoon: #bitcoin-pricewatch was almost empty
533 2013-05-04 15:30:43 <eqoloco> sydna: ok
534 2013-05-04 15:30:53 <eqoloco> but is it not better to use bitcoin-qt?
535 2013-05-04 15:32:07 <hpprinter100> thanks sipa working great now
536 2013-05-04 15:32:13 <sydna> what you use, and the way you use it is entirely dependant on the level anonymity you require
537 2013-05-04 15:32:28 <sydna> **level of anonymity
538 2013-05-04 15:34:47 <eqoloco> sydna: so its not safe with bitcoin-qt, are iam not anonymous with it? if I also use VPN
539 2013-05-04 15:34:54 <eqoloco> everytime I run the program
540 2013-05-04 15:35:12 <sydna> a VPN does not provide anonymity
541 2013-05-04 15:35:30 <sipa> it may
542 2013-05-04 15:36:07 <sydna> in most cases people are mistaken in that they are anonymous using one though.
543 2013-05-04 15:36:17 <sipa> agree
544 2013-05-04 15:36:46 <eqoloco> sydna: So I am not anonymous if I use bitcoin-qt?
545 2013-05-04 15:36:53 <sydna> I didn't say that
546 2013-05-04 15:37:05 <eqoloco> Sorry to seem paranoid, just wanna be safe. Hope you understand
547 2013-05-04 15:37:58 <sydna> you are anonymous if you use bitcoin-qt with Tor, but only to a degree
548 2013-05-04 15:38:00 <eqoloco> Really appreciate all the answers and abetting (helo I get)
549 2013-05-04 15:38:13 <helo> ;)
550 2013-05-04 15:39:01 <eqoloco> sydna: How do I use TOR with bitcoin-qt? Can only see socks settings, it's not really TOR?
551 2013-05-04 15:39:16 <sipa> eqoloco: tor functions as a SOCKS proxy
552 2013-05-04 15:39:18 <helo> eqoloco: the person that sent you the bitcoin may know who you are. if someone approached them saying "who owns this address?", could they provide any information?
553 2013-05-04 15:39:31 <sydna> eqoloco: the onion router client presents itself as a local SOCKS proxy on port 9050.
554 2013-05-04 15:39:36 <buZz> helo: depends
555 2013-05-04 15:40:07 <sydna> eqoloco: if you have the Tor GUI (vidalia) running, you will have that local SOCKS proxy available for bitcoin-qt to connect to.
556 2013-05-04 15:40:19 <eqoloco> helo: how do you mean? how could they know who i am?
557 2013-05-04 15:41:21 <eqoloco> sipa: ok. sydna: so I am running TOR (vidalia), what SOCKS proxy should I use? How do I know this? Caouse it changing all the time.
558 2013-05-04 15:41:58 <sydna> eqoloco: nothing changes. the proxy address you use in bitcoin-qt will always be 127.0.0.1:9050
559 2013-05-04 15:42:17 <helo> eqoloco: they don't necessarily know who you are. but most channels that people buy bitcoin through provide some additional data that may lead to you
560 2013-05-04 15:42:18 <sipa> i think some tor distributions run at a random port
561 2013-05-04 15:42:25 <eqoloco> sydna: ok.
562 2013-05-04 15:42:41 <rdponticelli> eqoloco: If privacy is that important to you, you might be better with some consultant fully aware of all the technicallities
563 2013-05-04 15:42:43 <sydna> sipa: the Browser Bundle which includes vidalia and firefox does this
564 2013-05-04 15:43:18 <sydna> sipa: the raw Vidalia build, and the command line `tor` present at localhost:9050
565 2013-05-04 15:43:28 <sipa> ok
566 2013-05-04 15:45:04 <eqoloco> sydna: So the only thing I need to do, install TOR, put on vidalia and put bitcoin-qt socks on 127.0.0.1:9050. right?
567 2013-05-04 15:45:26 <eqoloco> helo: what do you mean?
568 2013-05-04 15:45:47 <sydna> SOCKS on, and disable uPNP (the setting above SOCKS)
569 2013-05-04 15:46:39 <sydna> sipa: is it a known issue that UPNP still assigns an incoming power, even when a SOCKS proxy is in use?
570 2013-05-04 15:46:46 <sydna> *incoming port
571 2013-05-04 15:46:50 <eqoloco> sydna: what is uPNP?
