1 2014-01-05 00:04:23 <amincd> hi, how do I use the bitcoin commands with bitcoin-qt?
2 2014-01-05 00:05:59 <nsh> iirc it's removed to stop people foot-shooting
3 2014-01-05 00:06:27 <sipa> in the debug console
4 2014-01-05 00:06:30 <sipa> in the gui
5 2014-01-05 00:06:36 <sipa> or you can start with -server
6 2014-01-05 00:06:43 <sipa> and then send it commands via JSON-RPC
7 2014-01-05 00:06:45 <sipa> nothing removed
8 2014-01-05 00:06:49 <nsh> sorry, my bad
9 2014-01-05 00:06:59 <amincd> sipa: thanks
10 2014-01-05 00:20:17 <flound1129> is there a way to get a list of mining transactions only? from the command line
11 2014-01-05 00:20:25 <flound1129> i.e. generate, immature, or orphan
12 2014-01-05 00:20:29 <flound1129> and skip the sends/receives?
13 2014-01-05 00:24:32 <justanotheruser> flound1129: you only want the coinbase transactions?
14 2014-01-05 00:24:54 <justanotheruser> your blockchain doesn't include orphans
15 2014-01-05 00:31:11 <flound1129> justanotheruser1: yes
16 2014-01-05 00:43:36 <shesek> anyone knows who was running mojocoin's testnet facuet?
17 2014-01-05 00:44:23 <shesek> looks like their domain has expired, perhaps they'll want to let someone else maintain it?
18 2014-01-05 01:11:00 <flound1129> justanotheruser: so is there a way to do that?
19 2014-01-05 04:29:25 <lolcat> Hello
20 2014-01-05 04:31:11 <lolcat> I have two questions regarding the blockchain: 1) Would it be hard to modify it into being a database with like two tables with 3-4 fields each where one table in encrypted and the other is not? And why is the downloading of the blockchain so incredibly slow? Is it an issue with discovering the right peers, or the p2p protocol itself?
21 2014-01-05 04:32:44 <jaakkos> in bitcoin nothing is encrypted
22 2014-01-05 04:33:06 <jaakkos> greetings from ZoL channel btw ;)
23 2014-01-05 04:33:14 <lolcat> greetings
24 2014-01-05 04:33:36 <justanotheruser> lolcat: it is slow because you are downloading *and* verifying each block and transaction
25 2014-01-05 04:33:52 <Luke-Jr> (not in parallel)
26 2014-01-05 04:34:08 <justanotheruser> What are the 3-4 fields, why are you encrypting a table?
27 2014-01-05 04:35:25 <lolcat> justanotheruser: First table would contain: torrenhash/id|encrypted filename. Second table would contain: encrypted filenameandlocation|torrenthash/id|encryptionkey
28 2014-01-05 04:35:51 <lolcat> the first table needs like at least one more field to represent the shareID to enable nested shares, but that isn't too important
29 2014-01-05 04:35:59 <justanotheruser> lolcat: oh, you're saying you want to store data in the blockchain?
30 2014-01-05 04:36:40 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: this doesn't sound like a #bitcoin-dev topic O.o
31 2014-01-05 04:36:46 <lolcat> justanotheruser: Yes, I want a blockchain that can be signed by (either one trusted node, or by a collective of trusted nodes).
32 2014-01-05 04:37:14 <lolcat> Luke-Jr: I just wanted to ask a couple of questions about the blockchain, if that is offtopic I appologize. Is there a more appropriate venue?
33 2014-01-05 04:37:40 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: a centralised network has no need/use of a blockchain
34 2014-01-05 04:38:31 <justanotheruser> lolcat: You should store the data in namecoin at least. It is going to be expensive to store a lot of data in bitcoins blockchain
35 2014-01-05 04:38:45 <justanotheruser> along with that, that isn't what the bitcoin was designed for
36 2014-01-05 04:39:51 <lolcat> Luke-Jr: Part of it would be usefull, being able to verify that it is the correct data, in the correct order would be usefull. For a decentralized filesystem I am a bit uncertain what I would use the blockchain for (maybe for distributing storage space)
37 2014-01-05 04:40:32 <lolcat> Luke-Jr: Basicly I want to make P2P storage without coding more than a few lines myself, so I am just looking for any project I could take code from
38 2014-01-05 04:40:47 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: I don't think Bitcoin is that project.