572 2013-05-04 15:47:07 <helo> sydna: the Tor.txt doesn't mention that UPNP should be disabled to not receive incoming ipv4 connections
573 2013-05-04 15:47:16 <helo> so i know of it ;)
574 2013-05-04 15:47:22 <eqoloco> rdponticelli: ok
575 2013-05-04 15:47:39 <sydna> eqoloco: UPNP is a system that automatically assigns incoming ports at the router level
576 2013-05-04 15:48:02 <eqoloco> sydna: ok
577 2013-05-04 15:48:18 <sydna> helo: it would be a bug though, right? it shouldn't attempt to touch my router if the SOCKS proxy is in use
578 2013-05-04 15:48:22 <sipa> sydna: strange, if proxy is defined, listen should be disabled by default, and if listen is disabled, upnp should be too
579 2013-05-04 15:48:36 <helo> sipa: i've observed that behavior too :/
580 2013-05-04 15:48:42 <sydna> sipa: let me just verify it on 0.8.1
581 2013-05-04 15:48:52 <helo> yeah, i'm on git head, so it may not be in a release
582 2013-05-04 15:49:11 <sipa> this hasn't changed since 0.6 i think
583 2013-05-04 15:50:22 <sydna> yeah, I just confirmed the behaviour then
584 2013-05-04 15:50:44 <sydna> with a SOCKS proxy enabled, and UPNP enabled, I'm seeing 8333 being requested at the router
585 2013-05-04 15:51:11 <sipa> if you enable upnp, it is enabled
586 2013-05-04 15:51:23 <sipa> it's just disabled by default when not listening
587 2013-05-04 15:51:45 <sipa> perhaps that should be changed to never running upnp when listening is disabled
588 2013-05-04 15:51:52 <sydna> shouldn't there be a sanity check there though?
589 2013-05-04 15:52:53 <sydna> having UPNP and a SOCKS proxy is monumentally useless either way
590 2013-05-04 15:53:27 <sipa> not at all
591 2013-05-04 15:53:42 <sipa> the socks proxy only changes outgoing connection behaviour
592 2013-05-04 15:53:52 <sipa> upnp has to do with incoming connection behaviour
593 2013-05-04 15:54:02 <sipa> but i agree that UPnP + not listening is useless
594 2013-05-04 15:54:09 <sydna> but with a -proxy enabled, -listen is disabled
595 2013-05-04 15:54:17 <sipa> no, disabled by default
596 2013-05-04 15:54:27 <sipa> you can still explicitly listen, or bind
597 2013-05-04 15:54:59 <sydna> I was speaking specifically in regards to the GUI though, where you've no control over that
598 2013-05-04 15:55:16 <sipa> oh, no idea about the GUI option interaction
599 2013-05-04 15:55:22 <sipa> it's complicated in any case
600 2013-05-04 15:55:35 <sipa> as you can start bitcoin-qt with -bind=IP:PORT as well
601 2013-05-04 15:56:16 <sydna> pfft. I forgot that on OSX you can't disable the proxy once you've enabled it in the GUI.
602 2013-05-04 16:23:17 <gaantr2> Hello, I am using Bitcoin-j 0.9. I've noticed that after a few days that the system stops "processing" transactions. The transactions still register as being received, but the code that executes after that appears to get gummed up. For example, I run the Ping service for 3-4 days and then it needs to be rebooted or it doesnt work anymore.
603 2013-05-04 16:42:05 <Ferroh> Is Andreas Schildbach in this channel?
604 2013-05-04 16:42:57 <TD> Ferroh: he uses the nick Goonie_
605 2013-05-04 16:43:08 <Ferroh> Thanks TD
606 2013-05-04 16:43:10 <Goonie_> Hier, bei der Arbeit (-:
607 2013-05-04 16:43:53 <Ferroh> I have someone asking me why his imported private key in the Android Bitcoin Wallet is not showing funds.
608 2013-05-04 16:44:02 <Ferroh> He says that he sees the funds in multibit
609 2013-05-04 16:44:09 <Ferroh> and the public address shows the funds on blockchain.info
610 2013-05-04 16:44:09 <TD> imported private keys == pain
611 2013-05-04 16:44:15 <TD> best avoided if at all possible
612 2013-05-04 16:44:20 <Ferroh> Have you had issues with this before Goonie_ ?
613 2013-05-04 16:44:20 <TD> (at least for now)
614 2013-05-04 16:44:37 <Ferroh> I see.
615 2013-05-04 16:44:53 <Goonie_> well, funds not showing up can have many causes.
616 2013-05-04 16:45:06 <Ferroh> He says he has done a blockchain rescan.
617 2013-05-04 16:45:35 <Goonie_> is his key compressed or not?
618 2013-05-04 16:46:06 <Ferroh> I don't know, I will ask.