39 2014-01-05 04:41:09 <lolcat> justanotheruser: the coin part isnt that important, the important part for me is the way blockchains works, that you can add verifiable blocks and distribute them p2p
40 2014-01-05 04:41:15 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: Bitcoin is probably the most inefficient way possible to store data
41 2014-01-05 04:41:38 <lolcat> Luke-Jr: But could I make my own blockchain using RSA signing of something?
42 2014-01-05 04:41:50 <Luke-Jr> you could, but it'd be silly
43 2014-01-05 04:42:10 <Luke-Jr> blockchain essentially means every single p2p node has a complete copy of everything
44 2014-01-05 04:42:25 <Luke-Jr> the usecases for that are not very wide
45 2014-01-05 04:43:20 <lolcat> Luke-Jr: I would have to be able to transfer the data to a new block chain, for instance, when I am sharing my vacation photoes with my grandmother, I don't want her to have the torrent IDs or decryption keys for my drunk pictures.
46 2014-01-05 04:43:57 <lianj> lolcat: wrong project
47 2014-01-05 04:44:43 <justanotheruser> lolcat: It will cost the standard transaction fee for every 80 bytes you want to encode if you use OP_RETURN in 0.9. This means you will pay this much per Kb:
48 2014-01-05 04:44:47 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: I have no idea why you thought Bitcoin would be a good foundation for this idea, but it isn't.
49 2014-01-05 04:44:52 <lolcat> I'll ask my last question and then I will stop bothering you. How does the bitcoin blockchain differ from me for say, signing something with RSA for each block?
50 2014-01-05 04:44:54 <justanotheruser> ;;calc 800*0.00001*1000/80
51 2014-01-05 04:44:56 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: ⦠no
52 2014-01-05 04:44:59 <gribble> 0.1
53 2014-01-05 04:45:35 <justanotheruser> oops, standard tx fee is 10 times that
54 2014-01-05 04:45:41 <justanotheruser> Luke-Jr: no what
55 2014-01-05 04:45:53 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: OP_RETURN isn't intended to be used.
56 2014-01-05 04:46:08 <lolcat> justanotheruser: Storing it in the actual bitcoin blockchain seems crazy. It is HUGE.
57 2014-01-05 04:46:20 <justanotheruser> Luke-Jr: "So, with some reluctance, I recently merged pull request #2738 : âRelay OP_RETURN data TxOut as standard transaction type.â"
58 2014-01-05 04:46:40 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: OP_RETURN is essentially "Argh, I can't stop you from raping me! Please be gentle!"
59 2014-01-05 04:46:46 <lolcat> justanotheruser: Copying the sourcecode for the P2P distribution of the block chain, and maybe the verification of the block chain, that would be usefull
60 2014-01-05 04:47:31 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: and Gavin has little authority to make data carriers a standard transaction type - it's really the miners' role
61 2014-01-05 04:47:35 <justanotheruser> Luke-Jr: so it isn't intended to be used, but it can be used. I am telling him it is pointless because it costs $1/kb, when you could get 10,000,000 times that much storage for free
62 2014-01-05 04:48:54 <justanotheruser> Luke-Jr: Isn't it more the networks role? If the network can get it to the miners, one of them might choose to include it, and if one of them choose to include it they all might as well include it because they are losing transaction fees.
63 2014-01-05 04:49:06 <lolcat> justanotheruser: I think you fail a bit to see the application. And I guess I fail a bit at understanding what a blockchain is. I thought it was something like signed(signed(somedata)somemoredata)
64 2014-01-05 04:49:14 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: hopefully no miners will include it.
65 2014-01-05 04:49:57 <justanotheruser> Luke-Jr: Well they can already store the data in a scriptsig right? At least this way there is one less item in the utxo
66 2014-01-05 04:50:35 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: scriptSig is never in the UTXO ever.
67 2014-01-05 04:51:01 <Lifeofcray> https://twitter.com/BitEmber
68 2014-01-05 04:51:27 <Luke-Jr> Lifeofcray: why are you spamming this scam?
69 2014-01-05 04:51:39 <lolcat> Is tehre any limit on what the miner can add to a block?
70 2014-01-05 04:51:47 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: 1 MB
71 2014-01-05 04:51:59 <lolcat> ah
72 2014-01-05 04:52:37 <Luke-Jr> also a limited number of ECDSA opcodes
73 2014-01-05 04:52:38 <lolcat> Is the block just recursive signing of like $lastsignedblock with the new data appended signed?
74 2014-01-05 04:52:50 <justanotheruser> Luke-Jr: Was this message not stored using a scriptsig? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=38007.msg484499#msg484499
75 2014-01-05 04:52:55 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: blocks are essentially executable bytecode with a proof-of-work attached
76 2014-01-05 04:53:12 <justanotheruser> Or is it just not in the utxo, but it can't be pruned
77 2014-01-05 04:53:16 <lolcat> Luke-Jr: executable?
78 2014-01-05 04:53:32 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: not sure which
79 2014-01-05 04:53:43 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: interpretable, if you prefer
80 2014-01-05 04:53:47 <lolcat> Ah
81 2014-01-05 04:53:59 <lolcat> Does the blockchain grow in both directions?
82 2014-01-05 04:54:04 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: no.
83 2014-01-05 04:54:23 <justanotheruser> Luke-Jr: Does the coinbase still allow arbitrary messages, or is it just the height now
84 2014-01-05 04:54:34 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: up to 95 bytes
85 2014-01-05 04:55:35 <lolcat> That makes sense, it appears the stuff RSA adds at the beginning of the message is just for humans
86 2014-01-05 04:56:02 <lianj> there is no rsaâ¦
87 2014-01-05 04:56:21 <lolcat> lianj: I am just comparing the protocoll to what I know
88 2014-01-05 04:56:28 <lolcat> RSA signing I have experienced
89 2014-01-05 04:57:50 <lolcat> I am sure bitcoin blockchain signing isn't pragmatically much different, as in the concept is the same
90 2014-01-05 04:58:08 <Luke-Jr> lolcat: bitcoin blockchain is not signed at all..
91 2014-01-05 04:58:10 <lianj> blocks are not signed at all
92 2014-01-05 04:58:48 <lolcat> Oh, I guess I am dumb, and you guys were right all along then...
93 2014-01-05 05:00:01 <lolcat> Then the only usefull part of code for me would be the P2P part that distribute the blockchain
94 2014-01-05 05:00:23 <nessence> are there any good codesamples (or codebase, say libbitcoin?) that would be good for creating multi-sig transactions and managing several wallets?
95 2014-01-05 05:00:48 <nessence> many options, and not sure which is right tool for the job yet.
96 2014-01-05 05:01:37 <lolcat> Is the P2P protocoll complicated?
97 2014-01-05 05:01:55 <lianj> no
98 2014-01-05 05:02:07 <lolcat> Does it use encryption?
99 2014-01-05 05:02:18 <lianj> no
100 2014-01-05 05:03:04 <lolcat> I guess that would be fine
101 2014-01-05 05:19:00 <Luke-Jr> http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1ufacn/bitcoin_wallets_are_inaccessible_for_blind_people/
102 2014-01-05 05:52:39 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: genjix's command-line sx wallet would work...
103 2014-01-05 06:02:39 <shesek> I never thought I'd hear command line tools mentioned as a solution for accessibility problems :)
104 2014-01-05 09:35:08 <Luton> Hi, I have a question regarding the ScriptSig (tx in): Is it possible to convert the ASM value to HEX (and vice versa)?
105 2014-01-05 09:36:40 <Luton> Here is an example: https://coinb.in/api/?uid=1&key=12345678901234567890123456789012&setmodule=block&request=gettransactionbeautify&txid=824c16b311e55be77f2466386054a459fe6c5908f702b844fd253c04e27dfd8c&output=xml
106 2014-01-05 09:37:38 <maaku> Luton: yes, of course
107 2014-01-05 09:37:55 <maaku> is there an (dis)assembler tool? no
108 2014-01-05 09:38:01 <maaku> but read script.cpp
109 2014-01-05 09:38:35 <gmaxwell> maaku: decodescript
110 2014-01-05 09:38:49 <gmaxwell> no assembler though
111 2014-01-05 10:44:31 <michagogo> cloud|Luton, maaku: Seems to me script.h would be more useful than script.cpp
112 2014-01-05 10:44:51 <michagogo> cloud|(or the wiki article on Script)